Variant Ranger question

[Volthawk]

When does this ranger variant actually GET the wild shape and fast movement?

Just wondering because if it gets Wild Shape at first level, you could go into Master of Many Forms at level 2, right?

[Haruspex_Pariah]

At the same level as the druid, apparently.

"These variants simply swap one or more of that class's features for one or more class features of another class. A class feature gained works just as it did for its original class, including the level at which it is gained and any other effects, except as noted below. "

[Soranar]

yes you qualify for MOMF

but

your wildshape progression is the same as a druid

which means you need 5 levels

[Volthawk]

At the same level as the druid, apparently.

"These variants simply swap one or more of that class's features for one or more class features of another class. A class feature gained works just as it did for its original class, including the level at which it is gained and any other effects, except as noted below. "

Ooops. Missed that.

Although I did guess that, since prestige classes at level 2 seemed just a bit odd.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Ooops. Missed that.

Although I did guess that, since prestige classes at level 2 seemed just a bit odd.

Survivor is enterable at 2. There are Mystic Theurge builds that can enter at 3, and the classic Master Specialist is intended to be snagged at 4. Heck, Divine Minion lets you use MoMF at 4, IIRC.

[Volthawk]

Where is Survivor? Gotta see this for myself

[Dusk Eclipse]

Survivor is inSavage Species IIRC, it is great for NPC's or maybe gestalt it gives no bab bonus, I believe all good saves and evasion and other survival related abilities (evasion, mettle uncanny dodge)

[sonofzeal]

Survivor is inSavage Species IIRC, it is great for NPC's or maybe gestalt it gives no bab bonus, I believe all good saves and evasion and other survival related abilities (evasion, mettle uncanny dodge)

0 BAB (not even 1/2), all good saves, imp. evasion, imp. uncanny dodge, DR 5/-, but NO mettle. Oh, and like d8 HD.

[Riffington]

To be fair, survivor wasn't designed to be accessible at lev 2. That was a mistake on the designers' part, but one that they found too funny to want to fix.

[tyckspoon]

To be fair, survivor wasn't designed to be accessible at lev 2. That was a mistake on the designers' part, but one that they found too funny to want to fix.

To be even more fair and accurate, the only class that can enter it that early is Commoner anyway- it requires that your level be higher than your highest save, so the only way in that early is with a class that has all bad saves.

[Volthawk]

To be even more fair and accurate, the only class that can enter it that early is Commoner anyway- it requires that your level be higher than your highest save, so the only way in that early is with a class that has all bad saves.

Oddly enough, it uses a half-orc fighter as an example, even though he wouldn't qualify!

[Person_Man]

Fist of the Forest is enterable at level 4. IIRC Stoneblesed is enterable at level 3. Assuming you have racial hit die, you can enter some PrC at level 1.

[faceroll]

When does this ranger variant actually GET the wild shape and fast movement?

Just wondering because if it gets Wild Shape at first level, you could go into Master of Many Forms at level 2, right?

MoMF needs BAB +4, so you can enter at level five with a changeling.

[sofawall]

Survivor is enterable at 2. There are Mystic Theurge builds that can enter at 3, and the classic Master Specialist is intended to be snagged at 4. Heck, Divine Minion lets you use MoMF at 4, IIRC.

And some that enter at 2.

[Volthawk]

MoMF needs BAB +4, so you can enter at level five with a changeling.

No, it doesn't. It needs Alertness, Endurance and Wild Shape.

[deuxhero]

Endurance? Sounds like it was meant for Wildshape rangers.

[arguskos]

And some that enter at 2.

Wait wut. I know most of the early entry tricks, and I don't know that one. I am assuming it has something to do with Precocious Apprentice and someway to make your spells count as arcane and divine, but how does the latter happen?

[Dr Bwaa]

Endurance? Sounds like it was meant for Wildshape rangers.

It basically is, since otherwise it's a "druid" class with no casting and no animal companion.

[Vizzerdrix]

And some that enter at 2.

None can enter at level 2 due to the skill requirements. 6 ranks are needed in both skills and you can't get that until 3rd level

[Volthawk]

It basically is, since otherwise it's a "druid" class with no casting and no animal companion.

Well, it does get some nice things, which the Druid gets with Epic feats (Gargantuan, Diminutive, Dragon and Vermin Wild Shape), some things he can't get from feats (Ooze, Aberration, Humanoid,Fey,Monstrous humanoid and Giant Wild Shape, Wild Shaping as a move action,extraordinary abilities of forms and speaking while in Wild Shape and Shapechanger subtype ) and more wild shapes (total of 10, one each level).

[ErrantX]

None can enter at level 2 due to the skill requirements. 6 ranks are needed in both skills and you can't get that until 3rd level

You'd think that... but you'd be wrong. Judicious use of a bardic ability, a psionic power, and the right feats and you can enter for your 2nd level. You'd suck, but you could still get into it.

-X

[Volthawk]

You'd think that... but you'd be wrong. Judicious use of a bardic ability, a psionic power, and the right feats and you can enter for your 2nd level. You'd suck, but you could still get into it.

And what would they be?

[TheFallenOne]

When does this ranger variant actually GET the wild shape and fast movement?

Well, the Wildshape one has been answered very fast, but nobody mentioned the Fast Movement

That variant gets it at first level(since the Barbarian does so too) but don't you think it's strange that this variant gets Fast Movement without having to sacrifice anything for it unless he decides to take a now dead second level?

[deuxhero]

Hmm, does a Wolf Totem barb 2/wildshape ranger 3 stack his speed boosts (I know I can trade them)?

[Ernir]

Hmm, does a Wolf Totem barb 2/wildshape ranger 3 stack his speed boosts (I know I can trade them)?

No, you'd just get the Barbarian's Fast Movement "again".

So yes, do trade one of them out for an ACF. And by that I mean Pounce.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

You'd think that... but you'd be wrong. Judicious use of a bardic ability, a psionic power, and the right feats and you can enter for your 2nd level. You'd suck, but you could still get into it.

-X

Not if you play by WBL.

[deuxhero]

No, you'd just get the Barbarian's Fast Movement "again".

So yes, do trade one of them out for an ACF. And by that I mean Pounce.

I don't think you can take both Wolf Totem AND spirit tiger.

[LibraryOgre]

Hey, turns out I still have the spreadsheet of simple variants I did a few years ago!

GoogleDocs link

Looking at them, I'd probably go with the Crafty Hunter Barbarian. The Deadly Hunter druid would be interesting, especially with a parsimonious GM, and the wildshape ranger.

[faceroll]

No, it doesn't. It needs Alertness, Endurance and Wild Shape.

Oh. I was thinking of warshaper.

You'd think that... but you'd be wrong. Judicious use of a bardic ability, a psionic power, and the right feats and you can enter for your 2nd level. You'd suck, but you could still get into it.

-X

Hypothetically, but they're all beyond the WBL of a 2nd level character.
And I see now that I was ninjad.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Hypothetically, but they're all beyond the WBL of a 2nd level character.
And I see now that I was ninjad.

How did I ninja you? The last post before mine was 9 hours ago.