[3.5 Help Please] Tripping, Grappling, and Prone Questions

[balistafreak]

So I made a character based on the Technical Fighter found here:

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Technic...haracter_Build)

Then, I started running some combat exercises in my head/on paper.

"So there's an enemy spellcaster. I run toward him. I Improved Trip with my Improved Unarmed Strike, and if it succeeds, I use my free melee attack to start an Improved Grapple... hmm..."

So, the questions:

1. Can I grapple with my Improved Trip attack?

2. What benefits for me/problems for the enemy occur when I grapple a prone enemy?

3. Hey, while I'm at it, how's disarming while grappling work?

4. And for frak's sake, someone please explain why this build ran whips.

[The Random NPC]

1. Yes
2. -4 to melee AC for the prone opponent
3. Just like normal
4. It's like a spikeless spiked chain, but no idea.

[AslanCross]

So I made a character based on the Technical Fighter found here:

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Technic...haracter_Build)

Then, I started running some combat exercises in my head/on paper.

"So there's an enemy spellcaster. I run toward him. I Improved Trip with my Improved Unarmed Strike, and if it succeeds, I use my free melee attack to start an Improved Grapple... hmm..."

So, the questions:

1. Can I grapple with my Improved Trip attack?

2. What benefits for me/problems for the enemy occur when I grapple a prone enemy?

3. Hey, while I'm at it, how's disarming while grappling work?

4. And for frak's sake, someone please explain why this build ran whips.

1. It seems like you can. Initiating a Grapple is "like a melee attack."

2. None, by RAW. However, I do think you at least have to kneel to grapple a prone enemy, assuming it's medium. For simplicity's sake I'd just rule that you have to be prone as well.
EDIT: I forgot about the prone AC penalty.

3. As far as I can tell you can disarm as normal, since you can attack as normal. However, since you're using an unarmed strike or light weapon, you are likely to get a penalty to disarming. This is especially useless if your opponent is using a two-handed weapon.

4. No idea. I can't access the link at work.

[Siosilvar]

If you actually grapple a tripped opponent, however, do be prepared for the "horizontal tango" puns and so forth that will come your way.

[The Random NPC]

I just read more about the build; he is using the whip because it is one handed. He uses the other hand for a shield.

[9mm]

I just read more about the build; he is using the whip because it is one handed. He uses the other hand for a shield.

Whips are a light weapon with Reach that can trip... basicly it's there so he can trip when out side of grapple range, unforturnately because you don't threaten the whip's reach, the net result isn't worth the proficency.

[The Random NPC]

I always assume there is an implied, "instead of a spiked chain." Although, if he just wanted a one handed spiked chain, why he didn't just go with the Kusari-Gama is beyond me.

[balistafreak]

I always assume there is an implied, "instead of a spiked chain." Although, if he just wanted a one handed spiked chain, why he didn't just go with the Kusari-Gama is beyond me.

Two reasons for no spiked chain:

1. He's sick and tired of it. Most people are. :p

2. He did say this was an SRD only build, so that Kusari-Gama is right out.

So, if I understand correctly:

When I grapple a prone opponent, he gets -4 to AC. But this isn't relevant unless I choose to ATTACK him while grappling, not DEAL DAMAGE. If I ATTACK him, I suffer a -4 penalty to hit, which I suppose the prone penalty negates. He's also unable to use his Dexterity as armor.

If I DEAL DAMAGE, I can, as a monk, make an opposed grapple check. Him being prone here doesn't affect anything.

Take an example where I've successfully started grappling a fighter in full plate, with an AC of 18 and a touch AC of 10, and a +2 Strength modifier. If I ATTACK, I have to bust through AC 14 (prone) with my Unarmed Strike of -1 to hit... that's some pretty piss-poor odds. But if I want to DEAL DAMAGE I'll roll my grapple check of +7, which gets +4 from Improved grapple, against his much worse grapple check of +3.

Since I'm an unarmed monk, I'll always choose to deal damage in this case.

But say I'm wailing on some caster with an AC of 12, touch AC the same and no Strength modifier. If I ATTACK, I'll have a -1 attack against AC 8... which isn't bad. But if I DEAL DAMAGE, I'll then have a +7 grapple against his own 0, which is actually worse than the ATTACK.

... crap, this is complicated. I hate grappling rules.

[gallagher]

so it is ruled that one can grapple from a trip attempt... how would one go about that? does it go
-melee touch attack
-if successful, then trip
-if successful, then grapple attempt
-if successful, then one light weapon/natural/unarmed strike