Help with Epic BAB and Save progression??

[Os1ris09]

Hey guys I was wondering which way does an epic character accumulate saves and bonuses when reaching epic lvl w/out a full 20 class levels/ 10 PrC/ and 5 PrC?

For example at lvl 20 I have a Ranger 6/ Scout 4/ Dervish 10 and I want to take the 21st lvl in scout. So the build would be ranger 6/scout4/dervish10/scout1.

Do I gain the normal saves and BAB of a 5 lvl scout or do I use the Epic lvl chart and gain 1 BAB and no saves?

[Douglas]

You use the epic chart and gain 1 BAB but no save increases.

[Blackfang108]

Specifically, Once you have reached 20 Hit Dice, you begin the Epic Save and Epic Attack Bonus(EAB) progressions, regardless of how you obtained those Hit Dice, be they Racial HD or Class HD.

So a Character with 3 Racial Hit Dice, 10 levels of Monk, 4 levels of Fighter, and 3 levels of Binder (3 [race]/10 Monk/4 Fighter/3 Binder) would use the Epic progression for saves and EAB going forward.

In your instance, one point of EAB (which does NOT add extra attacks per round), and nothing to saves, and the class features of a 5th level scout.

[sofawall]

Specifically, Once you have reached 20 Hit Dice, you begin the Epic Save and Epic Attack Bonus(EAB) progressions, regardless of how you obtained those Hit Dice, be they Racial HD or Class HD.

So a Character with 3 Racial Hit Dice, 10 levels of Monk, 4 levels of Fighter, and 3 levels of Binder (3 [race]/10 Monk/4 Fighter/3 Binder) would use the Epic progression for saves and EAB going forward.

In your instance, one point of EAB (which does NOT add extra attacks per round), and nothing to saves, and the class features of a 5th level scout.

Err, what? No. Dragons have Full BAB, for example.

[Douglas]

Err, what? No. Dragons have Full BAB, for example.

Racial hit dice get to ignore the epic progression, but they still count towards when you would otherwise start using it. A dragon with 30 racial hit dice has 30 BAB and +17 saves, but if he takes a class level he'll get epic progression for the class level. If he's got 20 racial hit dice, he'll have 20 BAB and +12 saves, and will use epic progression for any class levels he takes. If he has 15 racial hit dice, his first 5 class levels will use their normal progression but any after that will use epic.

[hamishspence]

DMG page 209: Monsters as epic characters

"A bugbear (3 Hit dice and +2 LA) that is also a 14th level fighter/3rd level blackguard is ECL 22 and thus gains an epic attack and save bonus"

So, if the monster has racial hit dice and character levels (and LA), and exceeds ECL 20, further character levels are epic and thus gain save bonuses and BAB bonuses according to the epic rules.

It may work differently for monsters being advanced via Hit Dice, though.