A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
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    Orc in the Playground
     
    Kyrthain's Avatar

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    Default Parrying Rules [PEACH and whatnot]

    For a while I thought it would be cool to have rules in place so that characters could actively parry attacks. HERE THEY ARE!


    Parrying

    On your turn, you may sacrifice a number of attacks up to your maximum. You may choose which attacks to sacrifice, and must spend either a standard action (for one)or a full round action (for more) to sacrifice them. You gain a number of parry attempts equal to the amount of attacks you sacrificed. You may choose to use some of your attacks to attack as normal, and allocate the rest as parry attempts as you wish.



    Example: a6th level fighter may use a standard action to gain one parry attempt, or a full round action to gain one parry attempt and attack, or gain two parry attempts.



    At the start of your next turn, you lose any unused parry attempts.

    If you have any parry attempts, and you are attacked by an enemy, so long as the dm agrees that you could feasible deflect the oncoming attack with your weapon, you may spend a parry attempt. Make an attack roll, as if you were using the attack you sacrificed to gain the parry attempt. If your roll exceeds the opponents attack roll, their attack misses, regardless of whether they would have hit your ac or not. If you fail to parry, the attempt is still used, but if the opponents attack roll is insufficient to hit your ac, they still miss. Any restrictions that apply to the attack you sacrificed apply to your parry attempt



    Example: a fighter sacrifices the attacks from whirlwind attack. They now have one parry attempt they can use against each adjacent foe.



    Riposte

    After successfully parrying, you may immediately spend another parry attempt to attack that foe. For the attack, they are treated as flat footed. Note: your parry roll must have exceeded their attack roll, you may not riposte if your parry is unsuccessful but your opponent still misses. You may only riposte once per successful parry, and it must be against the opponent whom you parried.


    If you are playing with these rules, you should convert most abilities that grant a bonus to AC based on your ability to parry attacks into a bonus on parry checks, or perhaps even a free parry attempt per turn. I might end up making feats associated with parrying at some point. Hope you guys like the rules.
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    Ashtagon's Avatar

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    Default Re: Parrying Rules [PEACH and whatnot]

    How do you plan to integrate this with the "fight defensively" and "total defence" combat options, which are what RAW uses to represent parrying?

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    Orc in the Playground
     
    Kyrthain's Avatar

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    Default Re: Parrying Rules [PEACH and whatnot]

    Well, total defense could be replaced by simply using a full attack action to gain more parry attempts. Maybe fighting defensively gives a bonus on parry attempts instead of AC
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    Ashtagon's Avatar

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    Default Re: Parrying Rules [PEACH and whatnot]

    The problem with "use attacks as parry attempts" is that while you only have one attack (levels 1-5 for everyone, higher for some classes), defensive fighting becomes an all or nothing affair. And any halfway intelligent monster is going to ignore any target that isn't actually a threat (ie. isn't attacking).

    It's a nice idea in theory, but D&D isn't really designed with that level of detail for combat.

    I think it may be better to let a character use an immediate action to parry, instead of an attack action. It fits in better in terms of the action economy. Maybe add a restriction that if you make a parry attempt, you must fight defensively or do total defence in the next round (ie. not a standard attack sequence). This restriction could be lifted once you have bab +6 or better.

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    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Parrying Rules [PEACH and whatnot]

    I spent a lot of time contemplating a system to introduce parries, and so far these are the best I've come up with, all riddled with problems.
    In general, I've made the applicable bonuses fairly low, and the functions fairly narrow, seeing as.. well, the potential ability to entirely negate an attack is rather potent.

    A) spending attacks of opportunity as defense rolls
    This option removes your BAB, but allows you to apply personal modifiers as normal (flanking: no. bull's strength: yes). The trading off of offense for defense is obvious.

    B) converting your weapon to a shield as a move action like taking full defensive.
    This option removes your BAB, but allows you to apply other bonuses as above, and is generally best suited to 2WF builds, as that weapon is no longer usable until you convert it back.

    C) designating a single foe ala Dodge, for whom your weapon/offhand weapon is a proper shield and weapon simultaneously.
    This option would allow you to apply all normal attack roll modifiers for that hand as a (potentially huge) shield bonus.


    I don't expect they're a great help, but I offer what I can. Best of luck!

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    Default Re: Parrying Rules [PEACH and whatnot]

    I'm not a huge fan of how you've currently got it set up as others have said it results at low levels in being unable to parry

    So I'm going to mention how I think you could modify your system then I'll tell you about the system I use for my true 20 games.

    1) I think you could solve the problem pretty simply give them a parry attempt for each attack they have. So one attack gives them one parry attempt by default. Then allow them to convert additional attacks into parries as well, then even at low levels they can parry they just aren't skilled enough to get a repose in.


    2) Here is how I run parries, I'm a firm believer in cinematic combat so with each attack I have the defender so long as they aren't flatfooted roll a opposing attack. If the attacker wins they compare their attack to the AC of the defender if it's higher then hit, lower they miss. If the defender wins they get to make an attack on the attacker, who can try and parry it, this goes on until someone hits or misses. But again I'm a fan of cinematic combat, and I generally only use it for more important bosses or if the players want to get into duels. Hacking down minions it becomes less important
    The avatar isn't really a good example of my work as I did it with my hand in a brace, hopefully I can put something nicer up soon. -TD

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    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: Parrying Rules [PEACH and whatnot]

    Fading Suns d20 has a similar system, in which one parries using his attack bonuses and his available attacks, with an automatic riposte if one successfully parries. However it requires two feats, called, appropriately enough, Parry and Riposte to use these maneuvers. It works . . . okay, I guess.

    The problem with both this system and the FSd20 system is that they both complicate the bejeezus out of combat, adding at least one extra step (the parry attempt, then maybe the riposte attempt) to every attack. All in all, in a combat system like D&D which makes basically no attempt at realism, you're better off with defensive fighting/total defense/combat expertise defenses than with active defenses that add THAT many rolls to every attempt to hit.
    Bwaha! I have deep-seated emotional problems! Die! Die! Die!



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    Kyrthain's Avatar

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    Default Re: Parrying Rules [PEACH and whatnot]

    Quote Originally Posted by The Duke View Post
    I'm not a huge fan of how you've currently got it set up as others have said it results at low levels in being unable to parry

    So I'm going to mention how I think you could modify your system then I'll tell you about the system I use for my true 20 games.

    1) I think you could solve the problem pretty simply give them a parry attempt for each attack they have. So one attack gives them one parry attempt by default. Then allow them to convert additional attacks into parries as well, then even at low levels they can parry they just aren't skilled enough to get a repose in.


    2) Here is how I run parries, I'm a firm believer in cinematic combat so with each attack I have the defender so long as they aren't flatfooted roll a opposing attack. If the attacker wins they compare their attack to the AC of the defender if it's higher then hit, lower they miss. If the defender wins they get to make an attack on the attacker, who can try and parry it, this goes on until someone hits or misses. But again I'm a fan of cinematic combat, and I generally only use it for more important bosses or if the players want to get into duels. Hacking down minions it becomes less important
    I suppose the problem with my system is that it was intended not to really change the balance of power, and so I wanted to make you have to trade off to get parries. However, since this affects everyone, that's not really an issue.

    EDIT: Since there's not really much more to say about my rules, perhaps we should just open this to a discussion of what different parrying rules people have come up with/use in their games.
    Last edited by Kyrthain; 2010-04-23 at 02:26 PM.
    Epic avatar by Serpentine
    (>*,,*)> Zombie wants to be your friend.

    There are no problems that cannot be solved by a liberal enough application of wolves. Think about it.

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