Vow of Poverty - Pathfinder

[Tetsubo 57]

If you were going to introduce the Vow of Poverty feat chain into PF, how would you do it? Can it be balanced against a standard characters wealth levels and assumed acquired gear? I love the *idea* of the VoP but it did lack some punch at higher levels in a standard 3.5 setting. Any thoughts?

[deuxhero]

Vow of Poverty
You don't need to eat ect. Normal restrictions blah blah blah You gain an amount of special powers based cost of magic items with them equal the amount of money you get rid of in whatever way the DM feels appropriate. These bonuses may be changed completely any time you sacrifice more than 3000 gold in treasure.


In otherwords, Pupu burns/donates/burys/leaves behind/blows on mechanically useless luxuries the equivalent of 10000 gold of items (sell value), Pupu can now instantly (or prehaps after a rest) gain the effects of a number of items equal to 10000 gold. Pupu doesn't need to worry about slot (though armor/weapon bonuses are still exponential costs)

Clean up the wording and you made the feat half decent.

[Starbuck_II]

If you were going to introduce the Vow of Poverty feat chain into PF, how would you do it? Can it be balanced against a standard characters wealth levels and assumed acquired gear? I love the *idea* of the VoP but it did lack some punch at higher levels in a standard 3.5 setting. Any thoughts?

PF doesn't lower the amount of money Party recives does it?
If no: Then why no need to change the feat.

Now, do you want to improve VoP? Let them carry + use potions would help.

[Soranar]

first Vow of Poverty should be a free character option instead of a feat based requirement (sacred vow + vow of poverty seems like a lot for a gimping feat)

Vow of Poverty should probably start by giving you the ability of not needing to eat/drink (instead of waiting till level 5)

and that ability should transfer to your familiars/mount/animal companions

even with party members to give you food ,it's really annoying to have to worry about your meal every day until you reach level 5

should also make you able to use any weapon and make it magical (instead of requiring weapon focus in said weapon)

your weapon choices are so few to start with it shouldn't be too powerful

might want to make an epic progression (stops at level 20) that makes sense in power

I would also let the character use basic non magical armor (light) and weapon of certain materials to bypass damage reduction (adamantine, cold iron, silver) or just add those properties to your magical enhancements instead, having all of your damage reduced is really a pain when you can't even wield an item made of the stuff (and facing evil outsiders should be your thing, you're practically a saint to start with)

the way it is now, druids and casters get a lot out of it but few other people because you can't wear any armor or use any type of weapon outside of simple equipment (staff or spear, sling or crossbow and thats about it)

maybe give them access to ranged weapons (bows, throwing weapons) and give them unlimited ammunition with them or returning qualities to at least get a few options (besides if you're a melee character you basically have no ranged capacity otherwise)

simply being able to use an ancestral weapon would also make a huge difference

gaining flight would also make them a lot more viable for non-spellcasting classes (say at level 16 ?) otherwise they'll have to rely on friendly casters for getting around and helping out at all

maybe add that they automatically qualify for any exalted feat despite STAT requirements (like the Charisma based ones)

with all of that they might be ok , if not great

[Gnaeus]

Vow of Poverty
You don't need to eat ect. Normal restrictions blah blah blah You gain an amount of special powers based cost of magic items with them equal the amount of money you get rid of in whatever way the DM feels appropriate. These bonuses may be changed completely any time you sacrifice more than 3000 gold in treasure.


In otherwords, Pupu burns/donates/burys/leaves behind/blows on mechanically useless luxuries the equivalent of 10000 gold of items (sell value), Pupu can now instantly (or prehaps after a rest) gain the effects of a number of items equal to 10000 gold. Pupu doesn't need to worry about slot (though armor/weapon bonuses are still exponential costs)

Clean up the wording and you made the feat half decent.

There should still be a discount. Somewhere between full value and half. Otherwise, the party gives Bob the Pious all the useless junk that they would otherwise sell, he buries it in a hole and gets full value from it as if in the worlds best magic mart.

[deuxhero]

Hence why I said sell value.

The advantages are you 1. can't be disarmed (and such) 2. you don't have to search for the item you want.

[taltamir]

Vow of Poverty
You don't need to eat ect. Normal restrictions blah blah blah You gain an amount of special powers based cost of magic items with them equal the amount of money you get rid of in whatever way the DM feels appropriate. These bonuses may be changed completely any time you sacrifice more than 3000 gold in treasure.


In otherwords, Pupu burns/donates/burys/leaves behind/blows on mechanically useless luxuries the equivalent of 10000 gold of items (sell value), Pupu can now instantly (or prehaps after a rest) gain the effects of a number of items equal to 10000 gold. Pupu doesn't need to worry about slot (though armor/weapon bonuses are still exponential costs)

Clean up the wording and you made the feat half decent.

in other words, you sacrifice absolutely nothing to gain the ability to emulate the ability to craft/buy anything you want at market price, stack abilities while ignoring slots, and cannot be disarmed / stolen from / etc...
aka, be vastly superior to a non VoP character.
this seems somewhat odd to me.

[deuxhero]

Prehaps that is why you spend 1/6th of your life learning to do it?

[taltamir]

Prehaps that is why you spend 1/6th of your life learning to do it?

you don't spend anything, you write it on your character sheet for a slew of benefits for no cost whatsoever... This is just way too good. unless I am missing something.
Sure, I think it needs to be improved, but this is going too far.

[Starbuck_II]

you don't spend anything, you write it on your character sheet for a slew of benefits for no cost whatsoever... This is just way too good. unless I am missing something.
Sure, I think it needs to be improved, but this is going too far.

You spend 2 feats.

Edit: old VOP anyway cost 2 feats.

[deuxhero]

You spend a feat (or 2, if you keep the need for sacred vow) for the ability to not be disarmed (slot affinities are very easy to get around) and easy access to items (something that is often ignored and one feat allows you to bypass for your weapon PLUS it only costs half as much). Quite a few more powerful feats out there.

[taltamir]

You spend 2 feats.

Edit: old VOP anyway cost 2 feats.

yes but as far as I saw it was mentioned here that the first change is that it is now free, no need for 2 feats.

You spend a feat (or 2, if you keep sacred vow) for the ability to not be disarmed (slot affinities are very easy to get around) and easy access to items (something that is often ignored). Quite a few more powerful feats out there.

I see i mixed up things... ok for 2 feats I guess it is acceptable in power.
kinda seems odd that your powers are directly linked to how much money you sacrifice though... this also completely undermine DM control over shopping, and especially inappropriate for settings without a magic mart.

[deuxhero]

That was someone elses suggestion it be free...

As for the oddity, I point to the ancestral relic feat, which is the same thing, only for weapons only and gives full (not sell) value of the items.

[Soranar]

I suggested that it could be a free character option, I never said anything about gaining magic properties for gold and xp, that completely undermines/negates the whole idea of VoP

you get a few , marginally powerful abilities (scaled by level) by giving up any material possession of value (which is a huge cost for most builds)

thats the spirit of the feat/build