Getting moar out of Sunder

[NekoJoker]

HULK SMASH!

yeah, that's pretty much the feeling i want to get out of this.
I have this build in mind that involves a goliath, a brutal surge goliath greathammer (is that the name?) combat brute and leap attack.
I aslo want to add imp trip and knockdown. this is an ECL 10 build using mostly fighter for feats and maybe a barbarian dip just to get pounce out of the ACF and rage...

the basic idea is leap atack the opponent, sunder his weapon, attack the guy then probably trip and during the extra attack bullrush the guy into a wall.
rinse, repeat.

I just hope this build is actually legal...

Now, I am afraid I may not be able to get to sunder the weapon, most likely i will be facing CR 10+ creatures (mostly humans) and i want to be really sure I will sunder the weapon.

I think i may be facing adamantine weapons with at least +2 Enhancement. I think that makes up for a fairly 50 dmg output to break the weapon (I am considering hardness here)

So, again I want to be sure I will crush the weapon on the first strike and move on with the combo.

have you ever tried something like this?

[Soranar]

be a paladin

smite the object (it works as it's not a non-evil creature)

[elonin]

Sundering will cause you to loose a fair bit of your wealth from encounters. I have no idea if those selections work together within the rules.

[NekoJoker]

Sundering will cause you to loose a fair bit of your wealth from encounters. I have no idea if those selections work together within the rules.

Loosing a bit of wealth is not a problem since we don't loot the bodies on our campaigns.

So all I am looking for is a way for certainly delivering +50 dmg at Lvl 10 I really think this can be done. I am open to most 3.5 splatbooks except for Tome of battle and Oriental adventures.

I am open to any tactics that wil give me the HULK SMASH! feeling i'm looking for

[Keld Denar]

The Shards of Granite Tactical feat from ToB will give you some useful abilities, as will a number of Stone Dragon manevuers.

[NekoJoker]

The Shards of Granite Tactical feat from ToB will give you some useful abilities, as will a number of Stone Dragon manevuers.

Thanks for the advice, but ToB is not allowed. We as a group don't really like it. I know it has some really AWESOME stuff going on, but we try not to use it whenever possible.

[Keld Denar]

I'm assuming you have Shocktrooper? This will let you PA for full on a charging sunder, and Combat Brute will allow you to cleave through the weapon after you trash it on a full PA sunder.

[Shiva asori]

See if you can get your weapon modeled after the Shatterspike Specific weapon in the DMG but using the greathammer instead.

[sofawall]

I am open to most 3.5 splatbooks except for Tome of battle

[NekoJoker]

I'm assuming you have Shocktrooper? This will let you PA for full on a charging sunder, and Combat Brute will allow you to cleave through the weapon after you trash it on a full PA sunder.

Yes, those are included in the mix as well. In addition to this I want to see if I can convince my DM to have Directed bullrush to work with the Brutal Surge enhancement from the MiC. This way the enemy will actually fly off in a nice curve befor landing against a wall. That'd be a good laugh

See if you can get your weapon modeled after the Shatterspike Specific weapon in the DMG but using the greathammer instead.

Don't know this weapon. It's on the regular DMG? I'll look it up now.

Is Raptor School Worth it? just to keep up with the flavour from Leap attack.
Besides, I heard about this spell... Rhino Charge i think the name was. It seemed like it doubled damage dealt after a charge. Do you know about it? How does it work?


EDIT --- Shatterspike will do a just fine. The bonuses are really cool. Now. I want to know. is it possible to further enhance a specific weapon? I was always puzzled by that.

[Shiva asori]

3.5 DMG, shatterspike is a +1 longsword which gets a +3 to hit, on damage and to effective enchantment bonus bonus on sundering stuff, need improved sunder for the main effects to work all of this for 4,315 gp, see if you can get the weapon of your choice to do the same and you'll sunder well.

[Shiva asori]

I think Page 232-233 in the Magic Item compendium should work for your needs I think, AKA take the base cost of the weapon enchanted to what you want - what the weapon costs before you improved it = who much it would take to improve it.

Rhino's rush is what's the spell you're thinking of is called; lvl 1 paladin, ranger and first lvl wrath domain spell, swift action to cast doubles damage on first hit in a charge attack, lasts for one round (page 176-177 in the SpC).

[NekoJoker]

I think Page 232-233 in the Magic Item compendium should work for your needs I think.

Rhino's rush is what's the spell you're thinking of is called; lvl 1 paladin, ranger and first lvl wrath domain spell, swift action to cast doubles damage on first hit in a charge attack, lasts for one round (page 176-177 in the SpC).

Excelent. I'm checking it out right now.

I am also planning on having near to none AC, Besides Karmic Strike is there any other feat/spell/enhancement/whatever that will allow me to punish anyone that
DARES hit me?

[kjones]

Loosing a bit of wealth is not a problem since we don't loot the bodies on our campaigns.

Blasphemy!

[Shiva asori]

Plenty of spells do that, the spells Fire in the Blood and Mantel of pure spite in heroes of horror, more then a few spells such as death armor (low duration) and hamatula barbs (high duration) in spell compendium, reciprocal bracers

Spoiler

Show

(if enemies land a crit or sneak attack, you can activate it to treat you next attack as a crit, still need to confirm it though {works 2 times per day})

combined with flesh ring of scorn

Spoiler

Show

( auto comfirm crit but take damage equal to ed6 where e= the weapon crit multiplier {works 3 times per day})

can make a nasty combo but only working on crits and sneak attacks is a bad thing.

Thing is though, most of the time better to avoid getting hit then countering hits with heavier hits.

[NekoJoker]

Thing is though, most of the time better to avoid getting hit then countering hits with heavier hits.

True enough. But most likely I will be taking away huge chunks of my AC through Charge and Hit multipliers like heedless charge and things like that. so I would like to give a real pain to my enemies. Of course i will have to go the Combat Reflexes way to achieve that. But still it might be worth it if I can manage a way not to get too beaten up after a couple of encounters.... Maybe Feral template for Fast healing?

or maybe a way to get a decent DR... i will still be hit more often than not, so it may pay off to hit them back harder and get healed after battle with Fast healing...

[Shiva asori]

You Could try the retributive amulet, (enemy takes half of what you take for a single melee attack 3 times per day.) retaliation armor property (if the enemy deals at least 10 points of damage they take 1d6 damage, if they drop you below 0, they take 3d6 damage.) or the ring of vengeance ( enemys who crit a good aligned wearer takes 5d6, works 3 times per day.) and maybe the counterstrike bracers ( if the enemy misses you with a melee attack, you can choose to get a free AOO even if you haved used them all in the same round, works 2 times per day.)

[Escheton]

feral is overpowered, its not really intended as a playertemplate. Or if your dm allows it, jack it up to a +2 mod at least.
a tiefling or aasimar have nothing on a feral human.
Or unless you want to go overboard, feral half ogre or giant- goliath
consider taking psiwarrior instead of fighter, and the goliath barb substitution for moar str and sizeincrease

if you have dex and some extra feats (flaws allowed?) you could go for AoO's with robilars and such

[Optimystik]

Tome of Magic allowed? Dip Binder, you get Improved Sunder for free and double damage to objects with just one level (Aym.) Proceed into whatever melee class you like.

If you'd rather not spend a level on Binder, taking the Bind Vestige feat with Aym still gets you the double damage to objects (but not Improved Sunder.) You shouldn't have much trouble with hardness with an ability like that.

[Shiva asori]

With binder he could advance more in it and get dahlver-nar's shield self ability and get revenge easily, just boost the DC and you're good to go.

[Eloel]

You Could try the retributive amulet, (enemy takes half of what you take for a single melee attack 3 times per day.)

Where're you getting that from? BoED amulet gives half the damage, forever.

[Optimystik]

Binder is a useful choice in its own right. With Knight of the Sacred Seal, you can get +16 BAB and full Binding at 20 (Binder 15/KotSS 5) for all iteratives. Aym goes well with Savnok - you get free full plate that scales with your level (from Masterwork at 2nd all the way to +4 heavy fortification at 20th), and no movement speed reduction while wearing it. Savnok also lets you swap places with any ally within 50 feet.

You'll also have a ton more tricks than being a sundermonkey or swinging your mace around. Be the party face, be a battlefield controller, be a healer, spam summons... Binders can do it all. The fun only increases once you hit epic.

[sofawall]

Where're you getting that from? BoED amulet gives half the damage, forever.

MIC updated it.

[Shiva asori]

Updated in MiC actually

Edit: ninja...

[NekoJoker]

Tome of Magic allowed? Dip Binder, you get Improved Sunder for free and double damage to objects with just one level (Aym.) Proceed into whatever melee class you like.

If you'd rather not spend a level on Binder, taking the Bind Vestige feat with Aym still gets you the double damage to objects (but not Improved Sunder.) You shouldn't have much trouble with hardness with an ability like that.

I never introduced the Tome of Magic into my group (I possess the largest sum of books available to us and to be honest I just overlooked this one).
The Binder class looks really good, nice flavour, easy access, and the powers granted are well, almost too good to be true.

So I have to ask, when you bind Aym do you get ALL of the powers? I mean...
-No Encumberance
-The firey Halo that deals damage to enemies when the hit you
-Improved sunder
-Medium Armor proficiency
-Fire Resistance 10
-Double damage against objects.

At any rate all I just need would be the Double damage power, but I wouldn't be a sad Panda if I could get all of them. I will look further into this when I get my hands on my books later on, but can you guys enlighten me in the meantime?

[The Glyphstone]

Yup. Binding a vestige gets you all of its granted powers. Sometimes they can only be used X/day, or on a 5-round cooldown, but no vestige I know of has abilities that are only open for higher-level binders that isn't simply too high level to be bound by a lower-level one.

[NekoJoker]

Another thing. If I get Rhino Rush (spell) to double damage after a charge, then I use Ruinous attack from the vestige to deal double damage agains objects...

this is on the following scenario:
1-leap attack
2-Activate combat brute and use Sundering cleave
3-Deal damage

Does this actually work?
If so, how is damage multiplied?

[Pechvarry]

I'd assume that, as usual, two doublings equals a tripling, and so on and so forth.

[Lycanthromancer]

Needs Moar Disarming.

[Optimystik]

Aym is one of the few vestiges with no limit on her powers. No cooldown, no x/day.

And again, you don't even need a Binder level for the double damage to objects - that's the ability she gives you if you pick her with the Bind Vestige feat. And even if you do go the Binder level route, you only ever need 1 - none of her abilities scale with level.

I'd assume that, as usual, two doublings equals a tripling, and so on and so forth.

This sounds right to me. All you're doing is multiplying, so why would there be a problem?