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    Default Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    So I just stumbled across the Crystal Master PrC from Mind's Eye, and it intrigued me. I was thinking that, for a combination of flavor and power reasons, I would try entering as a Psiforged - not only would it make embedding the crystals less squicky and more thematic, it would give me a good reason to look like this:

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    My thoughts, etc.:
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    In addition, many of the warforged qualities override the need for certain crystals - for example, I wouldn't need to embed Jade (Warforged don't age) or Azurite (they don't need to breathe, eat or sleep.) So that would give me more flexibility in my choice of gems. An Erudite also feels like a better fit thematically - I could very well see my Psiforged puttering about camp, arguing with his psicrystal and talking to his power stones while "downloading" the powers contained within them to his own memory.

    I was thinking I would go Erudite, since they have all the required skills as class skills and they start with both a free psicrystal and bonus feat, enabling me to enter the class with ease. But since I have to wait until level 5 anyway, I figured I might as well trade one of my bonus feats for the Favored Discipline ACF.


    But I digress. My questions for the Playground's mentalists are as follows:

    1) Who gets the most mileage out of this class? Psions, Erudites, Psywars, or one of the other psionic classes? Though I'm all but decided on Psiforged wavering between Psiforged and Kalashtar, would another race work better?

    2) If I go with Psion (Or FD Erudite) which discipline would go best with this class?

    3) What personalities should my psicrystal have? Since I get Imp. Psicrystal upon joining the class, I can have at least two. So far I'm leaning towards Artiste and Single-Minded (Craft and Concentration respectively) but is there a better combination? Would the social skills be useful, or the save bonuses, instead?

    4) Addendum to the above - how could I roleplay the combinations (on behalf of my crystal)? I suppose a single-minded artiste psicrystal would be... I'm not sure... constantly nagging me to cut gems? Convinced that crystals are the only form of art or valuables worthy of adoration? Shushing the other party members while I work?

    5) Can a psiforged stay up all night cutting gems? Is there some kind of limitation on crafting them that I'm not aware of?

    6) Most importantly, keeping in mind the Psiforged immunities and other racial benefits - what gems do you recommend embedding?
    Last edited by Optimystik; 2010-01-16 at 04:45 PM.

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    2. Shaper, of course.

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gnorman View Post
    2. Shaper, of course.
    Hmm... any way to have my Craft (gemcutting) count as Craft (sculpting) or vice-versa?

    Also, any answers to the other questions?

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    personality: nimble. more initiative is always better.

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    This just sounds like you're building Shale from Dragon Age: Origins!
    If there's a rule, there's someone out there trying to figure out how to get around it just to piss off his DM.

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    - The Jack-signal. Thanks Jokes!

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by JackMage666 View Post
    This just sounds like you're building Shale from Dragon Age: Origins!
    It's possible. I haven't played DA:O yet, but I fully intend to.

    In the meantime... bump

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by Optimystik View Post
    Though I'm all but decided on Psiforged, would another race work better?
    Psiforged are awesome, but if you were a Kalashtar, you could also use the various Quori-Embedded Shards, for even more crystal goodness.

    If you want to do that but still stay Psiforged, there's the Renegade Mastermaker PrC which will turn a Kalashtar into a Psiforged, and the Quori Mindhunter PrC which may or may not (ask your DM) turn a Psiforged into a Kalashtar, or a DC 25 Use Psionic Device check, which means Shaper or Psionic Rogue.

    Actually, a lot of the Shard powers and Crystal Master powers are pretty nice for a sneaky character. Permanent nondetection + Aura Mask, a Deep Crystal Ectoplasmic Fist, Telepathy, Touchsight, and the ability to see around corners...

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    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    My preferred picks for a straightforward manifester.

    -Aquamarine is obviously the #1 pick, for a potential +3 untyped boost to Int once you finish the class.
    -Ruby's another good pick, for the extra Con.
    -Jet could be handy, Fly 5/day for 10 minutes at a time isn't bad.
    -Moonstone would replicate a constant augmented Defensive Precognition, basically saving you 19 PP/combat (+5 bonus with swift activation). Not great, but okay.
    -Diamond, for an extra 20 PP/day. A tiny piece of your total, but it's still more PP.
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Fel, on quest rewards View Post
    "Is a stack of ten pancakes too many pancakes to give to the party, even if most of them fell on the floor and one or two were stepped on? I wanted to give my party pancakes as a reward but I'm unsure if it's too much. The pancakes are also laced with blowfish poison so the party would have to get an antitoxin before they could eat the ones which weren't pulverized by shoes."

    I don't think anyone would want those pancakes even if you paid them to eat them.

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by Fishy View Post
    Psiforged are awesome, but if you were a Kalashtar, you could also use the various Quori-Embedded Shards, for even more crystal goodness.
    Interesting. What book are the shards in?

    Now that you mention it, Kalashtar has other benefits as well - If I went with a Kalashtar Telepath, I could add a third personality to my Psicrystal by using the compound psicrystal feature of their racial substitution levels. Being a Kalashtar would also free up a feat (as I wouldn't have to take Psiforged Body) and the extra PP would make up for not being a cognizance crystal.

    I'll definitely have to think more about this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fishy View Post
    If you want to do that but still stay Psiforged, there's the Renegade Mastermaker PrC which will turn a Kalashtar into a Psiforged, and the Quori Mindhunter PrC which may or may not (ask your DM) turn a Psiforged into a Kalashtar, or a DC 25 Use Psionic Device check, which means Shaper or Psionic Rogue.
    RMM seems more for artificers or arcanists than psions. It doesn't seem to advance ML at all. In addition, while becoming a Psiforged with the class is possible (and quite cool, might I add,) I lose 4 ML along the way between RMM and CM. I'd rather have 9th-level powers, I'm afraid.

    Quori Mindhunter is a bit more appealing, as it only loses 1 ML, so I could still qualify for 9s. It seems like an odd thematic choice for a Warforged though, even a psionic one. But its abilities would negate a few more gems for me (like emerald) and would synergize amazingly well with others (Like Bull's Eye Agate.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Fishy View Post
    Actually, a lot of the Shard powers and Crystal Master powers are pretty nice for a sneaky character. Permanent nondetection + Aura Mask, a Deep Crystal Ectoplasmic Fist, Telepathy, Touchsight, and the ability to see around corners...
    Good point. Can a Warforged Scout take Psiforged Body? Psiforged Psychic Rogue, here I come.

    Thanks for your help. Any answers to my other questions?

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    Bump.

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Glyphstone View Post
    My preferred picks for a straightforward manifester.

    -Aquamarine is obviously the #1 pick, for a potential +3 untyped boost to Int once you finish the class.
    -Ruby's another good pick, for the extra Con.
    -Jet could be handy, Fly 5/day for 10 minutes at a time isn't bad.
    -Moonstone would replicate a constant augmented Defensive Precognition, basically saving you 19 PP/combat (+5 bonus with swift activation). Not great, but okay.
    -Diamond, for an extra 20 PP/day. A tiny piece of your total, but it's still more PP.
    These are good suggestions (i like the pun too - Jet makes you fly - fnar fnar, WotC.)

    Wouldn't Red Jasper be more useful than Moonstone though? I think Warforged are still subject to ability drain. I'm going to be dropping my focus (and regaining it) a lot, and while its down I'll be vulnerable. And is being able to fly really worth a gem slot?

    And can't anyone help me with my original questions?

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Glyphstone View Post
    My preferred picks for a straightforward manifester.

    -Aquamarine is obviously the #1 pick, for a potential +3 untyped boost to Int once you finish the class.
    -Ruby's another good pick, for the extra Con.
    -Jet could be handy, Fly 5/day for 10 minutes at a time isn't bad.
    -Moonstone would replicate a constant augmented Defensive Precognition, basically saving you 19 PP/combat (+5 bonus with swift activation). Not great, but okay.
    -Diamond, for an extra 20 PP/day. A tiny piece of your total, but it's still more PP.
    Don't forget the capstone ability; it makes the last three that much better (only at level 10, but you're assuming 5 gems anyway). Moonstone and jet (which actually lets you fly 12 times/day when you finish the class) also effectively increase the number of unique powers an erudite can manifest daily, which makes them much better than diamond. By the same logic, I'd take opal over the latter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Optimystik View Post
    Bump.



    These are good suggestions (i like the pun too - Jet makes you fly - fnar fnar, WotC.)

    Wouldn't Red Jasper be more useful than Moonstone though? I think Warforged are still subject to ability drain. I'm going to be dropping my focus (and regaining it) a lot, and while its down I'll be vulnerable. And is being able to fly really worth a gem slot?

    And can't anyone help me with my original questions?
    Warforged are vulnerable to ability drain, but the rest of your party probably will be too, so I think you're better off counting on the cleric or whatever to take care of that than spending a gem slot. Besides, it has the same focus dependance as moonstone, so I'd rather have the general defenses.

    Speaking of psionic focus, several of the good gems as well as the capstone ability require you to conserve it, so I think you're best off accepting that drawback and ignoring it when judging a gem's worth. Besides, you can pick up Psicrystal Containment at level 3 and get the best of both worlds.

    As for your original questions:

    1) I think erudites gain the most, since you can get some pretty good powers from it that don't count against your unique powers per day. Wilders would get a similar benefit, but they lose too much of what makes them unique.

    2) I think the benefits of most gems are general enough to work with any specialisation, though being a nomad becomes a bit less attractive if you pick jet since that gives you one of its signature powers.

    3) Nimble is the best, then probably Hero (at least if you're not a warforged). It wouldn't hurt that much to choose something else for purposes of role-playing, though.

    4) What you said sounds about right for a single-minded artiste. A nimble hero would probably be constantly on edge and eager for action.

    5) You can do that, yes.

    6) See above; basically, The_Glyphstone's list with opal instead of diamond.

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by Fishy View Post
    Psiforged are awesome, but if you were a Kalashtar, you could also use the various Quori-Embedded Shards, for even more crystal goodness.
    Use Psionic Device takes care of this. I forget, do Erudites get that as a class skill?
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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by Teron View Post
    Don't forget the capstone ability; it makes the last three that much better (only at level 10, but you're assuming 5 gems anyway). Moonstone and jet (which actually lets you fly 12 times/day when you finish the class) also effectively increase the number of unique powers an erudite can manifest daily, which makes them much better than diamond. By the same logic, I'd take opal over the latter.
    I fully intended on taking the capstone - I need my psicrystal to stay close to me anyway for power sharing purposes (e.g. the usual PSV trick.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Teron View Post
    Warforged are vulnerable to ability drain, but the rest of your party probably will be too, so I think you're better off counting on the cleric or whatever to take care of that than spending a gem slot. Besides, it has the same focus dependance as moonstone, so I'd rather have the general defenses.
    The trouble with ability drain - an ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure. I'd rather be immune at the outset, preventing me from losing power points or risking helplessness so I can help my party out. But perhaps I can count on my psiforged immunities (disease and poison) to deal with the more common kinds, and just be careful around undead.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teron View Post
    Speaking of psionic focus, several of the good gems as well as the capstone ability require you to conserve it, so I think you're best off accepting that drawback and ignoring it when judging a gem's worth. Besides, you can pick up Psicrystal Containment at level 3 and get the best of both worlds.
    Yes, that was my intention. And it's another advantage of a Psiforged Erudite over a Psion - because I get a free psicrystal and a bonus feat, I'll have a free feat before entering Crystal Master. Though I can't decide what to get yet. I'll already be getting Psicrystal Containment, and Psionic Meditation is a lock for the bonus feat at 5.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teron View Post
    1) I think erudites gain the most, since you can get some pretty good powers from it that don't count against your unique powers per day. Wilders would get a similar benefit, but they lose too much of what makes them unique.
    That's a very good point. I can use jet to fly and free up a UPD, etc. This is the kind of advice I was hoping for.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teron View Post
    2) I think the benefits of most gems are general enough to work with any specialisation, though being a nomad becomes a bit less attractive if you pick jet since that gives you one of its signature powers.
    While that's true, I'd definitely want powers like Hustle as soon as possible. For instance, an FD Erudite can learn it at 3, but a regular one has to wait until 7!

    Of course, the same goes for powers like Quintessence, so it's a toss-up I guess. The 9th level discipline powers would have to be my deciding factor, as well as those on other lists (like Ardent).

    Quote Originally Posted by Teron View Post
    3) Nimble is the best, then probably Hero (at least if you're not a warforged). It wouldn't hurt that much to choose something else for purposes of role-playing, though.

    4) What you said sounds about right for a single-minded artiste. A nimble hero would probably be constantly on edge and eager for action.
    I can't believe I forgot Nimble. Yes, that ranks right up there with the other two, possibly even ahead of Single-Minded. So a Nimble Artiste... maybe it uses its spider-legs to help me craft, or maybe it likes to dance

    How much of a money maker is gemcutting? I don't really plan on maxing it - just getting it high enough to take 10 and get all my gems. So the boost would allow me to spend my points elsewhere, e.g. Autohypnosis.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teron View Post
    5) You can do that, yes.
    Excellent. Now if only my party doesn't mind sleeping through the scraping.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teron View Post
    6) See above; basically, The_Glyphstone's list with opal instead of diamond.
    Opal? Is Divination that useful? I'd rather leave "what should we do?" type powers to the cleric if I'm going to be an Erudite. That's the kind of spell you'd cast at the beginning of a day to know what you should do next, but it would tie up one of my precious UPD until bedtime. Or if I wait until the end of the day, my UPD might already be tied up.

    I think I'd pass on Opal, which leaves me with another three gems to assign: The ones I've decided on are Aquamarine, Ruby and Jet - though Diamond gives 24 PP at the capstone instead of 20, I'm not sold on it just yet.
    Last edited by Optimystik; 2010-01-17 at 06:20 PM.

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    I like the moonstone myself. +5 ac (because sometimes an arrow in the back happens) and +5 to saves. And they are a type that I don't see in play often (insight) so I can stack them sounds good to me.
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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    +6, actually. Like I said before, if you have five gems, you have the capstone that counts your psicrystal as a sixth gem. And between the boost to touch AC and fortitude, I think it would do about as much to protect your ability scores as red jasper. The latter only works against ability drain, not damage, which is awfully narrow. Really nice -- possibly even life-saving -- when it applies, but your life will depend on the outcome of a saving throw a lot more often.

    As for opal, I personally like divination/clairsentience, and depending on how your DM tends to answer it can be pretty damn useful any time you have ten minutes to consider your next move (and unlike a cleric, you don't have to have a sacrificial offering, which may be inconvenient at times if the DM doesn't let him handwave expensive components by spending 25 gold on the spot). It's also nice in that, unlike several similar spells, it never lies to you. If you'd rather take something else, though, diamond is a decent choice, or I suppose you could take red jasper along with moonstone for peace of mind. Emerald could range from "really good" to a liability, depending on the kind of enemies your DM favours and the make-up of your party (specifically, whether other PCs are likely to cast spells on you in combat).

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    Default Re: Psiforged Crystal Master [3.5]

    I'm kicking myself right about now - if I take Opal as an Erudite, Divination won't use up one of my UPD, as it will be a PLA. I still don't think its worthy of a slot though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vizzerdrix View Post
    I like the moonstone myself. +5 ac (because sometimes an arrow in the back happens) and +5 to saves. And they are a type that I don't see in play often (insight) so I can stack them sounds good to me.
    You're right about insight being rare. Moonstone makes the cut.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teron View Post
    As for opal, I personally like divination/clairsentience, and depending on how your DM tends to answer it can be pretty damn useful any time you have ten minutes to consider your next move (and unlike a cleric, you don't have to have a sacrificial offering, which may be inconvenient at times if the DM doesn't let him handwave expensive components by spending 25 gold on the spot). It's also nice in that, unlike several similar spells, it never lies to you. If you'd rather take something else, though, diamond is a decent choice, or I suppose you could take red jasper along with moonstone for peace of mind. Emerald could range from "really good" to a liability, depending on the kind of enemies your DM favours and the make-up of your party (specifically, whether other PCs are likely to cast spells on you in combat).
    Emerald isn't unique enough for me to consider - there's a ton of ways to get PR/SR, so I'd rather use a tattoo or a skin (or even manifest Power Resistance myself - after all, I have powers known to spare on it) than burn a gem slot on it. A power resistance tattoo or power stone would give me PR of 12 + my ML, easily exceeding the emerald's benefit. Even better, I can choose when I want to activate it, preventing me from having SR up when a teammate is giving me a much-needed heal or buff.

    With red jasper, I thought protection against ability drain would work just as well against ability damage. Was I mistaken?

    Obsidian seems like another good choice, making me immune to scrying effects. More importantly, it blocks me from true seeing, so if I find another way to turn invisible (UPD, for instance) then I'd be basically unfindable.

    Onyx also seems like a good choice. Will save DC 16 + Int mod or become shaken, 6/day, works on every enemy that can see me, and it's not mind-affecting. Brilliant. (It also doesn't mention being a fear effect, but that might be a bit much to try and get past my DM.)

    Tiger's Eye seems a good choice for the Dex boost - more initiative is always good.

    Finally, Sapphire gives me permanent 60ft. Touchsight - meaning it's impossible for things to hide from me as long as I have LoE. RAW, I can even find people hiding under a mind blank. Now wouldn't that make me the leading choice to stand guard?

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