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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Marking & Allies 4e

    Who counts as an ally? Is a mind controlled enemy an ally? Can you switch back and forth as to who is an ally or not?

    Consider the following:
    1. Fighter marks an enemy B.
    2. Wizard/Psion mind controls enemy archer into attacking enemy B.

    Now whether or not the other enemy would take the opportunity attack from using a range weapon in close combat. Consider, if the fighter gets a free basic attack for a marked enemy attacking an ally.
    If enemy B does defend itself to the range attack by making an opportunity attack. Does the fighter get a combat challenge free basic attack?

    If that's too silly, consider:
    1. Fighter marks archer A.
    2. Wizard/Psion mind controls archer A into attacking Enemy B.

    Does the fighter get free attacks vs the Archer?

    Just a thought experiment I was considering when looking over the domination powers.
    Last edited by HMS Invincible; 2010-02-20 at 05:54 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
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    Oracle_Hunter's Avatar

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    Default Re: Marking & Allies 4e

    AFAIK there's no ruling on how to designate Allies and Enemies. My houserule is that, unless a power says so, you can designate an entity as either an Ally or Enemy once per round - essentially, you can't change you designation until your next turn.

    However, there is a rule that you can't take Immediate Actions on your turn. So that keeps OA questions from getting too wacky.

    Now, your examples actually seem pretty straightforward.
    Quote Originally Posted by PHB 277
    DOMINATED
    ✦ You’re dazed.
    ✦ The dominating creature chooses your action. The only powers it can make you use are at-will powers.
    Nothing about changing Allies or Enemies - just on the Dominated Enemy's turn, the Dominatior gets to choose the Dazed creature's action.

    Likewise:
    Quote Originally Posted by Combat Challenge
    In addition, whenever a marked enemy that is adjacent to you shifts or makes an attack that does not include you, you can make a melee basic attack against that enemy as an immediate interrupt.
    Since the Marked Dominated creatures attacked someone who wasn't the Fighter, he can make a Combat Challenge attack. As for the OA - sure, everyone can take it, though the Enemy probably won't.
    Last edited by Oracle_Hunter; 2010-02-20 at 07:09 PM.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Marking & Allies 4e

    Dominated was changed in the last update: you aren't dazed while dominated. Instead, you can't do anything except a single at-will that your opponent chooses.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Marking & Allies 4e

    It's just funny how many attacks you can generate based off marking and OAs.

    At best, you can trigger an OA if you dominate someone to throw their weapon at another bad guy, which can trigger a combat challenge. So you can have 3 attacks all hurting bad guys off a single power. Anyway to improve this?

  5. - Top - End - #5
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    Gralamin's Avatar

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    Default Re: Marking & Allies 4e

    Quote Originally Posted by HMS Invincible View Post
    It's just funny how many attacks you can generate based off marking and OAs.

    At best, you can trigger an OA if you dominate someone to throw their weapon at another bad guy, which can trigger a combat challenge. So you can have 3 attacks all hurting bad guys off a single power. Anyway to improve this?
    No, Because You have a single OA per combatants turn, and a single immediate action per round.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: Marking & Allies 4e

    Quote Originally Posted by HMS Invincible View Post
    Who counts as an ally? Is a mind controlled enemy an ally? Can you switch back and forth as to who is an ally or not?
    The best rule of thumb is: "Willing people of your choice." And determining that on an effect by effect basis. As soon as one side chooses not to be friendly there is no alliance, for the particular effect in question.


    Now whether or not the other enemy would take the opportunity attack from using a range weapon in close combat. Consider, if the fighter gets a free basic attack for a marked enemy attacking an ally.
    Why do you not provoke opportunity attacks from your friends? Now, that is the wrong question. You do provoke. Hopefully, your friends are not inclined to take the opportunity you provide.

    So, of course, poor enemy B would get whacked.

    Sometimes common sense is really helpful.


    If enemy B does defend itself to the range attack by making an opportunity attack. Does the fighter get a combat challenge free basic attack?
    Yes, for the same reasons.

    The fighter might not be able to this, if the enemy was not marked before the ranged attack (i.e. if the opportunity was the marking incident). Then, the point of time where one checks for the Combat Challenge attacks would have passed.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Gralamin's Avatar

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    Default Re: Marking & Allies 4e

    Quote Originally Posted by 1of3 View Post
    The best rule of thumb is: "Willing people of your choice."
    Also of note is, by RAW, you cannot be your own Ally. And that, by RAW, an enemy is anyone who is not your friend. So you are your own enemy.

    Thats just following stupid RAW though.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Marking & Allies 4e

    Quote Originally Posted by Gralamin View Post
    No, Because You have a single OA per combatants turn, and a single immediate action per round.
    Wow, apparently our GM has house-ruled that. Cuz our sword-mage made an opportunity attack and an aegis trigger attack. Or is this kosher via RAW? In other words, is an OA an immediate action?
    Last edited by HMS Invincible; 2010-02-21 at 05:36 AM.

  9. - Top - End - #9
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    Gralamin's Avatar

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    Default Re: Marking & Allies 4e

    Quote Originally Posted by HMS Invincible View Post
    Wow, apparently our GM has house-ruled that. Cuz our sword-mage made an opportunity attack and an aegis trigger attack. Or is this kosher via RAW? In other words, is an OA an immediate action?
    An OA is separate from an Immediate Action. That is why you can have an OA per turn, but an immediate action per round.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Marking & Allies 4e

    Quote Originally Posted by Gralamin View Post
    Also of note is, by RAW, you cannot be your own Ally. And that, by RAW, an enemy is anyone who is not your friend. So you are your own enemy.

    Thats just following stupid RAW though.
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