Swift X feat {3.5e}

[AirGuitarGod32]

Out of Complete Scoundrel, the feat Swift Ambusher seems great for a Rogue/Scout. HOWEVER...

I want to play a Human Scout/Wilderness Feat Rogue

This said, would Swift Ambusher's Sneak Attack progression be swapped for feat progression or not?

and would this be a viable combination, seeing that I could also play this with a Shifter, Wood/Wild Elf, or a Raptoran?

[Grumman]

This said, would Swift Ambusher's Sneak Attack progression be swapped for feat progression or not?

Swift Ambusher doesn't improve your sneak attack progression in the first place, just your skirmish.

[AirGuitarGod32]

Swift Ambusher doesn't improve your sneak attack progression in the first place, just your skirmish.

My bad. just reread it

God, I feel like an idiot!

[Grumman]

Even if it did, your DM would have to be an idiot to let you trade one feat for lots of feats.

[AtwasAwamps]

Wait, I'm trying to figure out what you were trying to do here.

If you were going to dip far enough into Swift Ambusher to pick up the Skirmish Damage boost, you could theoretically jump into rogue and just continuously level as a rogue to gain sneak attack growth while picking up skirmish growth from Swift Ambusher.

Or did you want to stay as a scout and get sneak attack dice from swift ambusher only while gaining scout class features?

If your GM is okay with it, play as a feat rogue with Swift Ambusher. You'll get your feat progression and your skirmish progression. Hell, that doesn't seem half-bad at all, really...once you do that, you'll have a bunch of skill points and a perfect set up for something like dervish or tempest if you want to be more combat oriented.

[JaronK]

Even if it did, your DM would have to be an idiot to let you trade one feat for lots of feats.

Vow of Poverty already does this.

JaronK

[AtwasAwamps]

Vow of Poverty already does this.

JaronK

VoP is technically two feats, as it requires Sacred Vow. VoP is also a DEADLY TRAP.

[Grumman]

Vow of Poverty already does this.

Vow of Poverty lets you trade two feats and lots of gold for lots of feats and other benefits. It at least requires that you ask yourself whether lots of gold is worth more or less than lots of feats and other benefits. In the situation we're talking about here, you simply have to ask yourself whether one feat is worth more or less than lots of feats, plus other benefits, to which the answer is obviously "less".

[AirGuitarGod32]

So 2 thumbs up for a Human Wilderness Feat Rogue/Scout/[Insert PrC Here]?

[JaronK]

Vow of Poverty lets you trade two feats and lots of gold for lots of feats and other benefits. It at least requires that you ask yourself whether lots of gold is worth more or less than lots of feats and other benefits. In the situation we're talking about here, you simply have to ask yourself whether one feat is worth more or less than lots of feats, plus other benefits, to which the answer is obviously "less".

Except that the question is whether one feat and never being allowed to multiclass out of Scout while still getting the bonus feats is worth a bunch of Fighter only Bonus Feats. Once we put together all the costs, it's not so bad really. Like Vow of Poverty, there are hidden costs associated with it. I honestly don't think it's too bad for a Rogue 4/Scout 16 to get an extra bunch of bonus feats, as you're still a precision damage based skirmisher type.

JaronK

[Grumman]

Except that the question is whether one feat and never being allowed to multiclass out of Scout while still getting the bonus feats is worth a bunch of Fighter only Bonus Feats. Once we put together all the costs, it's not so bad really. Like Vow of Poverty, there are hidden costs associated with it. I honestly don't think it's too bad for a Rogue 4/Scout 16 to get an extra bunch of bonus feats, as you're still a precision damage based skirmisher type.

JaronK

There is no cost. By the time you have enough Scout levels to qualify for this modified Swift Ambusher feat, you have already broken even. Everything else is just gravy. Even a Rogue 4 / Scout 3 / X 13 gets to spend one feat to get two feats, with no drawbacks.

[Foryn Gilnith]

There's a noteworthy opportunity cost. As JaronK observed, it forces your build into scout for the rest of your levels.

[jiriku]

So 2 thumbs up for a Human Wilderness Feat Rogue/Scout/[Insert PrC Here]?

I think that would be totally ok and healthy for the game, and should even be encouraged as a great way to build a wilderness-oriented character who mixes stealth and martial ability.

[Grumman]

There's a noteworthy opportunity cost. As JaronK observed, it forces your build into scout for the rest of your levels.

No, it doesn't. Even if you never take another level of scout ever again, it has already paid for itself.

[Xenogears]

No, it doesn't. Even if you never take another level of scout ever again, it has already paid for itself.

Trading one free Feat for two Fighter Bonus Feats is not always an amazing trade though. I mean if You really really need those feats sure but even so its only a better than average choice not an OMGWTF choice.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Trading one free Feat for two Fighter Bonus Feats is not always an amazing trade though. I mean if You really really need those feats sure but even so its only a better than average choice not an OMGWTF choice.

There is always something a Scout can do with 2 Fighter feats. Whether going destroyer(TWF et al, TWD, TWP) or archer(too many to list) or even skirmisher(Dodge, Mobility, etc), you need feats, and most of them are on the Fighter bonus list.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Combine Daring Outlaw, with Daring warrior using: Feat rogue, Fighter, Swashbuckler, and Ninja or A PrC that grants SA and you get an almost gestalt character that's in effect a Fighter//Swashbuckler with a dash of SA. Just a thought. You can drop the Fighter levels and Daring Warrior if you're not worried about the WF feat tree, and you still get a swashbuckler with a mess of bonus feats.

[kme]

By his interpretation, you wouldn't be gaining feats for nothing , you would be gaining them instead of SA dice.