Gestalt Cleric//Swordsage?

[Force]

I decided to take a whack at the Neverending Dungeon despite my noob-ness (never played a game of 3.5 in my life due to... shall we say, parental factors). However, I have been reading the optimization boards for some time and I feel that my opti-fu might be enough to get me through a few levels of the Dungeon before I get slaphammered. I figured I'd first post my build and ask for any input I could get before I applied, though. So, without further ado...

Male Human Cloistered Clr1/SwSa1;

HD 1d8+2; hp 9;
Init +1; Spd 30 ft/x4;

AC 14 (+4 armor), touch 10, flat-footed 14;

Base Atk/Grapple +0/+3;
Full Atk +4 Two-handed (2d6+4;19-20/x2, Greatsword), +0 Two-handed (1d8;20/x3, Longbow);

Str 16(+3), Dex 10(+0), Con 14(+2), Int 12(+1), Wis 16(+3), Cha 8(-1)

Skills: Concentration¹ +6, Knowledge (arcana) +3, Knowledge (local) +5, Knowledge (nature) +5, Knowledge (religion) +3, Listen¹ +7, Search¹ +3, Spellcraft +5, Spot¹ +5

Flaws: Frail, Murky-Eyed
Maneuvers and Stances: Blistering Flourish, Burning Blade, Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Stance of Clarity, Clinging Shadow Strike, Shadow Blade Technique, Stone Bones.

Feats: Extra Turning x3, Weapon Focus (Greatsword; Greataxe; Mace, Heavy; Unarmed Strike), Extended Spell, DMM: Persistent Spell.

Domains: Planning, Undeath, Knowledge

Discipline Focus: Stone Dragon

So, guys-- any critique for me? I could also use some help picking spells & maneuvers.

EDIT: Fixed wall o'text and fullplate, updated w/cloistered cleric and flaws + new feats, new weapon.

[Yorrin]

First- for future reference the people on these boards know your class features/saves/BAB just from what your class is, which will cut down greatly on your intimidating wall of text

I have to ask- why a Heavy Mace? You've got access to martial weapons, you might well use them. Also- I've never heard a DM ask for a Martial Lore check- you're better off with something like Knowledge(religion).

Since this is gestalt, you're probably going to greatly benefit from making your Cleric a Cloistered Cleric (Unearthed Arcana), which will up your skill points, give you Bardic Knowledge, and give you the Knowledge domain as a free bonus domain. Swap it in for the Knowledge Devotion feat from Complete Champion for good results. It'll drop your BAB down on the Cleric side of things, but Swordsage has your BAB covered.

Those are my initial thoughts. I'll have to reread your wall'o'text to see if I missed anything glaring.

EDIT: For some reason I'm not seeing how you have that many feats... care to clarify? I'm also not going to question how you afford Full-Plate at lvl 1...

[Fortuna]

The number of feats is simple: three of those (Weapon Focus, Extend Spell and Extra Turning) are bonus feats from class features. The full-plate, however, is just strange, and I don't know how you did it.

Since you're relying on Cleric for your armor proficiency, only go Cloistered if you're not using heavy or medium armor anyway.

In terms of advice, I'd suggest that your plan is actually better served (IMO) by a Crusader//something. I'd suggest Barbarian, netting you some movement to make up for wearing armor. A Frost Dwarf Crusader//Barbarian wearing medium armor ends up at a 30 foot movement speed and NI healing from the Martial Spirit stance (+2 hp whenever you attack). Grab Extra Granted Maneuver, because it will let you use Crusader's Strike more often, and make sure your maneuvers include both Crusader's Strike and Stone Bones.

EDIT: Crusader//Swordsage could also work well, using mostly boosts and counters from Swordsage in order to work around the action economy. Hell, if you're desperate Fighter nets you a bonus feat. And don't, whatever you do, forget to use flaws and traits.

[Optimystik]

Since you're relying on Cleric for your armor proficiency, only go Cloistered if you're not using heavy or medium armor anyway.

Wouldn't he lose the Swordsage AC bonus in those? I'm not very versed with the ToB classes.

[Yorrin]

Wouldn't he lose the Swordsage AC bonus in those? I'm not very versed with the ToB classes.

Yes, the lvl2 Swordsage Wis to AC can only happen in light armor.

[Greenish]

The full-plate, however, is just strange, and I don't know how you did it.

I think it's light armour and the swordsage bonus.

[Edit]: Oh yeah, level 1. Dunno then.

[Jack_Simth]

I decided to take a whack at the Neverending Dungeon despite my noob-ness (never played a game of 3.5 in my life due to... shall we say, parental factors). However, I have been reading the optimization boards for some time and I feel that my opti-fu might be enough to get me through a few levels of the Dungeon before I get slaphammered. I figured I'd first post my build and ask for any input I could get before I applied, though. So, without further ado...

Shen Ragnar
Male Human Clr1/SwSa1; CR 1;
Medium Humanoid (human);
HD 1d8+2; hp 10;
Init +1; Spd 20 ft/x3;
AC 20 (+8 armor, +2 shield), touch 10, flat-footed 20;
Base Atk/Grapple +0/+1;
Full Atk +2 One-handed (1d8+1;20/x2, Heavy Mace), +0 Two-handed (1d8;20/x3, Longbow);
SA&SQ Spontaneous Casting, Restricted Spells, Turn Undead(Su), Domains (Planning & Undeath), Quick to act(Ex), Discipline Focus, × Weapon Focus(Ex);
SR 0; AL NG; SV Fort +4, Ref +2, Will +5;
Str 12(+1), Dex 10(+0), Con 14(+2), Int 8(-1), Wis 16(+3), Cha 16(+3);
Skills: Concentration¹ +6, Intimidate¹ +4, Listen¹ +6, Martial Lore +3, Search¹ +1, Spellcraft +3, Spot¹ +5,
Maneuvers and Stances: Blistering Flourish, Burning Blade, Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Stance of Clarity, Clinging Shadow Strike, Shadow Blade Technique, Stone Bones
Feats: Extra Turning (PH 94)², Weapon Focus (PH 102) (Greatsword; Greataxe; Mace, Heavy; Unarmed Strike), Extend Spell (PH 94)², Persistent Spell (CAr 81).

Battle plan: Persist Lesser Vigor in order to survive the dungeon. I may have problems healing in-combat but monsters can't wear me down over successive encounters. Considering taking a Flaw for another Extra turning so I can persist another spell, either Divine Favor or Shield of Faith. Favor lets me hit harder, Shield makes me harder to hit-- combined with Stance of Clarity, I'd have AC 24, not perfect but definitely evasive.

So, guys-- any critique for me? I could also use some help picking spells & maneuvers.

You seem to have a pretty solid plan, assuming your DM lets Touch range spells count as fixed range spells for purposes of the Persistent Spell feat (not all will do so).

But you've got the one curiosity that's been mentioned (Full Plate? How did you afford it, and why are you using that when you'll be getting Wis to AC in a single level?), and you're better off with one of the Swordsage weapons - they tend to be slightly more useful with maneuvers, and you're proficient with them all anyway.

A Coistered Cleric//Swordsage would do a little better... most of what you're gaining by using the full Cleric over the Cloistered version will be obsolete in just a few levels due to Swordsage bonuses. But you've got a pretty solid plan.

[Douglas]

I don't see Divine Metamagic in your list of feats. Did you just forget to list it? You are obviously planning to use it.

As the game this is for is an exercise in optimization, take not just one flaw but two, take Extra Turning both times, and use the wiggle room this gives you to drop your charisma and boost the stats that can't be replaced by that feat - strength, primarily.

You seem to have a pretty solid plan, assuming your DM lets Touch range spells count as fixed range spells for purposes of the Persistent Spell feat (not all will do so).

The specific game this is for (the Neverending Dungeon) approved that detail long ago.

[Force]

On the full plate-- boy, I feel stupid. I just grabbed the best option on the list and forgot to check the GP requirements. I'll probably stick with studded leather or a chain shirt.

I believe I forgot to list DMM Persist. My mistake.

As for the heavy mace-- it's in line with my Swordsage discipline focus, so I get free weapon focus. *shrugs* +1 to hit is nothing to sneeze at. It had the highest damage die of all the one-handed weapons I saw I could use that didn't require an exotic weapons proficiency feat. I figured I'd be better off as a S&B cleric, though again, I could be wrong.

I'll run Cloistered Cleric through Heroforge tomorrow and see what I get.

Thanks guys!

[The Cat Goddess]

I don't think Heroforge includes the Cloistered Cleric option.

[Pluto]

Don't you get to choose your discipline focus? Desert Wind would probably be the best choice for damage output (high crit ranges are very friendly to the sorts of high flat damage bonuses that the Cleric generates so well).

Anyway, Sword and board is a good idea at level 1, but it doesn't really work with Cloistered. And two-handed fighting is more Persist-Cleric-friendly later on (Righteous Might, Divine Power and Righteous Wrath favor two-handers).

[Force]

Swapped to a greatsword and updated feats and stats using flaws.

Any other comments?