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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Is This Puzzle Workable?

    If you're in my game and have managed to figure out my screen name, please vacate the premises.
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    Okay. As a break from the hack/slash fest we've had the last couple of weeks in my Eberron campaign, I'm putting in a Mastermind-style puzzle for my group to chew on. Normally, it's rare for my games to test player knowledge instead of character knowledge this way, but I wanted a change of pace, and something that could engage those players who are a bit less outspoken in the roleplay department. Ideally, this occupies them enjoyably for 15 - 30 minutes. As an aside, the players are between 14 - 18 years old, and there are as many as 14 there any given week.

    Unfortunately, I find these puzzles fiendishly difficult to judge independently, because I, as creator, can clearly see the solution. I cannot readily tell if I've given enough information, too much information, or insufficient information to solve the puzzle. For this reason, I come to you good, people of GitP, to read my puzzle and see if it is workable as is, needs more clues, or is laughably easy.

    I'm putting the puzzle in a spoiler, below. If you think you have the correct answer, please spoiler that. If there's a problem with too little or too much info, there's no need to use spoilers to tell me I screwed up.

    Spoiler
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    Before you is a sealed door of a brightly polished metal. It is perfectly smooth and shows no handles, buttons, or other opening mechanisms. If checked, it faintly radiates abjuration and conjuration magics. In a small alcove to the left of the door are 8 black iron figurines, each about the height of a small human palm, with labels identifying them stamped in the metal, arranged alphabetically: a buzzard, an eagle, a falcon, a harrier, a hawk, an osprey, an owl, and a vulture. When a light is brought close to the alcove, eight colored circles are visible on the floor in front of it. In left-to-right order, they are: pink, red, purple, violet, orange, blue, green, and yellow. The light catches something glittering on the floor; words, in the Riedran language, have been polished into the stone. The neat, block script says,

    "Herein lies the key.

    The hawk does not go on the purple or yellow circle.

    The falcon goes between the hawk and the eagle.

    The osprey and vulture are side by side.

    The vulture does not sit on the violet or the green circle.

    The eagle sits neither on the blue nor orange circle.

    The owl sits beside the vulture, and not on the green circle.

    The harrier has only one neighbor and is not by the osprey or the eagle.

    The buzzard does not occupy the pink or red circle."


    EDIT: multiple solutions were not intended.
    Last edited by Amphetryon; 2010-04-03 at 06:13 AM.
    Iron Chef in the Playground veteran since Round IV. Play as me!


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  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Elfin's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    While I haven't yet actually tried to solve the puzzle (will do it in a minute), this doesn't seem like it would be too hard, merely being a logic puzzle and not a riddle of some sort.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Titan in the Playground
     
    PersonMan's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    It'd probably require drawings and some time, but it seems workable. The problem with puzzles is if there is a single solution that is completely random. A puzzle like this should do fine.

    ...Anyways, if they're COMPLETELY stumped, they can just "force" the puzzle by trying every possible combination.
    Not Person_Man, don't thank me for things he did.

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  4. - Top - End - #4
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Malificus's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    This seems like it could have multiple correct answers. If they find one other than what you think it should be, it will work, right?



    also, I got:

    Spoiler
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    pink - Harrier
    red - Owl
    purple - Vulture
    violet - Osprey
    orange - Hawk
    blue - Falcon
    green - Eagle
    yellow - Buzzard

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Elfin's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Ok; so far I've gotten:
    Spoiler
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    Eagle:Red; Falcon:Purple; Owl:Orange; Vulture:Blue; and Osprey:Green.

    However, the clues don't provide any way to decide
    Spoiler
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    whether the harrier goes on the pink and the buzzard on the yellow,
    or vice versa.

    Edit: Looks like this has multiple solutions, or I messed up somehow...
    Last edited by Elfin; 2010-04-02 at 05:06 PM.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    I got: (seems like two possible answers)

    Spoiler
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    pink - Hawk
    red - Falcon
    purple - Eagle
    violet - Osprey
    orange - Vulture
    blue - Owl
    green - Buzzard
    yellow - Harrier
    Last edited by Eldonauran; 2010-04-02 at 05:08 PM.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Well, looks like I screwed up a bit, then. I intended only one correct answer. OP edited to try to fix that.
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  8. - Top - End - #8
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Heliomance's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Okay, trying to run the clues through a logic grid, and I've got stuck before finding any definite answers. I haven't placed any of the birds for sure, and I'm pretty sure I've eked all the possible meaning from the clues.
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  9. - Top - End - #9
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Lord Vukodlak's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    I did a mastermind puzzle to open a door once, you had so many guesses failure resulted in the guardians being summoned [who granted no xp upon defeat], then the password reset.

    I just used the mastermind game on my iphone, each color represented a school of magic from illusion to universal.[for a total of 8] I simply entered the combination's as they spoke them then then told them the results

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Starbuck_II's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Quote Originally Posted by Amphetryon View Post

    Spoiler
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    Before you is a sealed door of a brightly polished metal. It is perfectly smooth and shows no handles, buttons, or other opening mechanisms. If checked, it faintly radiates abjuration and conjuration magics. In a small alcove to the left of the door are 8 black iron figurines, each about the height of a small human palm, with labels identifying them stamped in the metal, arranged alphabetically: a buzzard, an eagle, a falcon, a harrier, a hawk, an osprey, an owl, and a vulture. When a light is brought close to the alcove, eight colored circles are visible on the floor in front of it. In left-to-right order, they are: pink, red, purple, violet, orange, blue, green, and yellow. The light catches something glittering on the floor; words, in the Riedran language, have been polished into the stone. The neat, block script says,

    "Herein lies the key.

    The hawk does not go on the orange or yellow circle.

    The falcon goes between the hawk and the eagle.

    The osprey and vulture are side by side.

    The vulture does not sit on the violet or the green circle.

    The eagle sits neither on the pink nor blue circle.

    The owl sits beside the vulture, and not on the green circle.

    The harrier has only one neighbor.

    The buzzard does not occupy the blue or red circle."


    EDIT: multiple solutions were not intended.
    I got-
    Spoiler
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    pink - Hawk
    red - Falcon
    purple - Eagle
    violet - Osprey
    orange - Vulture
    blue - Owl
    green - Buzzard
    yellow - Harrier

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldonauran View Post
    I got: (seems like two possible answers)

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    pink - Hawk
    red - Falcon
    purple - Eagle
    violet - Osprey
    orange - Vulture
    blue - Owl
    green - Buzzard
    yellow - Harrier
    Even with the edit, this placement is still a correct solution.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Lord Vukodlak's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Looking at this puzzle a bit more, you use the exact same colors that are on my Crack the Code game on my calculator.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    I just used standard rainbow colors.

    A second edit has been made to eliminate one unintended 'right' solution.
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  14. - Top - End - #14
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    Darkmatter's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    I don't know how well this type of puzzle will work in a game the size you're thinking about. I used a similar puzzle once with my group of 4 (they had to replicate a magical ritual based on tattered remnants of a spellbook and random laboratory notes). Mine was more complex - it used three elements rather than two, but there were fewer total groupings and I made sure to give more clues than were necessary to specify a unique solution. Even though my group includes three doctoral students in physical chemistry (so pretty good with logical thinking), it still took about 30-45 minutes for them to figure out, in large part because this sort of puzzle does not lend itself well to group solving. The puzzle wound up being a success because the two players not really interested in solving the puzzle got to run around collecting the reagents necessary to complete the ritual, while the two players who were interested raced to see who could get it done first. Otherwise, there would have been a couple of very bored players for that half hour. I could see this problem writ large for a group as massive as yours.

    Also, you might want to think about renaming bits of your puzzle for clarity... a harrier is a type of hawk, violet is a shade of purple, and "buzzard" is primarily a colloquialism for any number of raptors, including vultures, hawks, and eagles.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Here's what I got:
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    Pink: not buzzard
    Red: not harrier, not buzzard
    Purple: not harrier
    Violet: not vulture, not harrier
    Orange: not hawk, not harrier, not eagle
    Blue: not eagle, not harrier
    Green: not vulture, not owl, not harrier
    Yellow: not hawk, not owl, not osprey

    owl, vulture, osprey or osprey, vulture owl must be in sequence
    hawk, falcon, eagle, or eagle, falcon, hawk must be in sequence
    That leaves only harrier and buzzard which can go wherever allowed above

    You may want to double check my work, but the same line of logic is still usable. I think you could quickly put together several solutions from what I have above. Or at least 4-8 I think. Try it out. EDIT: I think they'll get it in 5-20 minutes because of this. Which is fine, I suppose. After all this is Dungeons and Dragons not Puzzles and Pencils. Varying things can be fun but changing a large part of a gaming session into a $3 puzzle book session is less fun.

    EDIT #2: Adjusted for non-eagle orange-ness. Which removes maybe 1 possibility.
    Last edited by ericgrau; 2010-04-02 at 10:25 PM.
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  16. - Top - End - #16
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Did you intend to tell us that the eagle is not on blue twice? That might have been a typo that could help reduce the number of solutions.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkmatter View Post
    I don't know how well this type of puzzle will work in a game the size you're thinking about. <snip> Otherwise, there would have been a couple of very bored players for that half hour. I could see this problem writ large for a group as massive as yours.

    Also, you might want to think about renaming bits of your puzzle for clarity... a harrier is a type of hawk, violet is a shade of purple, and "buzzard" is primarily a colloquialism for any number of raptors, including vultures, hawks, and eagles.
    For the first part: A group this size has the risk of bored players regardless of the scenario, including combat. The number of players involved makes combat take longer than usual and plays havoc with challenge ratings, and RP interactions will almost per force exclude at least a couple of people. As indicated, I'm adding this in as a change of pace, hoping to get those who are not as gungho for combat more involved in the game for at least this little bit. If you have a solution that doesn't involve combat, RP, or puzzles that can involve everyone - since those all run into boredom potential - please, share.

    For the second part: Violet and purple are distinct colors within the spectrum, according to the art professor at college and the art students in the group, so they should have no difficulties there. Similarly, the birds of prey were selected specifically as distinct varieties. Naturally, some colloquialisms can alter specific meanings within some communities, but that's going to be the case with any group of 8 birds of prey represented only by general, non scientific, species differentiation. Using the scientific Latin terms is, for me and this group, an unnecessary intrusion of the 'real world' into the verisimilitude of the game. If you are aware of 8 separate and distinct birds of prey that are specific to Eberron, please let me know which pages to search so I can make this more exacting.

    EDIT: Fixed fixed the the redundant redundant listing listing.
    Last edited by Amphetryon; 2010-04-02 at 07:03 PM.
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  18. - Top - End - #18
    Troll in the Playground
     
    HalflingRogueGuy

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Of course, my answer was "Ancient Mountain Hammer on the door." Since such tools exist, a door alone is really not a good obstacle. More useful would be if the solution to this puzzle revealed some specific necessary information, such as which of the treasures is actually the necessary artifact or something.

    JaronK

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    I wrote a program to brute force all solutions, and found 17 for the first example. With the edit, it only finds these 12.
    I'm afraid you need more conditions to only allow one option.

    Spoiler
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    These solutions are for this version of the problem
    Spoiler
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    The hawk does not go on the orange or yellow circle.

    The falcon goes between the hawk and the eagle.

    The osprey and vulture are side by side.

    The vulture does not sit on the violet or the green circle.

    The eagle sits neither on the blue nor orange circle.

    The owl sits beside the vulture, and not on the green circle.

    The harrier has only one neighbor.

    The buzzard does not occupy the pink or red circle."


    Solution 1:
    Eagle on Pink
    Falcon on Red
    Hawk on Purple
    Buzzard on Violet
    Owl on Orange
    Vulture on Blue
    Osprey on Green
    Harrier on Yellow

    Solution 2:
    Eagle on Pink
    Falcon on Red
    Hawk on Purple
    Osprey on Violet
    Vulture on Orange
    Owl on Blue
    Buzzard on Green
    Harrier on Yellow

    Solution 3:
    Eagle on Pink
    Falcon on Red
    Hawk on Purple
    Owl on Violet
    Vulture on Orange
    Osprey on Blue
    Buzzard on Green
    Harrier on Yellow

    Solution 4:
    Harrier on Pink
    Eagle on Red
    Falcon on Purple
    Hawk on Violet
    Owl on Orange
    Vulture on Blue
    Osprey on Green
    Buzzard on Yellow

    Solution 5:
    Harrier on Pink
    Hawk on Red
    Falcon on Purple
    Eagle on Violet
    Owl on Orange
    Vulture on Blue
    Osprey on Green
    Buzzard on Yellow

    Solution 6:
    Harrier on Pink
    Osprey on Red
    Vulture on Purple
    Owl on Violet
    Buzzard on Orange
    Hawk on Blue
    Falcon on Green
    Eagle on Yellow

    Solution 7:
    Harrier on Pink
    Owl on Red
    Vulture on Purple
    Osprey on Violet
    Buzzard on Orange
    Hawk on Blue
    Falcon on Green
    Eagle on Yellow

    Solution 8:
    Hawk on Pink
    Falcon on Red
    Eagle on Purple
    Buzzard on Violet
    Owl on Orange
    Vulture on Blue
    Osprey on Green
    Harrier on Yellow

    Solution 9:
    Hawk on Pink
    Falcon on Red
    Eagle on Purple
    Osprey on Violet
    Vulture on Orange
    Owl on Blue
    Buzzard on Green
    Harrier on Yellow

    Solution 10:
    Hawk on Pink
    Falcon on Red
    Eagle on Purple
    Owl on Violet
    Vulture on Orange
    Osprey on Blue
    Buzzard on Green
    Harrier on Yellow

    Solution 11:
    Osprey on Pink
    Vulture on Red
    Owl on Purple
    Eagle on Violet
    Falcon on Orange
    Hawk on Blue
    Buzzard on Green
    Harrier on Yellow

    Solution 12:
    Owl on Pink
    Vulture on Red
    Osprey on Purple
    Eagle on Violet
    Falcon on Orange
    Hawk on Blue
    Buzzard on Green
    Harrier on Yellow


    Edit: Adding one or more restrictions that force harrier to go on Pink reduces the number of solutions to 4 though (Solutions 4 to 7).
    Edit2: And I might have some errors in my code, only checked that a few of them actually worked myself
    Last edited by Accersitus; 2010-04-02 at 07:28 PM.

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  20. - Top - End - #20
    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Quote Originally Posted by Amphetryon View Post
    Well, looks like I screwed up a bit, then. I intended only one correct answer. OP edited to try to fix that.
    I don't know what you changed, but there are still more than one solution

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Quote Originally Posted by JaronK View Post
    Of course, my answer was "Ancient Mountain Hammer on the door." Since such tools exist, a door alone is really not a good obstacle. More useful would be if the solution to this puzzle revealed some specific necessary information, such as which of the treasures is actually the necessary artifact or something.

    JaronK
    I have no doubt you can pull this 7th level maneuver off at 2nd level, JaronK, but could you please explain how it's done?

    Not every group chooses to simply bypass the puzzles as their first response, would be my second thought. I never said whether the puzzle was relevant to the adventure's overall plot, because that information isn't actually needed to figure out the puzzle itself. It is, by the way. The thread is for trying to boil the puzzle down into a single viable solution to the puzzle - rather than a solution avoiding it.
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  22. - Top - End - #22
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    Math_Mage's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    For starters, "the eagle sits on neither the blue nor blue circle" is redundant.

    In the puzzle's current incarnation, there are many possible solutions. The base specifications are:
    1. Harrier on an end;
    2. Hawk-Falcon-Eagle, or vice versa;
    3. Owl-Vulture-Osprey, or vice versa.

    So, we have four 'pieces' to arrange: the harrier, the falcon group, the vulture group, and the buzzard. The total number of combinations before color rulings is 48: 24 possible orderings of four pieces, minus 12 where the harrier is not on the end, times four because two of the pieces have two possible internal orientations. Our job is to eliminate 47 of those, either with color rulings or by further restricting the order.

    As is, here are the solutions that come to mind:

    Spoiler
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    {table=head] Solutions|Pink|Red|Purple|Violet|Orange|Blue|Green|Yellow
    1|Hawk|Falcon|Eagle|Buzzard|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Har rier
    2|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Har rier
    3|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Buzzard|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Har rier
    4|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Har rier
    5|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Har rier
    6|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Har rier
    7|Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|E agle
    8|Harrier|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|E agle
    9|Harrier|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buz zard
    10|Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Bu zzard[/table]

    Hopefully that's a comprehensive list, and I didn't screw anything up. Now, to narrow it down, we start striking things off. Most of the solutions come from the flexibility of the owl-vulture-osprey group, so let's say "the owl sits to the right of the vulture, and not on the green circle" instead of what we had before. Let's revise the table--red solutions are dead, blue are live.

    Spoiler
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    {table=head] Solutions|Pink|Red|Purple|Violet|Orange|Blue|Green|Yellow
    1|Hawk|Falcon|Eagle|Buzzard|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Harrier
    2|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Harrier
    3|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Buzzard|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Harrier
    4|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Harrier
    5|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Harrier
    6|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Harrier
    7|Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|Eagle
    8|Harrier|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|Eagle
    9|Harrier|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard
    10|Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard[/table]

    Four left. The eagle, falcon, and osprey are all pretty free from color-based restraints; add two, maybe all three, and you can easily pick whichever arrangement you like. Myself, I like solution #7 the best, so I'd restrict the eagle from purple (cuts out #6), the falcon from blue (cuts #10 and #4), and the osprey from pink (cuts out #4). Slightly redundant, but it gets the job done.

    So, the revised key would read:

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    "Herein lies the key.

    The hawk does not go on the orange or yellow circle.

    The falcon sits between the hawk and the eagle, and avoids the blue circle.

    The osprey and vulture are side by side; neither holds the pink circle.

    The vulture does not sit on the violet or the green circle.

    The eagle sits neither on the purple nor blue circle.

    The owl sits at the vulture's right hand, and not on the green circle.

    The harrier has only one neighbor.

    The buzzard does not occupy the pink or red circle."

    And the final arrangement would be:

    Spoiler
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    Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|Eag le

    Whew! Wall of text much. Logic puzzles fascinate me; blame that.

    EDIT: Oops, it appears I missed a spot or two.
    Last edited by Math_Mage; 2010-04-02 at 07:43 PM.

  23. - Top - End - #23
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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    The puzzles I've found work best are those in which you can get everyone, or in your case, small groups, working on something at the same time, in and out of game. Puzzles mixed with combat, puzzles that involve incremental realizations, and puzzles that are directly tied to plot points tend to work best for me. That, of course, is for a much smaller group. In your situation, you could try making a whole slew of smaller puzzles, each of which gives a clue necessary for the solving of a larger puzzle, which allows access (or whatever). That way everyone can work on something in parallel.

    For a solid example, in this case you could double the number of clues on this puzzle so it's trivial once they get all the clues, and solvable with about half of them. Then put each one of them into a different letter substitution code. The players could figure out the code individually, then as they figure out their pieces of the puzzle, start working on the bigger problem. That way everyone has something to be doing at all times, and it's still constructive.

    For the colors, if it works for your group, that's great. For raptors, how about: merlin, kestrel, goshawk, osprey, owl, vulture, gyrfalcon, and harrier? Gives it a nice dark-ages falconry feel. Bonus points if you replace the colors with the actual titles allowed to use various raptors to hunt!

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2009

    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Btw, I just timed myself solving this (without looking further down the thread). Got 1 solution in 5mins, so its easily possible without too much frustration.

    Problem is, I got another solution not ten seconds afterwards. So your players will spot that there is more than one answer.

    What you can do is take one of the ones above that constrain the problem further. Say, Math_Mage's.

    Then have it be clear that the tablet continues with the extra lines needed so those players who don't want to solve the puzzle can go find the extra lines.

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

    Join Date
    Apr 2007

    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Quote Originally Posted by Math_Mage View Post
    For starters, "the eagle sits on neither the blue nor blue circle" is redundant.

    In the puzzle's current incarnation, there are many possible solutions. The base specifications are:
    1. Harrier on an end;
    2. Hawk-Falcon-Eagle, or vice versa;
    3. Owl-Vulture-Osprey, or vice versa.

    So, we have four 'pieces' to arrange: the harrier, the falcon group, the vulture group, and the buzzard. The total number of combinations before color rulings is 48: 24 possible orderings of four pieces, minus 12 where the harrier is not on the end, times four because two of the pieces have two possible internal orientations. Our job is to eliminate 47 of those, either with color rulings or by further restricting the order.

    As is, here are the solutions that come to mind:

    Spoiler
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    {table=head] Solutions|Pink|Red|Purple|Violet|Orange|Blue|Green|Yellow
    1|Hawk|Falcon|Eagle|Buzzard|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Har rier
    2|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Har rier
    3|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Buzzard|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Har rier
    4|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Har rier
    5|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Har rier
    6|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Har rier
    7|Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|E agle
    8|Harrier|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|E agle
    9|Harrier|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buz zard
    10|Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Bu zzard[/table]

    Hopefully that's a comprehensive list, and I didn't screw anything up. Now, to narrow it down, we start striking things off. Most of the solutions come from the flexibility of the owl-vulture-osprey group, so let's say "the owl sits to the right of the vulture, and not on the green circle" instead of what we had before. Let's revise the table--red solutions are dead, blue are live.

    Spoiler
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    {table=head] Solutions|Pink|Red|Purple|Violet|Orange|Blue|Green|Yellow
    1|Hawk|Falcon|Eagle|Buzzard|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Harrier
    2|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Harrier
    3|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Buzzard|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Harrier
    4|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Harrier
    5|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Harrier
    6|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard|Harrier
    7|Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|Eagle
    8|Harrier|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|Eagle
    9|Harrier|Owl|Vulture|Osprey|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard
    10|Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Eagle|Falcon|Hawk|Buzzard[/table]

    Four left. The eagle, falcon, and osprey are all pretty free from color-based restraints; add two, maybe all three, and you can easily pick whichever arrangement you like. Myself, I like solution #7 the best, so I'd restrict the eagle from purple (cuts out #6), the falcon from blue (cuts #10 and #4), and the osprey from pink (cuts out #4). Slightly redundant, but it gets the job done.

    So, the revised key would read:

    Spoiler
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    "Herein lies the key.

    The hawk does not go on the orange or yellow circle.

    The falcon sits between the hawk and the eagle, and avoids the blue circle.

    The osprey and vulture are side by side; neither holds the pink circle.

    The vulture does not sit on the violet or the green circle.

    The eagle sits neither on the purple nor blue circle.

    The owl sits at the vulture's right hand, and not on the green circle.

    The harrier has only one neighbor.

    The buzzard does not occupy the pink or red circle."

    And the final arrangement would be:

    Spoiler
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    Harrier|Osprey|Vulture|Owl|Buzzard|Hawk|Falcon|Eag le

    Whew! Wall of text much. Logic puzzles fascinate me; blame that.

    EDIT: Oops, it appears I missed a spot or two.
    I modified my program, and with that configuration there are still 2 solutions, the 2nd being the one you provided:
    Spoiler
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    Solution 1:
    Eagle on Pink
    Falcon on Red
    Hawk on Purple
    Osprey on Violet
    Vulture on Orange
    Owl on Blue
    Buzzard on Green
    Harrier on Yellow

    Solution 2:
    Harrier on Pink
    Osprey on Red
    Vulture on Purple
    Owl on Violet
    Buzzard on Orange
    Hawk on Blue
    Falcon on Green
    Eagle on Yellow

    Nice job eliminating all those solutions by hand btw :D

    GENERATION 14: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. social experiment.

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2006

    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    For starters, "the eagle sits on neither the blue nor blue circle" is redundant.
    Silly error on my part has been fixed, thanks.
    Iron Chef in the Playground veteran since Round IV. Play as me!


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  27. - Top - End - #27
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    oxybe's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2009

    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    my answer
    Spoiler
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    from left to right: Hawk, Falcon, Eagle, Buzzard, Owl, Vulture, Osprey, Harrier.

    only took a few minutes, a pencil and an old bus pass to write on. after looking at the other answers, seems like this is an answers others have found. not too hard of a puzzle.

  28. - Top - End - #28
    Banned
     
    Math_Mage's Avatar

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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    Quote Originally Posted by Accersitus View Post
    I modified my program, and with that configuration there are still 2 solutions, the 2nd being the one you provided:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Solution 1:
    Eagle on Pink
    Falcon on Red
    Hawk on Purple
    Osprey on Violet
    Vulture on Orange
    Owl on Blue
    Buzzard on Green
    Harrier on Yellow

    Solution 2:
    Harrier on Pink
    Osprey on Red
    Vulture on Purple
    Owl on Violet
    Buzzard on Orange
    Hawk on Blue
    Falcon on Green
    Eagle on Yellow

    Nice job eliminating all those solutions by hand btw :D
    The hardest part was actually coloring in the tables. Did you know that you can't color across cells? I didn't.

  29. - Top - End - #29
    Titan in the Playground
     
    ElfRangerGuy

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    Imagination Land
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    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    I've narrowed it down to two solutions, however realize that this sort of puzzle will have to be written out to be solved. That may work for some groups, but my players probably would not go to all that trouble.

    Anyway, here's what I got:
    Spoiler
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    Pink = Harrier
    Red = Owl or Osprey
    Purple = Vulture
    Violet = Osprey or Owl
    Orange = Buzzard
    Blue = Hawk
    Green = Falcon
    Yellow = Eagle
    "Nothing you can't spell will ever work." - Will Rogers

    Watch me draw and swear at video games.

  30. - Top - End - #30
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2006

    Default Re: Is This Puzzle Workable?

    I made another edit to reduce wrong right answers.
    Iron Chef in the Playground veteran since Round IV. Play as me!


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