Mater of TWF <3.5 WoW/Forgotten Realms>

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

Hey folks! I'm new here, and I wish to ask for a tad of help...

I'm in a WoW/FR-based campaign in which the Weave from FR is in the WoW-verse and the Horde and Alliance must stand together against a new evil.

I'm a Tauren Ranger 1 who surrendered spellcasting for Bonus Feats, and specialized in TWF. I have a Warhammer and a Scimitar, with a beltfull of throwing knives and a Greatbow with a quiver full of random natural arrows.

I just want to know how to build him to be a TWF beast with lots of striking, using my strength to my advantage.

and because the weave is screwy, no spellcasting plz (spell choice is 100% random)

[gorfnab]

Since you're using a Warhammer and a Scimitar you'll need the feat Oversized Two Weapon Fighting (Complete Adventurer) to avoid massive penalties to your attacks. If your strength is decent and you're using the above weapons then Power Attack may work for you as well. Consider taking 1 level of Barbarian with the Lion Totem variant from Complete Champion so that you can pounce (full attack on a charge). Some levels of Scout with the Swift Hunter feat will give you a much needed damage boost. Also read these handbooks.
The 3.5 Ranger Handbook
The Swift Hunter's Handbook

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

Since you're using a Warhammer and a Scimitar you'll need the feat Oversized Two Weapon Fighting (Complete Adventurer) to avoid massive penalties to your attacks. If your strength is decent and you're using the above weapons then Power Attack may work for you as well. Consider taking 1 level of Barbarian with the Lion Totem variant from Complete Champion so that you can pounce (full attack on a charge). Some levels of Scout with the Swift Hunter feat will give you a much needed damage boost. Also read these handbooks.
The 3.5 Ranger Handbook
The Swift Hunter's Handbook

I see.

and the DM said that due to the core 22 STR, I can dual wield them both easilly (he's almost pure power)

I like that idea, but it sounds too much like an Ubercharger, which the DM specifically banned

and a dip or two in scout seems appropriate. He's an outcast of his clan, who now hunts for the perfect opponent

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

Actually, the game hasn't begun yet. maybe I can try incarnum...

[gorfnab]

I like that idea, but it sounds too much like an Ubercharger, which the DM specifically banned

Most uberchargers builds use Leap Attack feat, Shock Trooper feat, and sometimes the Charging Smite (PHBII) variant of Paladin. Other ubercharger builds are mount based. So as long as you stay away from those you really shouldn't have to much of a problem. Too bad though, because of your character's strength it would have actually been a decent melee style option.

[gallagher]

obligatory advice towards ditching TWF and going THF?

you are probably already sold on doing TWF, else you wouldnt have bothered posting, but i decided to advise you to look into THF in case you hadnt yet

[Keld Denar]

Actually, the game hasn't begun yet. maybe I can try incarnum...

THIS! ZOMG DO THIS!

Tauren have the PERFECT fluff to do Totemist perfectly. Totemists are BADASS. Tauren are BADASS. Tauren Totemists are BADASS^2.

What focus do you want your Totemist to persue? Totemists are flexible enough that they can kinda change what they are doing often enough, but in general you should stick with a given core concept, make it effective, and then you can adjust your peripheral soulmelds as you think the day will demand.

The main Totemist roles are grapple-monster or multilimbed striker. You can be a pretty impressive tank too, if jack up your HP and natural armor and get a couple avoidance melds like Phase Cloak. You can even make stunning charges if you pick up Shape Soulmeld: Thunderstride Boots of the Soulborn list. Its like, the only good Soulborn meld, SOMEONE has to get use out of it!

Straight Totemist20 is decent, but don't discount the potential of Barbarian2/Totemist4/TotemRager10/Totemist+4. Using the ACFs in Unearthed Arcana, this can net you Improved Grab (Bear Totem Barbarian) or Improved Trip (without needing Combat Expertese), and Complete Champion has Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian which grants Pounce, saving you a chakra bind on Sphinx Claws.

[strider24seven]

Levels in Tempest can make you a beast if TWF is your thing.

Since you are wielding a Scimitar, Dervish might help.

Take some levels in Swordsage. You want Assassin's Stance to qualify you for Craven. Character level to Sneak Attack damage? Yes please. Warblade levels round out the build with Tiger Claw maneuvers.

Really, though, you are better off going Two-Handed weapon style for an ubercharger. Frenzied Berzerker for the win.

[Keld Denar]

Levels in Tempest can make you a beast if TWF is your thing.

Tempest actually makes you WORSE at TWF by virtue of requiring a bunch of BS feats that don't help you while TWF, and giving you a bunch of abilities that don't synergize AT ALL with TWF. The only thing it gives you is reduced TWF penalties, which, when all is said and done, is only a +2 to hit. Yay, so amazing. Glad I spent ALL of those feats and 5 full class levels for an amazing +2 to hit. You'd be better off taking 5 levels of Warblade, or even Barbarian, to make you a better TWFer. Its seriously that bad.

[strider24seven]

Fair point.

Tempest works better in gestalt, really. I'm partial to a Swift Hunter Tempest-Dervish, though.

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

THIS! ZOMG DO THIS!

Tauren have the PERFECT fluff to do Totemist perfectly. Totemists are BADASS. Tauren are BADASS. Tauren Totemists are BADASS^2.

What focus do you want your Totemist to persue? Totemists are flexible enough that they can kinda change what they are doing often enough, but in general you should stick with a given core concept, make it effective, and then you can adjust your peripheral soulmelds as you think the day will demand.

The main Totemist roles are grapple-monster or multilimbed striker. You can be a pretty impressive tank too, if jack up your HP and natural armor and get a couple avoidance melds like Phase Cloak. You can even make stunning charges if you pick up Shape Soulmeld: Thunderstride Boots of the Soulborn list. Its like, the only good Soulborn meld, SOMEONE has to get use out of it!

Straight Totemist20 is decent, but don't discount the potential of Barbarian2/Totemist4/TotemRager10/Totemist+4. Using the ACFs in Unearthed Arcana, this can net you Improved Grab (Bear Totem Barbarian) or Improved Trip (without needing Combat Expertese), and Complete Champion has Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian which grants Pounce, saving you a chakra bind on Sphinx Claws.

Totemist was the goal, focusing on basically whatever makes sense.

I actually once ran a Star Elf Paladin of Slaughter 5/Hexblade 3/Battledancer 1/Soulborn 2 who kicked some royal bum... He used Cha for EVERYTHING.

I'm also running a Tauren Shaman (yes, OA shaman) who will look like this @ 20th: Shaman 15/Contemplative 1/Divine Oracle 1/Prestige Paladin 2

so a Tauren Totemist with level dips into Barbarian and Torem Rager (maybe go Spirit Lion and Sighn Rager) would be seriously scary?

[Sinfire Titan]

so a Tauren Totemist with level dips into Barbarian and Torem Rager (maybe go Spirit Lion and Sighn Rager) would be seriously scary?

Well, it is one of the three best PrCs in the book (the other two are Ironsoul Forgemaster and Soulcaster, Sapphire Hierarch lost points for missing Chakra Bind progression).

In general, it's between using the Manticore Belt and Flyby Attack abuse or going Totem Rager with a Totemist (unless you start above 6th level, in which case you can stay a single-classed Totemist and still get Pounce cheaply).

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

Well, it is one of the three best PrCs in the book (the other two are Ironsoul Forgemaster and Soulcaster, Sapphire Hierarch lost points for missing Chakra Bind progression).

In general, it's between using the Manticore Belt and Flyby Attack abuse or going Totem Rager with a Totemist (unless you start above 6th level, in which case you can stay a single-classed Totemist and still get Pounce cheaply).

This game starts at LV1. and I'm new to Incarnum, but I only dipped into Soulborn to try it in small doses and I was the tank for lack of a better word

[Sinfire Titan]

This game starts at LV1. and I'm new to Incarnum, but I only dipped into Soulborn to try it in small doses and I was the tank for lack of a better word

In that case, your best option would be Totemist 4/Barbarian 2 (or Barbarian 1/Warblade 1)/Totem Rager 10

Totemist 1 actually gives you more HP thanks to the Rage Claws, and everyone loves Dimension Door at will.

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

In that case, your best option would be Totemist 4/Barbarian 2 (or Barbarian 1/Warblade 1)/Totem Rager 10

Totemist 1 actually gives you more HP thanks to the Rage Claws, and everyone loves Dimension Door at will.

WHAT?! Dimensional door at-will???

[Sinfire Titan]

WHAT?! Dimensional door at-will???

10ft+10ft/essentia invested. Standard action. Blink Shirt Soulmeld.

One of the reasons Totemists are Tier 3. It takes effort to get them to stay down.

[Keld Denar]

I'd go the Totem Rager option, personally, picking up at LEAST pounce with Lion Totem Barb. You can get Pounce from binding Sphinx Claws to your hands slot, but dang it, I never have enough chakra binds. I'd recommend taking Shape Soulmeld for Thunderstride Boots and binding those to your feet. Every attack you hit with on a charge does extra damage based on essentia invested and has a chance to stun foes. Combine that with Girallon Claws bound to your Totem and you'll have 4 claws and a gore every time you charge. That'll result in about +10d4 damage on a charge, assuming you invest 2 essentia into Thunderstride Boots, and 5 fort saves vs stun on anything you hit. Thats a decent start.

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

I'd go the Totem Rager option, personally, picking up at LEAST pounce with Lion Totem Barb. You can get Pounce from binding Sphinx Claws to your hands slot, but dang it, I never have enough chakra binds. I'd recommend taking Shape Soulmeld for Thunderstride Boots and binding those to your feet. Every attack you hit with on a charge does extra damage based on essentia invested and has a chance to stun foes. Combine that with Girallon Claws bound to your Totem and you'll have 4 claws and a gore every time you charge. That'll result in about +10d4 damage on a charge, assuming you invest 2 essentia into Thunderstride Boots, and 5 fort saves vs stun on anything you hit. Thats a decent start.

Must verify that the messed up Weave won't mess up my Incarnum

[Sinfire Titan]

Must verify that the messed up Weave won't mess up my Incarnum

If anything, the deities governing Death would be the ones most likely to be able to mess with it. If the DM isn't convienced, remind him that you are messing with soulstuff, not magic. At worst, Soulmelds are analogues to Magic Items, and should follow any rules FR has that restrict Magic Items.

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

If anything, the deities governing Death would be the ones most likely to be able to mess with it. If the DM isn't convienced, remind him that you are messing with soulstuff, not magic. At worst, Soulmelds are analogues to Magic Items, and should follow any rules FR has that restrict Magic Items.

The problem is the Gods are being wacked, and the Spellweave is all messed up. Its so bad mages can't choose their casted spell. Instead, they pick a category, and they roll a d%

[Sinfire Titan]

The problem is the Gods are being wacked, and the Spellweave is all messed up. Its so bad mages can't choose their casted spell. Instead, they pick a category, and they roll a d%

That's just it, you don't use the Weave. If anything, you are closer to a Binder (which has a precedent mentioned in an FR splat as being marginally outside the Weave itself, IIRC).

[Morty]

According to this article, Incranum in the Realms does use the Weave. Whether you stick to it or not is your choice.

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

That's just it, you don't use the Weave. If anything, you are closer to a Binder (which has a precedent mentioned in an FR splat as being marginally outside the Weave itself, IIRC).

I see. he may rule differently, but how could the Weave mess me up?

[Lycanthromancer]

Natural attacks are nearly always better than TWF, as this thread has hinted at. Totemists and psychic warriors (who, along with psions, don't depend on the Weave for self-buffs, according to...um...Magic of Faerun, I think?) are the kings of natural attacks, tied with druids (which is amazing, considering how insane druids are at everything) and just a bit above wildshape rangers (might want to look into that one, by the way). ToB-ers also make great TWF-ers too, but they actually use weapons.

I know you want to play a tauren, and you'll take a hit on Strength, but the Races of the Dragon web enhancement kobolds make great totemists; three natural attacks, a bonus on Con, and some interesting-for-ambushes-and-escapes racial abilities make them a win. Y'know, just FYI.

So if you can't play a totemist, try a psychic warrior (or even an egoist); you'll have some stamina issues if you're not careful, but they do make awesome natural attack-ers, and you won't have to worry about the weave.

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

Natural attacks are nearly always better than TWF, as this thread has hinted at. Totemists and psychic warriors (who, along with psions, don't depend on the Weave for self-buffs, according to...um...Magic of Faerun, I think?) are the kings of natural attacks, tied with druids (which is amazing, considering how insane druids are at everything) and just a bit above wildshape rangers (might want to look into that one, by the way). ToB-ers also make great TWF-ers too, but they actually use weapons.

I know you want to play a tauren, and you'll take a hit on Strength, but the Races of the Dragon web enhancement kobolds make great totemists; three natural attacks, a bonus on Con, and some interesting-for-ambushes-and-escapes racial abilities make them a win. Y'know, just FYI.

So if you can't play a totemist, try a psychic warrior (or even an egoist); you'll have some stamina issues if you're not careful, but they do make awesome natural attack-ers, and you won't have to worry about the weave.

In this campaign, Psionics "draws" from another section of the Weave. And no kobold (DM orders)

[Lycanthromancer]

In this campaign, Psionics "draws" from another section of the Weave. And no kobold (DM orders)

So much for the *entire point* of psionics, then. Suckage.

Wildshape ranger, or perhaps druid, then?

Even if, as a druid, you have to choose randomly for your spells, as paraphrased: "A random choice from a giant pile of awesome is still awesome."

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

So much for the *entire point* of psionics, then. Suckage.

Wildshape ranger, or perhaps druid, then?

Even if, as a druid, you have to choose randomly for your spells, as paraphrased: "A random choice from a giant pile of awesome is still awesome."

and I'm currently gonna run (in my Friday night game) a Tauren shaman (as in shaman from OA), so I need a martial machine

[Kylarra]

Really, the only solution should be to play a wildmage.

[Lycanthromancer]

and I'm currently gonna run (in my Friday night game) a Tauren shaman (as in shaman from OA), so I need a martial machine

Well, once you get access to psychic reformation (via research or a feat), the random choice restrictions simply won't apply anymore.

Barbarian/ToB it is, then, if totemist isn't an option (although you have access to your entire soulmeld list daily, so "soulmelds known" just doesn't come into it...unless you mean everything's just wild magic, and any spell you cast is 100% random as to what effect actually happens, which is more dangerous to the party than anything else).

Really, your DM hasn't thought the repercussions of this decision through. D&D was 'balanced' (if you can call it that) with the idea of at least 2 spellcasters in the group. Trying to have a functional group without them is gonna be very difficult.

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

Really, the only solution should be to play a wildmage.

screw that noise!!!!! I like consistancy....

besides, I've never run a "pure" incarnum b/4 (the soulborn paly of slaughter doesn't count)