Support the GITP forums on Patreon
Help support GITP's forums (and ongoing server maintenance) via Patreon
Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 103
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    DrowGirl

    Join Date
    Aug 2008

    Default Help as a Wizard

    going up 1 on 1 with an epic level monk so it should be easy. but you can never have enough preparation right? so im level 16ish. standard items. so what tactics should i generally use?
    so far i have
    -fly
    -force cage
    -orbs
    *also im looking to *not* use infinite combos.
    ty in advance.
    3.5game
    Last edited by faith; 2010-05-20 at 11:06 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Canberra, Australia
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Your main danger is letting that monk get in hand to hand combat range with you - don't assume fly will keep you out of danger since hide is a monk class skill which means they can just get out of line of sight and wait until your spell runs out.

    Consider some summoning spells in order to have meatshields to cover you on the ground. Look also for spells that aren't blocked by magical resistance.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    sonofzeal's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2008

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Books available? Cheese level sought?

    - "Faeries Mysteries Initiate" = use your Int for hp.

    - Prepare "Celerity" and bring a scroll of "Time Stop". Best used with a method to prevent flatfootedness.

    - Solid Fog can get him to waste his Abundant Step, before hitting him with the much more expensive Forcecage

    - Stack "miss chance" effects. Greater Mirror Image + Blink + Blur + incorporeality = lulz.
    Avatar by Crimmy

    Zeal's Tier System for PrC's
    Zeal's Expanded Alignment System
    Zeal's "Creative" Build Requests
    Bubs the Commoner
    Zeal's "Minimum-Intervention" balance fix
    Feat Point System fix (in progress)

    Spoiler
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by JadePhoenix View Post
    sonofzeal, you're like a megazord of awesome and win.
    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Roc View Post
    SonOfZeal, it is a great joy to see that your Kung-Fu remains undiminished in this, the twilight of an age. May the Great Wheel be kind to you, planeswalker.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Doc Roc's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    starmantle + any source of evasion.
    basically, just look through the ToS banlist.
    Last edited by Doc Roc; 2010-05-20 at 11:41 PM.
    Lagren: I took Livers Need Not Apply, only reflavoured.
    DocRoc: to?
    Lagren: So whenever Harry wisecracks, he regains HP.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

    Join Date
    Dec 2008

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Really, Just for simplicities sake. The list of what NOT to do is so much easier.
    You can really do ANYTHING you want with a Wizard vs. Monk..

    Things to PREPARE for:
    -Anti Melee Range/Effective Use (This can be done with: Ranged Combat, Stacking Miss Chance, Not being the one to take the Damage (IE: Shield Other))
    -ANTI GRAPPLE - Freedom of Movement, Benign Transposition (sp?), Blur, MirrorImage.
    -ANTI - ANTI MAGIC FIELD (This will come into play If he is a Grappler with a Custom Item, 5ft Anti-Magic field, If hes flat-basic monk you shouldnt have to worry).

    ----
    Lets focus on you NOT taking the damage, regardless.
    Helpful Spells: Freedom of Movement, Blur+Mirror Image+Displacement, Any of the Bigsby Grasping/Forceful Hand spells (It makes for Handy barrier), Wall Spells (Last resort), Invisibility (Or greater if you can afford it, chances are his Spot/Listen will be huge if hes smart).

    Also Important: GLITTERDUST! ALWAYS GLITTERDUST! (He will need to Hide from you for LoS, you can deny him that and Blind is HUGE vs. Melee (Along with your already impressive miss chances).

    Alternatively, Polymorph into something extremely small and pick spells you can cast without Somatic components or gestures (Or take the feats) and just Buzz around and "Sting" him to death.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Banned
     
    Superglucose's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    California
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by faith View Post
    -fly
    Good
    -force cage
    Anklets of Translocation are really good items for a very large number of reasons. I think they even cost less than the material component for Force Cage.
    -orbs
    Monks do not have tremendously high touch ACs, but their AC is mostly touch. Probably not what you want to use.

    Disjunct him and it's game. Contingency (I'm attacked/rude gesture/whatever) -> DD 100ft up -> Timestop -> Shapechange -> Disjunct -> Tenser's Transformation while a Solar -> pull out a greatsword and beat the tar out of the monk as a fighter.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    PId6's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Elemental Plane of Paper
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Singleclassed wizard or PrCs allowed? And level of monk? Shouldn't matter that much but still kinda does limit your options if he's too high level. Remember that Exceptional Deflection + Infinite Deflection lets him block all ranged touch attacks, so don't bother with those.

    Scrolls of Shapechange/Gate/Time Stop can be pretty good. Monks actually have good saves/touch AC, so don't bother with spells that allow them and just either focus on Planar Binding/Gate for unstoppable monsters or Polymorph/Shapechange to turn yourself into an unstoppable monster.

    Also, since he's an Outsider, see if you can't Gate him in and command him to kill himself.
    Rogue Handbook | Warmage Rebuild | Diablo's Assassin | Revised Classes
    Potpourri Creation Contest II Winner: Desert Martial Adept Substitution Levels
    Potpourri Creation Contest III Best Characterization: Edward the Sly's Lucky Spells
    Prestige Class Contest XXI Submission: Child of the Seelie Court

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Doc Roc's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Don't forget to bring a simulacrum.
    A Drakehelm (Explorer's Handbook) will get you Favor Of The Martyr.
    Lagren: I took Livers Need Not Apply, only reflavoured.
    DocRoc: to?
    Lagren: So whenever Harry wisecracks, he regains HP.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Banned
     
    Math_Mage's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Superglucose View Post
    Anklets of Translocation are really good items for a very large number of reasons. I think they even cost less than the material component for Force Cage.
    Doesn't the cube version of Forcecage block line of effect? Then you can't use Anklets to get out. There are other ways, though.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Banned
     
    Superglucose's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    California
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    In any case, just be a better monk than he is. If you're going to beat them, crush them in a way that proves your superiority. Everyone knows that a wizard can cast Fireball, what they don't know is that a wizard can also hit things with a pointy stick.

    EDIT: Greater Arcane Sight to figure out if he has Freedom of Movement up (4th level aburation, so moderate abjuration aura) after you disjunct. If he does not, then grapple him to death as a Balor. Just pin him, and let the rest of it sort itself out (he takes 6d6 fire, you have a BAB of 20, a strength of 39, and if you throw on Enlarge Person to yourself probably a size advantage as well).
    Last edited by Superglucose; 2010-05-21 at 12:20 AM.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Critical's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    winning
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    lol, really? You're asking help to beat a monk as a wizard? Okay, he's a monk, you're a wizard. You win.

    EDIT: Also, I personally reccomend dropping fly and using an alter self form with flight. Lower spell slot and longer duration!
    Last edited by Critical; 2010-05-21 at 12:17 AM.
    Awesome Bleachatar by Terry576.

    Previous Awesome Avvies:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Levethix the Dray Arcane Swordsage from the harsh world of Dark Sun.


    Fallout bloody mess avatar by C-Lam.


    My Homebrew:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Ursa Warrior PrC
    More to come... I hope.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    nyarlathotep's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Critical View Post
    lol, really? You're asking help to beat a monk as a wizard? Okay, he's a monk, you're a wizard. You win.

    EDIT: Also, I personally reccomend dropping fly and using an alter self form with flight. Lower spell slot and longer duration!
    He's only asking because of the level differential.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Banned
     
    Lycanthromancer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Don't forget, he's an epic monk with epic wealth.

    However, if you do things right he'll need every gp he can get his unarmed strike on.

    Learn the delay death spell, and cast it on round 1. Be a warforged as well, and polymorph into a chain golem or something, and you're now immune to anything he can possibly do to you using his class abilities (assuming 100% monk). Nab a planar bound nightmare (or a simulacrum thereof) for astral projection, to castrate anything he might try to pull out via items.

    As for what you'll want to do? Grab yourself a portable hole and fill it with all of the simulacrums, undead, and planar bound minions you can squeeze into a 1000 cubic foot space, then dump them out to hound him all over the place (allips are nice, as he'll find hitting them less than easy, and they can attack him from under the ground; fiendish remorhazes are nice, because they'll deal damage to him if he even thinks about hitting them). Find ways to entangle him to reduce his speed and his Reflex save and AC. Control weather to keep him groundbound, dimension lock to keep him from teleporting around, dust of sneezing and choking will make him easy prey for your minions to dispatch. Have a raven familiar and use shrink item on a cone made from adamantine (and wear it as a hat), using the raven's turns to prepare the command word for the cone, just in case he gets close to you somehow (not that he can hurt you - unless he's a loser Giacomonk, in which case he's already lost).

    Hell, there are lots and lots and lots of ways to destroy him. Maybe not as many as there are for a fighter (good saves + good touch AC = hard target), but the old standby of dimension lock + force cage + acid fog + freezing fog is always a good one (especially since you have access to time stop scrolls).
    Last edited by Lycanthromancer; 2010-05-21 at 12:37 AM.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Human Wizard3/MasterAbjurer6/IotSV7

    He's an epic monk, meaning he's swimming in magical items and effects. Get rid of them, and he probably can't do much to you.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant
    I want tools to use in the game, not a blank check to do what I want. I can already do what I want.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Banned
     
    SwashbucklerGuy

    Join Date
    Mar 2007

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Lycanthromancer View Post
    (not that he can hurt you - unless he's a loser Giacomonk, in which case he's already lost).
    Sigh.

    Monk at these levels uses time stop, gets next to wizard (possibly shapechanged tiny size from below to counter the cone trick), activates AMF (thus ending time stop) and wizard dies.
    Contingencies go "poof", anticipate teleports or whatever will not activate as monk with his great move can move 480ft or more per round and thus does not need really dimension doors or such, and celerities...are somewhat magical as I recall. Also, poof.
    Then...
    - Either wizard is astrally projected, at which point the AMF immediately kills him. ("snap" goes the astral chord)
    - Or wizard is present as usual, with the problem of facing the (epic) monk with a commoner's stats. I think, the (raven?) familiar may put up a bit of a fight, but the monk can sure to ignore the familiar. Ditto the nightmare (but astride the cone trick would not work that well, either).

    I think the best chance of a wizard in this situation is to use his magic to hide or somehow remain unnoticed by the epic monk.
    (remember at this point though also that an epic monk will have SR, saves - note how useless the disjunction gets vs a will save of +40 or such- hp and defenses that virtually blocks everything the non-epic wizard can throw at him. Add to this epic level wealth that could allow a monk to bypass any tricks of the wizard to hide. Possibly the wizard has a chance on a good day...but I cannot at the moment think of anything).

    - Giacomo
    Last edited by Sir Giacomo; 2010-05-21 at 01:16 AM.

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Doc Roc's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Hey Gia, sounds like a challenge! Perhaps Ernir will reprise his role as GM.
    Meet you in the arena with my L16 core wizard and your L21 epic monk.

    PS: Astral projection includes no such wording, by the way.
    Last edited by Doc Roc; 2010-05-21 at 01:22 AM.
    Lagren: I took Livers Need Not Apply, only reflavoured.
    DocRoc: to?
    Lagren: So whenever Harry wisecracks, he regains HP.

  17. - Top - End - #17

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    {Scrubbed}
    Last edited by Roland St. Jude; 2010-05-22 at 10:37 AM.

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Banned
     
    Superglucose's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    California
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    How many of those monk v wizards did you win again?

    EDIT: Here's my bet for you Giacomo. I will kill your level 20 monk with my level 20 wizard. I will kill your level 20 monk with grappling, and not with spells. You may use whatever tricks you like. Sound good? It's even easier than the 20 fighter/monk vs 20 wizard that PR is offering because I won't even kill you using spells!
    Last edited by Superglucose; 2010-05-21 at 01:26 AM.

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    gdiddy's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    New Jersey
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    I never get into these wizard/melee debates, however, I am beginning to believe that Giacomo is actually some sort of double agent that exists just to convince everyone how powerful wizards are.
    GMs 3.5, cWoD, Rogue Trader, Monsterhearts, The Pool, and Fudge. Narrativist, wacky builder, and dancer.

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Doc Roc's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by gdiddy View Post
    I never get into these wizard/melee debates, however, I am beginning to believe that Giacomo is actually some sort of double agent that exists just to convince everyone how powerful wizards are.
    Eh, the test of spite would exist without him, and to me, it's proof enough.
    Lagren: I took Livers Need Not Apply, only reflavoured.
    DocRoc: to?
    Lagren: So whenever Harry wisecracks, he regains HP.

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Roc View Post
    Hey Gia, sounds like a challenge!
    Meet you in the arena with my L16 core wizard and your L21 epic monk.

    PS: Astral projection includes no such wording, by the way.
    Astral Projection's wording is pretty vague, to be honest.

    http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/astralProjection.htm

    While you are on the Astral Plane, your astral body is connected at all times to your physical body by a silvery cord. If the cord is broken, you are killed, astrally and physically. Luckily, very few things can destroy a silver cord. When a second body is formed on a different plane, the incorporeal silvery cord remains invisibly attached to the new body. If the second body or the astral form is slain, the cord simply returns to your body where it rests on the Material Plane, thereby reviving it from its state of suspended animation. Although astral projections are able to function on the Astral Plane, their actions affect only creatures existing on the Astral Plane; a physical body must be materialized on other planes.

    You and your companions may travel through the Astral Plane indefinitely. Your bodies simply wait behind in a state of suspended animation until you choose to return your spirits to them. The spell lasts until you desire to end it, or until it is terminated by some outside means, such as dispel magic cast upon either the physical body or the astral form, the breaking of the silver cord, or the destruction of your body back on the Material Plane (which kills you).
    Emphases mine. Could it be that AMF ends an Astral Projection? That wouldn't be as devastating as the (obviously biased) Gia interpretation, but it would definitely cause many a wizard grumble about wasted funds.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant
    I want tools to use in the game, not a blank check to do what I want. I can already do what I want.

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Banned
     
    Lycanthromancer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Roc View Post
    Hey Gia, sounds like a challenge! Perhaps Ernir will reprise his role as GM.
    Meet you in the arena with my L16 core wizard and your L21 epic monk.

    PS: Astral projection includes no such wording, by the way.
    And the challenge is on!

  23. - Top - End - #23

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by GoodbyeSoberDay View Post
    Astral Projection's wording is pretty vague, to be honest.

    http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/astralProjection.htm

    Emphases mine. Could it be that AMF ends an Astral Projection? That wouldn't be as devastating as the (obviously biased) Gia interpretation, but it would definitely cause many a wizard grumble about wasted funds.
    Dispel Magic can end the form, so it's a magical effect. By that, AMF should suppress the form, much like incorporeal undead. They're not dead, they just cease to be for a while.

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by PhoenixRivers View Post
    Dispel Magic can end the form, so it's a magical effect. By that, AMF should suppress the form, much like incorporeal undead. They're not dead, they just cease to be for a while.
    I guess an optimized wizard's most feared environmental effect is the dreaded (and DM-created) permanent antimagic field, then. Tinfoil hats for everyone!
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant
    I want tools to use in the game, not a blank check to do what I want. I can already do what I want.

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Doc Roc's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by PhoenixRivers View Post
    Dispel Magic can end the form, so it's a magical effect. By that, AMF should suppress the form, much like incorporeal undead. They're not dead, they just cease to be for a while.
    Which has potentially terrifying implications, actually, in that I can hide in a wholly undetectable way with just an AMF.

    Hmm. Look what you've done.
    Lagren: I took Livers Need Not Apply, only reflavoured.
    DocRoc: to?
    Lagren: So whenever Harry wisecracks, he regains HP.

  26. - Top - End - #26

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Roc View Post
    Which has potentially terrifying implications, actually, in that I can hide in a wholly undetectable way with just an AMF.

    Hmm. Look what you've done.
    Based on what order you apply effects in, it's possible to do it with shapechange, too.

    Turn into an incorporeal undead.

    Choose to apply: "Winks out" before "suppresses Shapechange"

  27. - Top - End - #27
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    noiadodh's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Recife, Brazil
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    there will be a duel or not???

    *grabs popcorn*

  28. - Top - End - #28
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Doc Roc's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by PhoenixRivers View Post
    Based on what order you apply effects in, it's possible to do it with shapechange, too.

    Turn into an incorporeal undead.

    Choose to apply: "Winks out" before "suppresses Shapechange"
    Wizard inna bag? I think so! It'd need to have a sort of bivalve configuration, so that you could block LoE if you needed to, and you'd need to animate it, and it'd probably need to be your familiar.

    Depressingly, not a single one of these is actually an obstacle.
    Last edited by Doc Roc; 2010-05-21 at 01:39 AM.
    Lagren: I took Livers Need Not Apply, only reflavoured.
    DocRoc: to?
    Lagren: So whenever Harry wisecracks, he regains HP.

  29. - Top - End - #29

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    I doubt it. I offered Giacomo a chance weeks ago. Still am offering.

    For whatever reason, he's not accepted.

    I suppose he could have enough time to type up dozens of pro-monk debates, and yet be too pressed for an objective analysis.

    Or it could be that he doesn't have as much faith in this theory as he seems to infer.

    Guess we'll never know.
    Last edited by PhoenixRivers; 2010-05-21 at 01:45 AM.

  30. - Top - End - #30

    Default Re: Help as a Wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Roc View Post
    Wizard inna bag? I think so!
    Heck, put shapechanged wizard into a bag of holding. Place in AMF. There's literally no way to know it's not a simple bag.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •