Help with Pathfinder Archer

[Exarch]

Hi guys, I come seeking a little bit of assistance. I'm currently in a Pathfinder only game and had my Batmany (focusing in Enchanting though) Wizard clubbed to death by a raging barbarian and some druid's ice. 3-way fights are apparently not such a good thing when your DM has it in for you.


Anyway, I need to decide if I want to have my wizard Raised or roll a new character. I did some looking, and a ranged Fighter looks like it might be fun, but I'm a bit worried about the crunch. We currently have a Gish Wizard (going Eldritch Knight), a max Strength barbarian, a Cleric who can mix it up in melee well but mostly heals, and a rogue. It's a pretty high stat game and standard WBL, so most builds are available so long as they're Pathfinder only. The ranged character that I came up with is the following:

Fighter5
Str: 18 +2 (racial) = 20
Dex: 17 +1 (level 4) = 18
Con: 16
Int: 15
Wis: 9
Cha: 15

Feats: Point Blank Shot(1), Precise Shot(1), Deadly Aim(2), Weapon Focus: Comp Longbow (3), Weapon Specialization: Comp. Longbow (4), and Rapid Shot (5).

Items: Composite Longbow(5 Str) +1, Bracers of Archery, and a Cloak of Resistance +1.

This doesn't seem too bad, but I'm still wondering. My Attack Bonus, using both feats, is +9/+9 (+4 Dex +5 BAB +1 Focus +1 Class +1 BoA +1 Enhancement -4 Feats) and my damage is 1d8 +14/1d8 +14 (+5 Str, +4 Deadly Aim, +1 Class, +1 BoA, +1 Enhancement, +2 Specialization). Compared to the barbarian and our super-Gish, this seems subpar.

What are the Playgrounders thoughts on this build? Is it good? Is Arcane Archer better (the crunch doesn't make it seem so)? Would it be better to go Human (feat: Improved Initiative?) or Half Elf (bonuses against some spells that pillage me)? Would it be better to start with the higher Dex instead of Str, since bows don't give 1.5x Str? Thank you everyone for your help!

[subject42]

You may want to look at a ranged ranger. The Pathfinder version gets a bunch of new toys in addition to the old bonus feats. We have one in the game I'm currently running and she's doing really well.

[Mongoose87]

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/extras/commu...ide-to-rangers

Check out the Switch Hitter build. She is very nice.

As for race, I'd go with Human, for the feat.

[Critical]

Bard archer going into arcane archer is a thing to consider.

[Nero24200]

My thoughts are for power go human. Humans are generally a good race for anything, and that axiom is still the same in PF.

Also, don't let archers on paper fool you. They rarely have the damage out-put of melee characters, but since they can full-attack without moving they generally are more consistant with their damage.

[Tinydwarfman]

Actually there is one archer who will out-damage melee. The paladin archer. Add +10 damage to all of your damage rolls when smiting and it only gets better as you level.

[Ashiel]

Hi guys, I come seeking a little bit of assistance. I'm currently in a Pathfinder only game and had my Batmany (focusing in Enchanting though) Wizard clubbed to death by a raging barbarian and some druid's ice. 3-way fights are apparently not such a good thing when your DM has it in for you.


Anyway, I need to decide if I want to have my wizard Raised or roll a new character. I did some looking, and a ranged Fighter looks like it might be fun, but I'm a bit worried about the crunch. We currently have a Gish Wizard (going Eldritch Knight), a max Strength barbarian, a Cleric who can mix it up in melee well but mostly heals, and a rogue. It's a pretty high stat game and standard WBL, so most builds are available so long as they're Pathfinder only. The ranged character that I came up with is the following:

Fighter5
Str: 18 +2 (racial) = 20
Dex: 17 +1 (level 4) = 18
Con: 16
Int: 15
Wis: 9
Cha: 15

Feats: Point Blank Shot(1), Precise Shot(1), Deadly Aim(2), Weapon Focus: Comp Longbow (3), Weapon Specialization: Comp. Longbow (4), and Rapid Shot (5).

Items: Composite Longbow(5 Str) +1, Bracers of Archery, and a Cloak of Resistance +1.

This doesn't seem too bad, but I'm still wondering. My Attack Bonus, using both feats, is +9/+9 (+4 Dex +5 BAB +1 Focus +1 Class +1 BoA +1 Enhancement -4 Feats) and my damage is 1d8 +14/1d8 +14 (+5 Str, +4 Deadly Aim, +1 Class, +1 BoA, +1 Enhancement, +2 Specialization). Compared to the barbarian and our super-Gish, this seems subpar.

What are the Playgrounders thoughts on this build? Is it good? Is Arcane Archer better (the crunch doesn't make it seem so)? Would it be better to go Human (feat: Improved Initiative?) or Half Elf (bonuses against some spells that pillage me)? Would it be better to start with the higher Dex instead of Str, since bows don't give 1.5x Str? Thank you everyone for your help!

It looks like you're really cooking with gas to me. You have an average of 18 damage on two attacks with a solid bonus to hit. Your feats allow you to fire into melee. You should seek (no pun intended) the seeking enchantment for your bow when possible (ignores concealment!). Also, any sort of effect that gives you an extra attack will be golden. Some boots of speed, or the party's caster including you in a haste spell will drastically improve your damage output (gaining a +10/+10/+10 attack routine with an average of 18 damage per shot, and you can target anyone within range).

You can also be a fairly effective anti-spellcaster. Your minimum damage exceeds the damage reduction granted by Protection from Arrows, and ready + full attack against a caster will likely give them a bad day.

Finally, make use of the fact you're an archer. A golf bag of arrows will suite you well. You can spend a little money here and there to buy a few X-bane arrows, or a few ghost touch arrows, or silver, cold iron, and adamantine arrows. You can get around the damage reductions of almost anything by prepping a few basics ahead of time. Also, greater magic weapon is your friend.

An oil (potion) of flame arrow poured over your arrows makes them all flaming for a while (+1d6 fire damage on each shot) which pushes damage further. Also, sniping is an option (-1 perception penalty for every 10ft IIRC, which means at 100ft away, you're attacking with no penalties and your targets have a -10 penalty to see where you are); with ranks in stealth, you can have some fun with this method too.

If your DM allows 3.x material; I would suggest the energy bow web enhancement would be a good option (provides unlimited force-arrows, scales with your strength, is a +2 composite bow, and you can shoot other arrows with it too).

EDIT: Your biggest advantage as an archer is the fact you can almost always full attack; and take advantage of interesting tactical situations. You can hang back and shoot whomever needs shooting, move 5ft each round if you want, and you can draw a greatsword and guard the wizards if someone breaks front-lines and gets to you and your caster buddies.

[reefwood]

I'm enjoying this thread. Lots of good ideas that I can implement as DM :)

You can also be a fairly effective anti-spellcaster. Your minimum damage exceeds the damage reduction granted by Protection from Arrows, and ready + full attack against a caster will likely give them a bad day.

Although, I don't think anyone can Ready a Full Attack because a Full Attack is a Full-Round Action and you can only Ready a Standard, Move, Swift, or Free Action.

[Exarch]

Thanks for all of the suggestions so far!

To Mongoose: I checked that out and it looked good, but we already have 2.5 melee beef cakes. Even with this fighter, I was planning on taking a greatsword in the event that someone attacks from the back or is able to break through melee.

To Ashiel: Good to hear that I'm pretty much as optimised as possible. Only thing is, I don't have much money left over with my current gear. Should I drop the Cloak of Resistance +1 in favor of some magic arrows?

In all actuality, I think I'm better off sticking to the wizard, as I'm the only one with access to Haste and other fun stuff (other Wiz is 1Fgt/4Wiz and the cleric is Cle5). We're going to be fighting demons pretty soon, so that's even more of a reason to stick with wizard (right?).

[Ravens_cry]

Actually there is one archer who will out-damage melee. The paladin archer. Add +10 damage to all of your damage rolls when smiting and it only gets better as you level.

Yeah, I've always wanted to try that. Sure, you may get the feats a bit later then the ranger, but you still get em'. And it's a nice way to mix up the Paladin archetype.

[Paul H]

Hi

Human Paladins make good Archers, especially with that Smite thing going......
Bonuses to hit/damage plus defelection bonus to AC! And overcomes ALL DR! yay.....

You also might consider Fighter at 9th level to take both Improved Crit & Crit Focus, to set you up for Bleeding Crit at 11th. Note that DC 15 Heal check or magical healing required to stop the 2D6 bleed/rnd, so Undead have a really bad time with it. (They can be critted now).

Oh - and Paladins can now make weapon of choice magical instead of summoning a steed if they want......... (+1 total bonus at lvl 5, +2 at 8th, +3 at 11th, etc). So can have +1 Flaming bow at 8th lvl.

Cheers
Paul H