Druids 3.5

[Mystic Muse]

Okay. RIght now I'm playing a homebrew version of a Paladin but I want to make a Druid as a backup. Here are a few things to keep in mind.

1.I want to be able to transform into a dragon but I'd prefer to be able to go beyond medium size. If that's not possible that's fine.

2.I don't want to break this character. I want him/her to be good but not amazing.

3.I'm currently playing with another druid, a spellthief 1/dragonfire adept 6 and 2 fighters. Possibly a Monk too but maybe not.

4.This character has a starting level of 10. The other players are level seven but I'm hoping not to die until level 10.

5.I'd like a wisdom boost but don't pick a race that's really obscure and really odd please.

6. This character is Neutral Good.

7. I've never played a druid and don't know where to begin other than Natural spell.

[KurtKatze]

A pure Druid alone can be gamebraking. I mean you can shapeshift into something which is able to fly and than cast from a safe distance. The game braking aspect will depend on how you are going to play though.

For the race hmmm... maybe lesser Aasimar that's the least fancy thing i could think of.

[Eldariel]

You'll be able to Shapechange into Dragon easily enough with level 9 spells. For a bit earlier access, Draconomicon has Dragon Wildshape acquirable on level 12. It uhh...gives you Supernatural Abilities. So it's pretty damn good. So uh, careful. Still, if you only use that clause for breath weapon, it's no problem.

Wisdom-boost race; your principal options:
- Lesser Aasimar [PGtF]
- Dreamsight Shifter [RoE] (only while Shifting)
- Dragonwrought Kobold [RoD] (only with Age-categories)

And some more obscure ones. Then there's level-adjusted stuff, but that probably isn't very good, especially since you want HD for Wildshape. Note though that Druids make fine use of Age-categories as they don't need physical stats all that much, while all mentals are useful if not essential to them (basically, all they need is Con and the gain in mentals easily makes up for the extra points you invest in Con).

Really, Middle-Age is both thematically and mechanically excellent for Druids so if you wanna play a Wis-bonusless race like Human, it's a fine alternative. Oh, and they gain Timeless Body eventually; you can go sit in a fast-time plan and meditate for few days and gain all the mental bonuses at that point.


Where to begin? Focus. Druid can do anything, so decide what you want to do and work from there. Summoning? Can do. Wildshape combat focus? Can do. Animal Companion Focus? Yeah, doable. Friggin' Blasting? If you really want to.

Also note that Druid is actually good at the stuff he doesn't focus in, but he truly excels at his focus. So, yeah. If you want Dragon Wild Shape, for example, Wildshape-focus isn't a bad idea at all.

[Orran]

How about normal aasimar? Judging by the rest of the characters, LA+1 might help bring the druid in line, just try not to be too good at everything. As for turning into dragons, I believe theres a feat for it, although the only one I found on the SRd was epic.

[Eldariel]

How about normal aasimar? Judging by the rest of the characters, LA+1 might help bring the druid in line, just try not to be too good at everything. As for turning into dragons, I believe theres a feat for it, although the only one I found on the SRd was epic.

The issue is that the non-Epic version of Dragon Wildshape can only be acquired on level 12 so if he wants that, he'll be delaying that with LA. You can intentionally hold back if powerlevel is an issue (as it well might be).

[Tanaric]

While Dragon Wildshape can be simply a fun alternative to normal Wild Shape, you should be careful about unintended abuse.

For instance, a Very Young Shadow Dragon. You can Dragon Wildshape into that (or older, even) as soon as you qualify for the feat. That nets you the ability to have constant total concealment in everything but natural daylight and immunity to energy drain, on top of the normal dragon immunities and senses.

Oh, and a breath weapon that deals negative levels, but there are much better alternatives for that.

While the feat doesn't break the game wide open, it can be a boost to a Druid's power level, and a Druid really doesn't need the help on the whole.

In regards to the rest of your post, I suggest checking out The Druid Handbook. While it's not perfect, it gives a lot of sound advice and feat suggestions.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

You could use the Shapeshift variant from PH2 and just make all of your forms dragon-themed. They would be statistically identical to what you'd get if you use animal forms, but be more in-flavor with what you want for the character, plus it's far less overpowered than a standard Druid's Wild Shape. Go with a winged base race, such as Raptoran (RotW) or preferably take the feat Dragon Wings (RotD) with a Dragonblood race such as Silverbrow Human or Forestlord Elf from Dragon Magic, or even go Dragonwrought Kobold. When using Shapeshift to take a winged form you wouldn't normally gain a fly speed except when using Aerial Form, though if you already had a fly speed and use a winged Ferocious Slayer form for example you would retain that fly speed. That way every form you take could be that of a dragon, and once your character can fly normally you would be able to do so in every form. The Elemental Fury form could simply be that of a dragon made entirely out of whatever element you choose.

[Mystic Muse]

How exactly does Vow of poverty help a druid? just curious. Do they really need that little equipment?

[Mongoose87]

How exactly does Vow of poverty help a druid? just curious. Do they really need that little equipment?

Well, most of it is useless in Wild Shape.

[Mystic Muse]

I guess that's true. Assuming you mean equipment of course.

[Lycanthromancer]

How exactly does Vow of poverty help a druid? just curious. Do they really need that little equipment?

It hurts druids less than anyone but incarnum and psionic classes, considering the fact that it takes a considerable amount of effort (or lots of wilding clasps) to acquire magic items that are usable during wild shape.

It's generally considered good in excessively low-wealth campaigns even so, however.

[Optimystik]

It hurts druids less than anyone but incarnum and psionic classes, considering the fact that it takes a considerable amount of effort (or lots of wilding clasps) to acquire magic items that are usable during wild shape.

It's generally considered good in excessively low-wealth campaigns even so, however.

In addition to the above, Druids:

A) have the spells to make up for lack of items (e.g. against a flying foe, they can turn into a bird, cast Wind Walk etc.)

B) their divine focus is usually something that doesn't break the vow, as opposed to a cleric's holy symbol. (e.g. berries, leaves, pool of water etc.)

[Mystic Muse]

are there magic items for druids that make VOP NOT Worth it?

[Optimystik]

are there magic items for druids that make VOP NOT Worth it?

Artifacts

There might be, but the Equipment section of the handbook isn't finished so I dunno.

[Fenix_of_Doom]

Yes, they are called 'Wilding clasps', if I'm not mistaken and can be found in the magic item compendium.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Note, most magic items resize to fit, so a Druid can simply strip before Wildshaping, then have a party member put his Belt of Battle, Cloak of Resistance, Anklets of Translocation, and similar onto his Dire Tiger body.

[Aquillion]

2.I don't want to break this character. I want him/her to be good but not amazing.

7. I've never played a druid and don't know where to begin other than Natural spell.

Druids are so powerful that they don't really need any special build beyond that (although of course you'll need something to cover your desire to turn into a dragon, which others have gone over.) But basically, a druid with Natural Spell is just about as powerful as it gets; if you don't want to be amazing and don't want to steal the show, you don't need any further optimization or advice on top of that (in fact, depending on your group you may have to deliberately tone it down.)

In general, though, the best strategies for a druid are to choose powerful animal companions, turn into something powerful yourself, summon powerful stuff, and use your spells to buff them all.

It is very important for a druid to know the ins and outs of Summon Nature's Ally. It's actually a very, very powerful thing to be able to cast spontaneously (much more useful than a cleric's ability to spontaneously convert to cure spells IMHO); many creatures you can summon have their own innate powers that can let you access various spells without having to prepare them, and sometimes even spells or powers that aren't on your list at all (for instance, you can use Summon Nature’s Ally V to summon a Janni, who has Plane Shift and Ethereal Jaunt, both spells a Druid wouldn't normally get -- and now you don't even have to memorize them.) Similarly, Summon Nature's Ally IV gets you a unicorn, which is an easy way to heal.

[Mystic Muse]

So in order to keep the items on my body somebody has to go put them on my person after he/she morphs?

[Protecar]

There's specific size feats also, if you want to morph into larger or smaller creatures:
Gargantuan Wild Shape and then Colossal Wild Shape. I dunno where you can find them, but I'm sure someone else can point them out.

[CTLC]

druid 5, warshaper 5, master of many forms 10
maybe switch around momf or warshaper, but play an aasimar or lesser aasimar, take natural spell [duh], and you should be all set.

[Mystic Muse]

well gargantuan annd collosal wildshape are epic feats.

That and I don't know how I would wildshape into a huge creature since there isn't a huge wild shape feat and AFAIK you can only be a medium or small creature in wildshape form otherwise.

what are warshaper and master of many forms from?

[Wings of Peace]

You could always fufill the dragon shape by being a Planar Shepard of your campaign's dream realm and claim if a creature can be dreamt then it exists on the plane as a native and can thus be wild shaped into. Though that would violate your number 2.

[Nate the Snake]

well gargantuan annd collosal wildshape are epic feats.

Master of Many Forms gets gargantuan wild shape as a class feature. Colossal still requires epic, though.

That and I don't know how I would wildshape into a huge creature since there isn't a huge wild shape feat and AFAIK you can only be a medium or small creature in wildshape form otherwise.

Druid 15 and MoMF 6 grant huge wild shape as a class feature.

what are warshaper and master of many forms from?

Complete Warrior and Complete Adventurer, respectively.

[Zergrusheddie]

You knowing that you need Natural Spell is pretty much all you need to know.

Animal Companion: Fleshraker. These things are unbelievable. If DM says no dice, a Dire Wolf can also be great; put a saddle on him and the guards probably won't care that you are riding an extremely lethal animal. After all, it's just a big riding dog.

Some fun things to do is turn into an Ape type animal and use Brambles from Complete Divine. It adds a +2 enhancement bonus to attack and +1 damage/level (Max 10 or 15) for hours/level to a staff. It will be powerful, but it isn't overshadowing to a huge degree. When I played my last Druid, I had lots of fun with the Staff + Brambles but I was slightly better with just a Dire Bear with my Wolf Tripping. Trip, Attack, Grapple. If they escape, AoO as the stand up. Free Grapple.

Feats:
Any Druid that does not take Natural Spell at level 6 is burned at the stake.

Natural Bond is great if you can get your DM to agree to letting it reduce the penalty factor for advanced Animal Companions.

Dragon Wildshape at level 12 is a must for your character concept. Companion Spellbond increases the range that you can share spells with your

Animal Companion to 30 feet. This is wonderful because it lets your Barkskin and Greater Magic Fangs still help your Animal Companion when you are no in melee range with your pet. This lets you send the pet while you sit back in a safer position.

Multi-attack can be nice and if you are going to turn into a creature that has 6+ attacks a round, than it is certainly worth it.

Items:
Wilding Clasps are nice. Attach to your periapt of wisdom and you are good to go.

Wilding Armor can be decent though it is a +3 Enhancement.

Lesser Rods of Extends are nice. With three uses and three spells casts per day, you can make Barkskin basically last hours/level. Not amazing, but it is useful at lower levels when a few more AC can actually matter.

Monk's Belt. If you can convince the DM that it converts your Wisdom into AC as well, that it can be worth the steep price.

[faceroll]

Animal Companion: Fleshraker. These things are unbelievable. If DM says no dice, a Dire Wolf can also be great; put a saddle on him and the guards probably won't care that you are riding an extremely lethal animal. After all, it's just a big riding dog.

Depends on your DM, and what dire animals look like:

Dire animals are larger, tougher, meaner versions of ordinary animals. Each kind tends to have a feral, prehistoric, or even demonic appearance.

[Prime32]

You could use the Shapeshift variant from PH2 and just make all of your forms dragon-themed. They would be statistically identical to what you'd get if you use animal forms, but be more in-flavor with what you want for the character, plus it's far less overpowered than a standard Druid's Wild Shape. Go with a winged base race, such as Raptoran (RotW) or preferably take the feat Dragon Wings (RotD) with a Dragonblood race such as Silverbrow Human or Forestlord Elf from Dragon Magic, or even go Dragonwrought Kobold. When using Shapeshift to take a winged form you wouldn't normally gain a fly speed except when using Aerial Form, though if you already had a fly speed and use a winged Ferocious Slayer form for example you would retain that fly speed. That way every form you take could be that of a dragon, and once your character can fly normally you would be able to do so in every form. The Elemental Fury form could simply be that of a dragon made entirely out of whatever element you choose.

I would go with this. It's not as powerful as a standard druid, but it's simple and mechanically different from the other druid in the party.

Or rather than play a guy who turns into a dragon, you could play a dragon who turns into a guy (ie. a bronze, gold or silver dragon), though the LA places them outside your range unless you're using variant rules (with which a very young gold dragon or a young bronze dragon should suit your needs) or you can somehow convince your DM to apply the benefit of the Dragon Cohort feat to yourself (as Leadership, but cohort only and ignore 3 points of LA).

[Fenix_of_Doom]

Items:
Wilding Clasps are nice. Attach to your periapt of wisdom and you are good to go.

Wilding Armor can be decent though it is a +3 Enhancement.

Lesser Rods of Extends are nice. With three uses and three spells casts per day, you can make Barkskin basically last hours/level. Not amazing, but it is useful at lower levels when a few more AC can actually matter.

Monk's Belt. If you can convince the DM that it converts your Wisdom into AC as well, that it can be worth the steep price.

The armour is very much not worth it, the monk's belt+wilding clasp very much is, there really isn't any convincing necessary for allowing wis to AC, to belt specifically address non-monks using the belt.
Also remember that per MIC you can tag certain enchantments to random items. So you could for example add a +4 CON bonus to your +6 pariapt of wisdom with a single wilding clasp. Do the same with str/dex/resistance(better to use a spell for resistance though) for the belt and proceed to smash face.

[Flickerdart]

If you wanted to have a bit of fun, you could dip some Monk levels, which would simultaneously keep your power level in check and provide a handful of goodies, also opening up some PrCs. Druid 20, of course, is better, but not as creative.

[Felyndiira]

Before you ask about optimizing a druid without being too powerful, think about it this way:

A druid with natural spell can cast in flying forms starting at level 6. A cleric need to pick one of about 4 (!) domains in order to get the polymorph spell for the same thing. Three of these domains get it at level 15+, and no deities have the transformation domain.

A druid's spell list is superior to that of a cleric.

A druid needs less stats than a cleric.

A druid gets an animal companion and class features.

Therefore, a druid requires only natural spell to be far superior to the cleric, a tier 1 class. That says something about how powerful a druid is without any extra optimization on your part.

[Mystic Muse]

All I'm hearing is "go vow of poverty"

Okay. I'm probably going to focus on Wildshaping.