Wise Humanoid Races

[Raistlin1040]

So, here's what I'm looking for for my next Cleric.

Humanoid, specifically human-looking (Elven-looking would be okay, Dwarf or Orc or whatever, not so much)
No LA
Fluff that points to a sheltered way of life (though that can be written by the DM and myself)
Bonus to Wisdom is a bonus
Penalty to Charisma is also a bonus.

Right now, I'm leaning towards Illumian, from RoD, but other suggestions are appreciated.

[Dr.Epic]

Penalty to Charisma is also a bonus.

Really? A cleric that WANTS a minus to cha? I'm sorry if I don't fully understand why you want to do this, but, well, that's an ability as a cleric you should want to be high. Again, sorry if I sound kind of like a jerk but I am a munchkin and always try to powergame which ends up hurting my character's character.

As for races maybe that one planetouched (forget the name) but again it has +2 to cha so maybe not such a good idea.

[Mystic Muse]

That'd be Aasimar.

I think lesser Aasimar doesn't have the charisma bonus but I lost the page so I'm probably wrong.

[Raistlin1040]

Really? A cleric that WANTS a minus to cha? I'm sorry if I don't fully understand why you want to do this, but, well, that's an ability as a cleric you should want to be high. Again, sorry if I sound kind of like a jerk but I am a munchkin and always try to powergame which ends up hurting my character's character.

As for races maybe that one planetouched (forget the name) but again it has +2 to cha so maybe not such a good idea.

It's a Roleplaying thing. Luckily enough, my party, with another Cleric and a Paladin, has had very little trouble with Undead in the past.

[Optimystik]

That'd be Aasimar.

I think lesser Aasimar doesn't have the charisma bonus but I lost the page so I'm probably wrong.

Actually, they still have it, making them ridiculously good clerics.

[Soranar]

really old kobold with dragonwrought feat

+3 to all mental stats

[Dragero]

really old kobold with dragonwrought feat

+3 to all mental stats

Including charisma......

Ilumian would be the best I can thinknof.....

[Mystic Muse]

Okay, here's a very simple solution.

Ask your DM to have a Charisma penalty instead of Bonus. No DM in their right mind will refuse.

[tyckspoon]

It's a Roleplaying thing. Luckily enough, my party, with another Cleric and a Paladin, has had very little trouble with Undead in the past.

How are you doing stat generation? If it's point-buy, you can simply assign no points to or even sell-down your Charisma (if method in play allows) and having a bonus will translate into just being average. If you actually do want an absolute stat penalty in Charisma, you're probably best off asking your DM if you can trade it down in some fashion anyway. Either take value from Charisma to raise another stat that better fits your character image, or see if you can get a feat out of it with the Pathetic (Charisma) flaw.

[Steveotep]

Night Elf gets bonus Wisdom, penalty Charisma, and until recently were isolated from other races.

They are from the d20 World of Warcraft RPG.

[Dr.Epic]

It's a Roleplaying thing. Luckily enough, my party, with another Cleric and a Paladin, has had very little trouble with Undead in the past.

Yes I realize it's a roleplaying thing. I as a gamer just tend to put muchkining before roleplaying. I like kicking ass and taking names, although since their NPCs the only names I get are along the lines of orc barbarian #247 or red dragon end boss #12.

[Superglucose]

Yes I realize it's a roleplaying thing. I as a gamer just tend to put muchkining before roleplaying. I like kicking ass and taking names, although since their NPCs the only names I get are along the lines of orc barbarian #247 or red dragon end boss #12.

Which fallacy is this again? The one about powergaming and roleplaying being mutually exclusive?

[erikun]

Which fallacy is this again? The one about powergaming and roleplaying being mutually exclusive?

Absolutely none.

It's a fallacy to say that powergaming implies a lack of roleplaying. It is not a fallacy to enjoy powergaming to the exclusion of roleplaying, nor is it a fallacy to prefer powergaming to roleplaying. It's a game, after all - the people playing should be having fun.

[Thurbane]

Yeah, not really any sort of fallacy when someone says they prefer munchkining to roleplaying - it's merely a statement of play style preference.

To the OP - you could always take a flaw (UA): Pathetic (Charisma). Take a -2 to Charisma, in exchange for an extra feat.

[Dr.Epic]

Which fallacy is this again? The one about powergaming and roleplaying being mutually exclusive?

Most of my character's personalities are jokes (I can't write good backstories) so I focus more on being an effect killing/adventuring machine.

[Dr Bwaa]

Which fallacy is this again? The one about powergaming and roleplaying being mutually exclusive?

You are referring to the oft-cited Stormwind Fallacy. That link is in danger of being necromantic if you post on it, but it has a ton of discussion on that particularly controversial topic (of when "fallacy" is applicable or not). I tend to think that it's hugely over-invoked, but I guess that's hardly surprising. Aaaaanyway...

On topic, I'd say Illumian Cloistered Cleric is probably a good bet. Or Lesser Aasimar with CHA dumped (or if your DM is crazy, see if he'll let you make Lesser Aasimar have -2 CHA and +4 WIS instead )

[Runestar]

If you are not going DMM:persist, cha is worthless (undead generally have too much HD to be able to turn anyways). I know my dwarf cleric got by just fine with 6 cha.

[FMArthur]

Wait, hold down a second, OP. You think Turn Undead is for turning undead?

[HunterOfJello]

Lesser Aasimar is what you're looking for


or a regular Aasimar is great too if you can do the LA buyoff from UA.

[Darrin]

Humanoid, specifically human-looking (Elven-looking would be okay, Dwarf or Orc or whatever, not so much)
No LA
Fluff that points to a sheltered way of life (though that can be written by the DM and myself)
Bonus to Wisdom is a bonus
Penalty to Charisma is also a bonus.

There aren't a lot of +2 Wis races. Lesser Aasimar (PGtF) is probably the closest to what you're looking for. They have a Charisma bonus, but you can still make it your dump stat if need be. Essentially the same as a standard Aasimar, except they aren't outsiders, they have the humanoid type with the planetouched subtype.

There's another way to play an Aasimar with no LA. This article on the WotC website breaks the Aasimar into a slightly weaker version with one "racial class level" to represent whatever abilities make them +1 LA. You can either take that racial class level later, or just not take it at all. Unfortunately, this version of the Aasimar starts with +2 Cha instead of +2 Wis, so you'd have to take the racial class level to get the Wisdom bonus.

Buomman from the Planar Handbook has +2 Wis, -2 Cha, but they have this weird language/singing restriction... you can get rid of it with Dragonborn of Bahumat, though.

Tortle is a bit more obscure. Printed in Dragon Magazine #315. +2 Con, +2 Wis, -2 Dex, -2 Cha. +3 natural armor, favored class cleric. Yes, they are turtle/human hybrid-thingies. Yes, you will get TMNT jokes.

[Karsh]

There's another way to play an Aasimar with no LA. This article on the WotC website breaks the Aasimar into a slightly weaker version with one "racial class level" to represent whatever abilities make them +1 LA. You can either take that racial class level later, or just not take it at all. Unfortunately, this version of the Aasimar starts with +2 Cha instead of +2 Wis, so you'd have to take the racial class level to get the Wisdom bonus

Not true. Racial advancement classes must be completed before you can take class levels.

[Superglucose]

"Again, sorry if I sound kind of like a jerk but I am a munchkin and always try to powergame which ends up hurting my character's character."

That was the one I was intending to reference.

OP: See if you can get Half-Vistani (Ravenloft).

[JaronK]

What about Buommans from Planar Handbook? +2 Wis, -2 Cha, and never speak (but there's a feat they can take so they can cast normally). Also, they look like humans.

JaronK

[Darrin]

Not true. Racial advancement classes must be completed before you can take class levels.

No, only Monster Class Levels from Savage Species work that way. Savage Progression's Template/Racial Class Levels work differently, as explained by this article:

"Characters are not required to complete all the levels of a given template class in uninterrupted succession. For example, a character who takes a level of wereboar could then take a level of fighter and a level of rogue (or any other combination of other class levels) before taking another level of wereboar."

[Thurbane]

What about Buommans from Planar Handbook? +2 Wis, -2 Cha, and never speak (but there's a feat they can take so they can cast normally). Also, they look like humans.

JaronK

Good call!

[magic9mushroom]

Tortle and Lesser Aasimar are the only +0 LA +Wis humanoid races that I or Crystalkeep know. No sheltered fluff IIRC, and Tortles unsurprisingly look like Turtles.

There is Anthropomorphic Bat, with +6 Wis and -2 Cha, but that's not Humanoid.

[Riffington]

For RP, you usually don't actually want a +Cha or -Cha race. What you usually want is to have a higher or lower Cha than an average member of your race.

/but I don't know your exact situation.

[Harperfan7]

The blue monkeys from oriental handbook.

(Don't bother)

[Raistlin1040]

For RP, you usually don't actually want a +Cha or -Cha race. What you usually want is to have a higher or lower Cha than an average member of your race.

/but I don't know your exact situation.

Well, in this situation, his primary dealings would be with humans, so a negative charisma mod would make him suitably awkward. Lesser Aasimar could work, I suppose, but I'm likely to stick with Illumian. For those curious, my Cleric (Who was correctly guessed to be Cloistered), was a cleric of Hieroneus who was deemed the most pious cleric in a large human city. Hearing of this, and noticing the fairly high level (9th at start), the Devil Lords organized a wager to try and see who could cause him to lose his faith. At the campaign's beginning, Mammon, lord of the 3rd layer, caused him to put his lust above his faith, and he fell to LN. He then considers himself damned for eternity, and is haunted by the remaining Devil Lords and the pious part of his subconcious.

[Belobog]

Tortle and Lesser Aasimar are the only +0 LA +Wis humanoid races that I or Crystalkeep know. No sheltered fluff IIRC, and Tortles unsurprisingly look like Turtles.

There is Anthropomorphic Bat, with +6 Wis and -2 Cha, but that's not Humanoid.

Anthro Bat is also Int 11, as all Anthro Animals are. Least, if I'm recalling Savage Species right.