Mage-slayer build

[Dusk Eclipse]

I was considering a build specially focused on taking out casters, my initial thoughts are something like this:

Ranger 1
Monk 2
Paladin 2
Something X

Using the Mage-slayer feat three, ACF favorite enemy arcanist, serenity

The monk levels are mostly to get evasion, and some good saves while getting synergy with the feat Serenity

now the question is what would be the best course?

Thanks in advance

[Eldariel]

How do you intend on killing casters? Or is your plan to "be a hard target"?

[Dusk Eclipse]

actually I don't know yet, it is just an idea that struck me (partially inspired by a thread concerning Miko's build)

[Boci]

3 levels of hexblade for mettle and cha to saves against spells. Occult slayer is a decent class, a crusader dip for thicket of blades is also a good idea. Make sure you have the weapon quality that allows greater dispeling to be cast I think twice per day as a swift action. Sadly I forget where it is from.

[Totally Guy]

Suel Arcanamach?

You'd have a bad caster level due to the Mage slayer but his buffs have a dispell resistance and free extend spell plus you get a dispelling strike once per day.

Mage killing is what it says on the tin. Not sure how good it would be in practice.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Would Practiced Spellcaster suffice to fix the CL loss from Mageslayer? though I believe this will be a very feat starved build.

also where is Suel Arcanamath from? I seem to recall it but I don't remember exactly from which books is it.

[Boci]

Suel Arcanamach?

You'd have a bad caster level due to the Mage slayer but his buffs have a dispell resistance and free extend spell plus you get a dispelling strike once per day.

Mage killing is what it says on the tin. Not sure how good it would be in practice.

It depends, due to the numerous styles of the mage. Some focus on touch attack spells that do not allow a save, in which case psionic warrior for armour bonus to touch AC is good, but that won't help against a mage who never makes an attack roll.

also where is Suel Arcanamath from? I seem to recall it but I don't remember exactly from which books is it.

Complete warrior, same book as occult slayer.

[lord_khaine]

The best mage-slayer i can think of that isnt using arcane magic is a psion/slayer 10/10.

If you dont want it to be a full caster then i would instead suggest psychic warrior 18/warblade 2, with the mage slayer line of feats.

[KellKheraptis]

Slayer is an excellent idea, and especially if full transparency isn't in effect, as the -CL won't effect ML. Psion 6/Ranger 1/Slayer 9/Abjurant Champion 4 (psionic adaptation) would get a sexy bonus vs. arcanists, 9th level powers, 17 BAB, 18 ML, and can get the whole mage slayer tree, as only two feats are explicitly needed (Track, which Ranger gives free, and Combat Manifesting). Throw in Knowledge Affiliation capstone to shut down their spellcasting for a short while, and hope you can bring down their contingencies before they kick in to port them away. If you can do that, you stand a chance. If they get out of the trap, hope they don't come back that day or get a way to track you by an item (they can't track you magically, thanks to Slayer's nondetection being for all intents unbreakable, but nothing saying they can't track your footprints or some such). Also, a barbarian build using Instantaneous Rage, Knowledge Affiliation capstone, and Imperious Command might have at least a chance, under the same circumstances as above.

[Gaiwecoor]

Complete warrior Arcane, same book as occult slayer.

There you go - fixed that.

[Sinfire Titan]

The best mage-slayer i can think of that isnt using arcane magic is a psion/slayer 10/10.

If you dont want it to be a full caster then i would instead suggest psychic warrior 18/warblade 2, with the mage slayer line of feats.

Which is actually a good idea, since the Mage Slayer feats don't affect your ML (due to the Transparency being restricted to Spells and Magic Items).

[Mongoose87]

My suggestion is to pair it up with an AoO-based Crusader build, leaving you something to fall back on, if it's not working or there are no mages.

[Eldariel]

The best mage-slayer i can think of that isnt using arcane magic is a psion/slayer 10/10.

Uhm, Initiate of Mystra Cleric 5/Dweomerkeeper 10/X 5 anyone? Not an ounce of arcane magic (except a few cantrips to qualify for Dweomerkeeper), though ****tons of magic including ability to replicate most arcane spells as divine.

[LichPrinceAlim]

I actually suggest a wilder build based on being the counter of the wizard:

Race: Dragonborn Dromite
Class: Wilder 4/Paladin 1/Metamind 10/Arch Psion 5

Feats: Force of Personality (Not phenominal, but cha to will is nice), Psionic Staples, Mage-Slayer

[KellKheraptis]

I actually suggest a wilder build based on being the counter of the wizard:

Race: Dragonborn Dromite
Class: Wilder 4/Paladin 1/Metamind 10/Arch Psion 5

Feats: Force of Personality (Not phenominal, but cha to will is nice), Psionic Staples, Mage-Slayer

Best match IMO for Metamind is Ardent 10 (Dominant Ideal) with Practiced Manifester, possibly as an Ilumian. You'll lose 5 levels of PP progression, but get the capstone of unlimited PP with full ML and 9th level powers, plus you can augment powers with metapsionics like a real caster.

[LichPrinceAlim]

Best match IMO for Metamind is Ardent 10 (Dominant Ideal) with Practiced Manifester, possibly as an Ilumian. You'll lose 5 levels of PP progression, but get the capstone of unlimited PP with full ML and 9th level powers, plus you can augment powers with metapsionics like a real caster.

Okay....So Ardent over Metamind. However, I like the Dragonborn Dromite, simply for the free ray power, along with bonus power points.

[Sinfire Titan]

Okay....So Ardent over Metamind. However, I like the Dragonborn Dromite, simply for the free ray power, along with bonus power points.

Doesn't work. Dragonborn causes SLAs/PLAs to disappear.

[ghashxx]

My suggestion is to pair it up with an AoO-based Crusader build, leaving you something to fall back on, if it's not working or there are no mages.

This, plus this, plus more of this. They take a 5' step, AoO and with improved combat reflexes out of dragon that's two of your allowed AoO's you have available for each provocation. Even better, you've got a reach weapon which means that's another two attacks. So incredibly tasty.

[Signmaker]

In personal experience, I can't really say that I suggest going the pure melee route with mage-slaying. It would probably help if you were a caster or a manifester, so that you could at least even the odds. I'd probably prioritize manifesting over casting, at that would net you the action economy to deal with caster tricks.

Naturally, you're going to want flight, high movement speeds, immunity granters, Evasion/Mettle, and the other typical defense mechanisms. If you're building to combat DM-generated enemy casters you could probably slack off for a few of these points, but it's probably best that you consider whatever you'd think a caster would do to you, and then work to minimize the damage stemming from that, either by effective defenses or outright circumvention (AoO lock, for instance).

[mabriss lethe]

Factotum with the proper selection of SLAs works pretty darned well.

[Mongoose87]

This, plus this, plus more of this. They take a 5' step, AoO and with improved combat reflexes out of dragon that's two of your allowed AoO's you have available for each provocation. Even better, you've got a reach weapon which means that's another two attacks. So incredibly tasty.

Too bad Spellcasting Harrier is Epic, otherwise, Stand Still+Spellcasting Harrier = Useless spellcaster.

[lord_khaine]

Uhm, Initiate of Mystra Cleric 5/Dweomerkeeper 10/X 5 anyone? Not an ounce of arcane magic (except a few cantrips to qualify for Dweomerkeeper), though ****tons of magic including ability to replicate most arcane spells as divine.

Thats only technicaly not using arcane magic, and do remember that a propper made psion cant lose if he remembers to save his game.

[deuxhero]

Thats only technicaly not using arcane magic, and do remember that a propper made psion cant lose if he remembers to save his game.

Hehe

... Oh, you didn't mean take ****.

Yeah, Psionics/divine magic is the best non-arcane caster caster killer

[Dusk Eclipse]

Thanks all for the incredible suggestions concerning a mageslayer build, the problem is, that this was just a thought exercise.

But the suggestion of Psion/ranger/Slayer/Abjurant Champion sounds good and I might want to bring that as a backup character; the problem is the ab champ conversion into psionics.

My first idea to convert was change the prerequisites from combat casting to combat manifestation and change the requirement of abjuration spells to knowledge of force screen power while mantaining the full casting(now manifesting) progression.

also which race would be good for this build?

[mcl01]

Personally, if you want a nonspellcaster, I like:

Paladin 4 (Holy Warrior variant. Trade spellcasting for a bonus feat), Fighter 1, Occult Slayer 5, Pious Templar 1/X 9.

Required feats:
True Believer
Weapon Focus
Improved Initiative
Mageslayer Tree

CHA to saves
Mettle (grab ring of evasion to complete the set)
Turn Undead for divine feats
+3 to saves
Nondetection
Continuous immunity to mind-affecting spells.

Now fuel up CHA, and find someway to get CHA to hit regularly reasonably. The ability to fly would be probably necessary. Large size and/or reach weapons would be nice too.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Personally, if you want a nonspellcaster, I like:

Paladin 4 (Holy Warrior variant. Trade spellcasting for a bonus feat), Fighter 1, Occult Slayer 5, Pious Templar 1/X 9.

Required feats:
True Believer
Weapon Focus
Improved Initiative
Mageslayer Tree

CHA to saves
Mettle (grab ring of evasion to complete the set)
Turn Undead for divine feats
+3 to saves
Nondetection
Continuous immunity to mind-affecting spells.

Now fuel up CHA, and find someway to get CHA to hit regularly reasonably. The ability to fly would be probably necessary. Large size and/or reach weapons would be nice too.

Where do I find this variant?

also what would be the best discipline for a mage slayer psion? my money is a discipline which name I don't remember the name but the practitioners are called egoist... (schism and astral construct can be adquired using expanded knowledge)

[Person_Man]

Simple anti-caster tricks:

1) Sunder their spell component pouch or holy symbol.

2) Sleight of Hand their spell component pouch or holy symbol. If you have a high enough check, you can do this as a FREE action.

3) Take Mage Slayer so they can't cast defensively. Move so that they are within your threatened area. Attack them with a net or harpoon so that they have to make an opposed Str check if they want to move away.

4) Find a reliable way to deal Level * 10ish damage (on a full attack with Pounce if necessary), and take Pierce Magical Concealment. Boost your Initiative to a reasonably high level. A dead enemy can't cast spells.

5) Runescarred Berserker: A nifty Barbarian half-caster-ish PrC (you have to scribe scrolls into your skin to cast spells). Notably gets Protection from Evil, See Invisibility, Invisibility, Freedom of Movement, Haste, Improved Invisibility, Righteous Might, Stoneskin, Spell Immunity, Polymorph Self, Heal, Spell Resistance, and Anti-Magic Field on it's spell list.

[Boci]

Where do I find this variant?

At a guess I'd say complete champion.

[herrhauptmann]

At a guess I'd say complete champion.

Or possibly Unearthed Arcana or PHB2. There's a few variants between the two, and I don't remember which has what.

If you're going to use Mageslayer, by the time you finish the tree, you'll have spent 4 feats and be at a -12 CL. Do not use arcane/divine spells unless they're all short duration buffs. Any major spell you try to cast, an equal CR mage could counter with ease. But chances are they won't bother with countering a 1 round spell.
So then I recommend being either Psionic or ToB.

There's a PrC in ToM which also specializes in killing casters. It's aimed primarily at Binders, but its abilities work well for regular casters, particularly the capstone Momentary disjunction. Slippery mind is also decent, and mettle can be VERY effective depending on what you end up fighting (Unholy Blight/cloudkill). Witchslayer.

Horizon walker 6 can get you good battlefield mobility (dim door 1d4 rounds).
Swiftblade (a little rough to get into with your chosen feats/classes) could be awesome with judicious use of haste plus good tactics. Swiftblade 10 though limits you to at most, 16th level casting. Still, you can nova nicely if you have appropriate buffs prepared to cast during your timestops. As a bonus, your haste spell (and timestop) are EX abilities, so they can go into an AMF.

[mcl01]

At a guess I'd say complete champion.

Indeed. Complete Champion p49. Paladin 4 = 1 bonus feat. You trade spellcasting (but with mageslayer, that's perfect!)

Another few other tidbits for that build:
Magebane weapons +1 enchantment (complete Arcane p143). Against spellcasters/SLA users it becomes a +3 weapon that does an extra 2d6 damage.

With high CHA (and as a paladin, probably high CON as well), look at the "sudden _" weapons in DMG2. A bunch of constant priced enchantments (+2000) for +2d6 damage several times/day depending on your CHA or Con bonus. Of special note is Sudden Stunning. CHA/day 1d4+1 round stun attempts with scaling CHA-based reflex save. All for the low, LOW price of 2000gp.

If you would like, also you could keep that 1 level of ranger and take the arcane hunter ACF (CM 32) to get favored enemy (arcanist).