Help with Rogue build?

[Tanis HalfElven]

Hey all, just needing any advice on a rogue melee build I'm making for 3.5/Pathfinder. So far I'm a githzerai barbarian 1/ rogue 1, intending to buyout my LA (which is +1 for pathfinder) next lvl. I took barb 1 for the lion totem alt. class feature from CChamp. which gives the pounce ability. The theme is charge with TWF.

allowed books are all complete, core, xph, mm1-5, dmg, BoED, BoVD, ToB, Planar Handbook

FEATS:
TWF tree
Weapon Finesse
Shadowblade (ToB)
Neraph Charge (Planar HB)
Staggering Strike (CScoundrel)
??? Not sure what else would be good, any advice?

BUILD
Barb 1/Rogue 3/Swordsage 1/Rogue 4/Bloodclaw Master 2/Swordsage 2/Uncanny Trickster 3/???

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers.

[Redpieper]

Craven?
Otherwise there's a whole load of ambush feats in complete scoundrel which might warrant a look at.

[Tanis HalfElven]

Yeh, Craven's the best sneak attack feat, but no world-specific books, ie. Forgotten Realms, Eberron etc.

ambush feats are ok, but giving up sneak attack is kinda the opposite of what i was after.

thanks, tho

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Toss in a few dips that will give you more sneak attack. Things like Nightsong Enforcer, Assassin, Spellthief... that kind of thing. A few 1 level dips can impressively increase your SA damage.

Also, don't forget wands of Gravestrike/Golemstrike/Vinestrike... just in case.

[Temotei]

The world shall end.

The topic title includes "rogue" spelled right. BLASPHEMY!

[Tanis HalfElven]

Nightsong Enforcer's pretty good, but unless it's full BAB, my BAB is like, +6 at 10th lvl already! That's why i took 2 lvls of BCMaster to get rid of TWF penalties.

In pathfinder you can sneak attack anything that's not incorporeal, but thanks for the idea

i'm hoping to end the world with this build, any ideas to make that a reality?

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Nightsong Enforcer's pretty good, but unless it's full BAB, my BAB is like, +6 at 10th lvl already! That's why i took 2 lvls of BCMaster to get rid of TWF penalties.

In pathfinder you can sneak attack anything that's not incorporeal, but thanks for the idea

i'm hoping to end the world with this build, any ideas to make that a reality?

Nightsong Enforcer is a full BAB class, so is Assassin.

I assume the Swordsage is for Pouncing Strike and Assassin's Stance? Very nice dip there, although you have one too many Swordsage levels

[Tanis HalfElven]

Yeh, NSEnforcer a possibility. Assassin got nerfed in PF tho- no spells, WTF!

Sorry, if my build description's confusing, 1 lvl of SSage to get pre-req's for BCMaster, and 2nd lvl to get Wis bns to AC and Assassin's Stance.

Anyone know of any other cool feats/PrC's?

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Yeh, NSEnforcer a possibility. Assassin got nerfed in PF tho- no spells, WTF!

Sorry, if my build description's confusing, 1 lvl of SSage to get pre-req's for BCMaster, and 2nd lvl to get Wis bns to AC and Assassin's Stance.

Anyone know of any other cool feats/PrC's?

For your build? Spells are overrated. Sneak Attack and BAB are what you are looking for here. You're wanting one-level dip to maximize BAB and SA bonuses.

You've got three levels of SSage in your build... level 5 then 12 and 13. You only need 2.

[Tanis HalfElven]

Agreed, I stuffed my desc. of build, it is as follows:

Barb 1/Rogue 3/Swordsage 1/Rogue 4/Bloodclaw Master 2/Swordsage 1/Uncanny Trickster 3/

The only spell I really wanted was greater invis. *shrugs* oh well.

anything else i should know?

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Agreed, I stuffed my desc. of build, it is as follows:

Barb 1/Rogue 3/Swordsage 1/Rogue 4/Bloodclaw Master 2/Swordsage 1/Uncanny Trickster 3/

The only spell I really wanted was greater invis. *shrugs* oh well.

anything else i should know?

Use Magic Device. Now you have greater invis.

Right now, you have effectively 9 levels of Rogue for a total of 5d6 sneak attack. +2d6 from Assassin's Stance. Also, pick up, as your first stance, Island of Blades. It lets you flank much easier.

Shadow Blade is the feat for you, my friend. It lets you completely dump STR entirely, when combined with Weapon Finesse. And let's be honest, when are you not going to be using Shadow Hand weapons? Duo-wield Shortswords and win.

Heck, you can even go Strongheart Halfling for this. With Shadow Blade, you dump STR, meaning your STR is a 6. This lets you pump your Dex. You can easily have a 26-30 depending on toys. This stacks up hugely.

Also, see if a party member is willing to use Greater Magic Weapon on your behalf. It is tasty good.

EDIT: If you are going for a dagger build, use Master Thrower. It promotes sneak attack, and you get to pick up Sneaky Shot, which lets you use a Slight of Hand vs their Sense Motive to make them flat-footed for your attacks. Then Greater Invis is not necessary

Also consider Invisible Blade. It's also fairly fun.

[Tanis HalfElven]

Cheers Shneekey, but i did write that i was picking Shadowblade, and no Forgotten Realms stuff.

UMD is a good stuff tho

i thought about Master Thrower but really i don't want to neglect my sneak attack.

my next rogue will prob. be a rogue/swashbuckler/invisible blade/swordsage but i'd need to go either elf or tiefling.

anyway for this build my int. sucks- maxing out dex, con and wis.

cheers for the input tho

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Cheers Shneekey, but i did write that i was picking Shadowblade, and no Forgotten Realms stuff.

UMD is a good stuff tho

i thought about Master Thrower but really i don't want to neglect my sneak attack.

my next rogue will prob. be a rogue/swashbuckler/invisible blade/swordsage but i'd need to go either elf or tiefling.

anyway for this build my int. sucks- maxing out dex, con and wis.

cheers for the input tho

Being able to apply full SA damage on every throw? Worth a one-level dip.

Swashbuckler sucks. Really, no point to it with a build like this.

[Tanis HalfElven]

I'll take another look.

agreed.

cheers dude.