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  1. - Top - End - #1
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    Kobold

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    Default Psionic Stealth?

    So, if a power's only display is Mental (And mental displays are described as "A sort of pinging sound in your head") or Material (Which is described as "The target gets covered in astral slime") does that mean that no one can tell when or which psion is responsible it?

    Or indeed, if psionics is uncommon, would they be unable to recognize it as magic at all?
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    Starbuck_II's Avatar

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Quote Originally Posted by shadow_archmagi View Post
    So, if a power's only display is Mental (And mental displays are described as "A sort of pinging sound in your head") or Material (Which is described as "The target gets covered in astral slime") does that mean that no one can tell when or which psion is responsible it?

    Or indeed, if psionics is uncommon, would they be unable to recognize it as magic at all?
    Well, if someone nearby they can still get an attack of opportunity (guy still let guard down), but otherwise yeah it would be hard to tell who did it.

    Unless, you have Psicraft (psionic anlalog to spellcraft).

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    Kobold

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Oh god AoO's as witchcraft detectors

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Shadow, you break the multiverse.

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    DrowGuy

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Didn't Roy do that some time ago? I feel like I have an attack of opportunity and that guy didn't move so he must be casting a spell. Also, if the display is only mental then you'd have to have detect magic(psionics) up to get a chance at psi craft.

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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Eh. Hiding the Displays is a fairly trivial Concentration check anyway.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Yeah, any psionic character worth his salt hides his displays all the time. IIRC, there's no downside for hiding displays. If you fail the check, the display goes off.

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    By RAW, that is somewhat ambiguous.

    I'd have the psion roll a bluff check opposed by spot checks to disguise the fact that he is taking an action. And an attack of opportunity would be in place because the psion is not actively defending, as he is taking a mental action. This lack of defence is easily noticed and will provoke attacks in melee combat.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Kobold

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Iferus View Post
    By RAW, that is somewhat ambiguous.

    I'd have the psion roll a bluff check opposed by spot checks to disguise the fact that he is taking an action. And an attack of opportunity would be in place because the psion is not actively defending, as he is taking a mental action. This lack of defence is easily noticed and will provoke attacks in melee combat.
    In a fight, yes. It makes total sense that you could say "Hey, that guy isn't really paying much attention to me. BAM! Blindsided!"


    However, at, say, a coronation speech? Or a fancy dinner?
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  10. - Top - End - #10
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    However, manifesting defensively denies the AoO and thereby the detection. Every psion worth his salt manifests defensively where appropriate, too.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    The key words there are "where appropriate."

    Since casting defensively has the possibility of the spell failing (but not on a natural 1):

    With a CON score of 14, most Psychic Warriors can manifest defensively all the time by level 14, and Psions by level 17.

    Most psionic characters have to pick and choose when to manifest defensively before that point without CON- or Concentration-boosting items. Unless they took Combat Manifesting, but, really, who takes that feat?

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    Colossus in the Playground
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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Quote Originally Posted by strider24seven View Post
    Most psionic characters have to pick and choose when to manifest defensively before that point without CON- or Concentration-boosting items. Unless they took Combat Manifesting, but, really, who takes that feat?
    Doesn't everyone pick Con-boost items right after boosts to their primary stat tho?
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  13. - Top - End - #13
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    There's also the Single-Minded personality for the psicrystal. And throwaway skill shards for a one-shot assassination-type mission. Third-eye of Concentrate is pricey for low-level characters but virtually guarantees success for manifesting low-level powers.

    Concentration checks are not hard.

    @v: Holy crap...that's awesome! All these years playing psionic characters and I'd never noticed that part of psionic focus before! O.o
    Last edited by ghost_warlock; 2010-04-08 at 10:32 AM.

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    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    And for that matter, don't forget that expending Psionic Focus is an automatic roll of 15 on any Concentration check. Assuming you didn't intend to use metapsionics on that power, it's literally impossible to fail a defensive casting check for any power you're capable of manifesting if you spend focus.
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    Optimystik's Avatar

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Quote Originally Posted by shadow_archmagi View Post
    So, if a power's only display is Mental (And mental displays are described as "A sort of pinging sound in your head") or Material (Which is described as "The target gets covered in astral slime") does that mean that no one can tell when or which psion is responsible it?
    The sound radiates out from the manifester (to 15 feet), so they can reasonably pinpoint the source.
    The entire point of the displays is to give onlookers (particularly psionic ones) some way of figuring out who is responsible.

    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_warlock View Post
    Concentration checks are not hard.
    Indeed - especially when expending your focus lets you take 15.

    Quote Originally Posted by shadow_archmagi View Post
    Oh god AoO's as witchcraft detectors
    I don't think it makes sense to get an AoO if you're not already hostile to the caster/manifester.

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Glyphstone View Post
    Assuming you didn't intend to use metapsionics on that power, it's literally impossible to fail a defensive casting check for any power you're capable of manifesting if you spend focus.
    Well, if you have a decent number of ranks in Concentration.
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    Optimystik's Avatar

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Not to mention a Con bonus.

    Metapsionics aren't a huge problem either - use your psicrystal's focus instead. Elans also get Elan Retainment, or a Synad can use his split mind to recover his focus.

    Adding in Hyperconscious gives you even more options, such as one of my favorite feats, Permanent Focus.

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Draz74 View Post
    Well, if you have a decent number of ranks in Concentration.
    Without any Con-bonus, 9 ranks (or 6 ranks and Single-minded psicrystal) is all you'd need to auto-succeed on 9th-level powers.
    Last edited by ghost_warlock; 2010-04-08 at 10:50 AM.

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Of course, in order pull off that combo, you'd need to be at least in a midlevel game. You'd need:
    Psionic Meditation (and WIS 13): To regain your focus in combat
    Psicrystal Containment (and Obtain Psicrystal): To use your Psicrystal's focus

    But otherwise, you no longer provoke AND don't display. You are what the Unseen Seer wanted to be.

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    Default Re: Psionic Stealth?

    Quote Originally Posted by strider24seven View Post
    Of course, in order pull off that combo, you'd need to be at least in a midlevel game. You'd need:
    Psionic Meditation (and WIS 13): To regain your focus in combat
    Psicrystal Containment (and Obtain Psicrystal): To use your Psicrystal's focus

    But otherwise, you no longer provoke AND don't display. You are what the Unseen Seer wanted to be.
    How do you define "midlevel?"

    An Erudite/Psychic Warrior (any race) can pull this off at level 4, as well as a human Ardent.

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