spontanious casters

[Whyte_Widow]

i need a reference to where it states that Sorcs are spontaneous casters. GM says i cant take rapid metamagic cuz sorcs dont spontaneously cast spells.

[2xMachina]

... Your DM is a noob.

Unlike a wizard or a cleric, a sorcerer need not prepare his spells in advance. He can cast any spell he knows at any time, assuming he has not yet used up his spells per day for that spell level. He does not have to decide ahead of time which spells he’ll cast.

Definition of Spontaneous.

[Kylarra]

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/sorcererWizard.htm

[Volthawk]

So how does your sorcerer cast, if not spontaneously?

[ericgrau]

Fitting enough, it's in the Player's Handbook chapter on magic, in the metamagic section.

[DementedFellow]

How did he think Sorcerers cast their spells?

[Frosty]

On behalf of certain other threads, we should not assume that this nublet DM is a "he" since it could very well be a "she."

[Volthawk]

On behalf of certain other threads, we should not assume that this nublet DM is a "he" since it could very well be a "she."

Hehe, yeah. Wouldn't want to be sexist now, would we?

[Sliver]

Well, while non of those above call out them as being spontaneous with the exact use of the word...

Here is the most explicit thing I can find in the PHB..

Special: This feat can’t be applied to any spell cast spontaneously (including sorcerer spells, bard spells, and cleric or druid spells cast spontaneously), since applying a metamagic feat to a spontaneously cast spell automatically increases the casting time to a full-round action.

[DementedFellow]

On behalf of certain other threads, we should not assume that this nublet DM is a "he" since it could very well be a "she."

Wouldn't it be more sexist to assume the DM is a she since s/he doesn't even grasp the very concept of a basic class?

[Frosty]

Wouldn't it be more sexist to assume the DM is a she since s/he doesn't even grasp the very concept of a basic class?

We do not assume the DM is one specific gender or another. We merely state the possibility that this DM is something other than male. We do not state or suggest any in any form that the DM is definitely female.

[Sliver]

Bananas! Now, this train has gone off tracks quickly... Maybe this unknown DM will need further evidence, so lets keep this thread from being locked for a little while longer?

[AbyssKnight]

PHB pg. 53 Sorcerer class, Background section "Their first spells are incomplete, spontaneous, uncontrolled, and sometimes dangerous."

PHB pg. 98 Quicken Spell feat "This feat cannot be applied to any spell cast spontaneously (including sorcerer spells, bard spells, and cleric or druid spells cast spontaneously)."

I am also very confused as to how your DM doesn't think sorcerers cast spontaneously. They are pretty much the poster child of what spontanous casting IS.

[Frozen_Feet]

We do not assume the DM is one specific gender or another. We merely state the possibility that this DM is something other than male. We do not state or suggest any in any form that the DM is definitely female.

On a tangentially related issue, I consider all languanges that lack a proper gender-neutral pronoun are foolish, and note that "he" is easier to type because it's one letter shorter than the counterpart.

[Yuki Akuma]

"He" is the accepted gender-neutral pronoun in English when referring to a person. Unless you think it's more polite to say "it".

And...

Yeah your DM has no idea what he's doing. Sorcerers are the very definition of spontaneous spellcasters.

[Optimystik]

Well, while non of those above call out them as being spontaneous with the exact use of the word...

Here is the most explicit thing I can find in the PHB..

UA to the rescue again. (Did I mention how much I love that book?)

"Characters who cast all their spells spontaneously—such as bards and sorcerers—don’t have to prepare spells."

[Studoku]

Don't convince your DM that sorceres are spontaneous casters. Just use the metamagic as normal.

Since you're not a spontaneous caster (according to your DM), you don't need rapid spell to cast metamagic as a standard action.

[Abd al-Azrad]

And now we have resolved this issue, punish your DM. I give you...

Solo's Stupendously Superior Sorcerer Stratagems. Study these well.

[Whyte_Widow]

i was told that none of these references are proof that sorcerers are spontaneous casters. i need more definitive proof.

under the spontaneous caster section in the PHB it says its only druids and clerics...

for the sorc description in the classes section its a "descriptive word" not implying that sorcs spontaneously cast.

any other definitive proof?

[BRC]

i was told that none of these references are proof that sorcerers are spontaneous casters. i need more definitive proof.

under the spontaneous caster section in the PHB it says its only druids and clerics...

for the sorc description in the classes section its a "descriptive word" not implying that sorcs spontaneously cast.

any other definitive proof?

How does this sound

Unlike a wizard or a cleric, a sorcerer need not prepare his spells in advance. He can cast any spell he knows at any time, assuming he has not yet used up his spells per day for that spell level. He does not have to decide ahead of time which spells he’ll cast.

I mean I really don't see how else you could interpret the class. The description under Spellcasting seems pretty clear.

[Saph]

You could try pointing out that the "Normal" section of the Rapid Metamagic feat is identical to the description of how sorcerers and bards use metamagic in the PHB.

But really, this is just your DM being silly. Sorcerers are practically the definition of spontaneous casters. When 3.5 rulebooks say "spontaneous caster" and want to give an example, they say "like a sorcerer".

[deuxhero]

If this is a test to see if you know the system (Likely not) remember the penalties for wearing armor you don't have the proficiency are under the armor proficiency feats.

[2xMachina]

Also, do note that ONLY Spontaneous casters need 1 full round to apply metamagic.

Not spontaneous? You metamagic with no time addition. Thus, no Rapid Metamagic needed.

So, ask your DM. Want to let you take the feat, or give it to you for free?

[Lycanthromancer]

As was mentioned already, if the sorcerer doesn't cast spells spontaneously then he doesn't have to have Rapid Metamagic because only spontaneous spellcasters have extended casting times for metamagics.

You should just make a psion; you won't have that problem.

Of course, it sounds like your DM doesn't know the rules well enough to be DMing. Maybe you should consider finding someone else to DM, or pulling him (or her) here to talk to us directly?

[Whyte_Widow]

Also, do note that ONLY Spontaneous casters need 1 full round to apply metamagic.

Not spontaneous? You metamagic with no time addition. Thus, no Rapid Metamagic needed.

So, ask your DM. Want to let you take the feat, or give it to you for free?

hes at the table now w me and says that sorcerers fall somewhere in the middle of spontaneous and prepared. and to apply metamagic it will always cast one full action (or more). i need a statement from some 3.5 book that says "sorcerers are spontaneous casters"

he also says that bards are not spontaneous casters...

otherwise i cannot take rapid metamagic.

[Partysan]

Wait, since when were Clerics ever spontaneous casters?? They need to prepare spells in the morning (praying etc.), don't they?

And please ask your DM, if he thinks they fall into middle ground, what part of their casting provides the prepared casting's part of the mixture.

[Mongoose87]

Ask him what, exactly, sorcerers prepare?

The fact that this variant exists proves that clerics and druids aren't spontaneous casters.

[Whyte_Widow]

Ask him what, exactly, sorcerers prepare?

he says sorcerers dont prepare spells. that they fall somewhere in the middle

[Mongoose87]

he says sorcerers dont prepare spells. that they fall [I]somewhere in the middle[I]

If they're in between prepared and spontaneous, they must prepare some things and do some spontaneously. What do they prepare?

[Whyte_Widow]

only druids summon spells are spontaneous. and evil inflicts are spontaneous. also, good cures are spontaneous. that is it.