WOTC not following their own rules (3.5)

[Illven]

What are some examples of WOTC not following their own rules such as the malcovker with 14 wisdom casting 5th level cleric spells

[Godskook]

What are some examples of WOTC not following their own rules such as the malcovker with 14 wisdom casting 5th level cleric spells

I'm confused. If Malconvoker qualifies for explicitly granting access to new spells, then pretty much every class does, from Shadow Dancer(Hide in plain sight) to Archmage(Mastery of Elements).

[Illven]

No the sample Malcovker casts 5th level cleric spells but has a 14 wisdom, you need a wisdom of 10+spell level to prepare or cast a cleric spell, i.e 15 for a 5th level spell

[lsfreak]

Most books have at least one statblock that's off. They're notoriously bad. The one off the top of my head is Master of the Nine, which lacks the feats to take the PrC.

[Godskook]

No the sample Malcovker casts 5th level cleric spells but has a 14 wisdom, you need a wisdom of 10+spell level to cast a cleric spell, i.e 15 for a 5th level spell

If we're going to list bad statblocks, we'll be here all night.

[drengnikrafe]

No the sample Malcovker casts 5th level cleric spells but has a 14 wisdom, you need a wisdom of 10+spell level to prepare or cast a cleric spell, i.e 15 for a 5th level spell

Quick nitpick. Also, that Malconvoker also prepared 6th level spells.

[Illven]

I'm looking at it and it has all the required feats that I can see, can you tell me which one or ones it is missing

Yeah the sixith level spells are espically bad

[lsfreak]

I'm looking at it and it has all the required feats that I can see, can you tell me which one or ones it is missing

I misworded that. He's got all the feats, but didn't get them all until 9th level. After he'd take 2 levels of the class.

[Illven]

Ah okay makes more sense

[Temotei]

I misworded that. He's got all the feats, but didn't get them all until 9th level. After he'd take 2 levels of the class.

I thought you could take prestige classes if you intend to meet the prerequisites later.

Not really.

[sofawall]

The prefix pre does mean before. Example: A prefix comes before a word.

[AslanCross]

Most books have at least one statblock that's off. They're notoriously bad. The one off the top of my head is Master of the Nine, which lacks the feats to take the PrC.

The Ruby Knight Vindicator worships St. Cuthbert and not Wee Jas.

[drengnikrafe]

I thought you could take prestige classes if you intend to meet the prerequisites later.

Not really.

"What's in that corner of the fighter college?"
"An area restricted only to the greatest of our warriors, strikers of the many in little time! I suppose you grow close to such things. Can you cleave and great cleave things?"
"I can... pretend I can do that? I'll learn it later, I promise."

[Temotei]

The prefix pre does mean before. Example: A prefix comes before a word.

"What's in that corner of the fighter college?"
"An area restricted only to the greatest of our warriors, strikers of the many in little time! I suppose you grow close to such things. Can you cleave and great cleave things?"
"I can... pretend I can do that? I'll learn it later, I promise."

Funny man is funny.

[Illven]

So what we have learned so far is that while ToB is good at balancing melee classes, it sucks at following it's own rules. Anything else?

[KillianHawkeye]

If we're going to list bad statblocks, we'll be here all night.

No joke! You should see the ones in the Star Wars Saga books.

[AslanCross]

So what we have learned so far is that while ToB is good at balancing melee classes, it sucks at following it's own rules. Anything else?

Magic of Eberron. The Psiforged statblocks do not make sense. They treat psiforged as if it were a separate race, and not just a result of taking the Psiforged Body feat as per what the book actually says.

[Runestar]

The 3.5 FAQ lists 2 completely contradictory stances on epic progression rules for creatures with LA.

Use the character’s ECL to determine starting equipment and how the character earns and benefits from experience (including when he gains an epic attack and save bonus; DMG p. 209), as noted on page 5 of Savage Species. Use the actual character level for everything else.

and

When is a monster character considered epic level? Do you “go epic” when your total class levels equal 20 or when your total Hit Dice equal 20? Is a monster character eligible for epic-level feats (such as Epic Toughness) when its character level is 21+ or when its ECL is 21+?

A monster becomes an epic-level character when its character level hits 21, just like any other character. A monster’s character level equals its racial Hit Dice + class levels. (See the second sidebar on page 25 of the Epic Level Handbook.)

A creature’s ECL has no effect on when it becomes an epic character, although once it becomes an epic character, its ECL continues to affect how much experience it earns and when it can add a new level.

It is also worth noting that in just about every stat block involving monsters with class lvs whose sum exceeds 20, they simply add the bab and saves from the class lvs directly to that of the base monster, completely ignoring epic progression rules.

[Curmudgeon]

Here's a more fundamental rules violation.

The book you hold in your hands is the definitive guide for how to play the 3.5 revision of the DUNGEONS & DRAGONS Roleplaying Game. Years in the making, it gathers resources from a wide variety of supplements, rules errata, and rules clarifications to provide an authoritative guide for playing the D&D game.... When a preexisting core book or supplement differs with the rules herein, Rules Compendium is meant to take precedence.

Meanwhile, the Errata files (for virtually every other D&D 3.5 book in existence) all say this:

Errata Rule: Primary Sources

When you find a disagreement between two D&D® rules sources, unless an official errata file says otherwise, the primary source is correct. One example of a primary/secondary source is text taking precedence over a table entry. An individual spell description takes precedence when the short description in the beginning of the spells chapter disagrees.

Another example of primary vs. secondary sources involves book and topic precedence. The Player's Handbook, for example, gives all the rules for playing the game, for playing PC races, and for using base class descriptions. If you find something on one of those topics from the Dungeon Master's Guide or the Monster Manual that disagrees with the Player's Handbook, you should assume the Player's Handbook is the primary source. The Dungeon Master's Guide is the primary source for topics such as magic item descriptions, special material construction rules, and so on. The Monster Manual is the primary source for monster descriptions, templates, and supernatural, extraordinary, and spell-like abilities.

So we've got Rules Compendium declaring itself the ultimate authority, vs. every other WotC official statement saying that cannot be the case.

[Drakevarg]

So we've got Rules Compendium declaring itself the ultimate authority, vs. every other WotC official statement saying that cannot be the case.

It must be the ultimate authority! It said so itself.

And if you think this makes sense, I'm the President of the United States. I said so myself.

[KillianHawkeye]

So we've got Rules Compendium declaring itself the ultimate authority, vs. every other WotC official statement saying that cannot be the case.

Isn't that just like how the Spell Compendium says that previous versions of the spells inside it are out of date, and the same thing with the Magic Item Compendium and magic items? It's not so much a rule violation as an exception.

[Curmudgeon]

Isn't that just like how the Spell Compendium says that previous versions of the spells inside it are out of date, and the same thing with the Magic Item Compendium and magic items?

No, it's actually different. WotC has an update rule for supplements, wherein the newest version of a thing (spell, prestige class, feat, magic item, or whatever) replaces previous versions. But Rules Compendium distinguishes itself by not being a rule supplement (instead supposedly being an authority that can't be supplanted), thus also taking itself outside of the scope of the update rule.

Rules Compendium's only authority is itself.

[Heliomance]

Surely that falls under the "specific versus general" clause, and thus Rules Compendium does indeed take precedence. In general, the primary source takes precedence. In the specific case, the RC does.

[Fortuna]

Perhaps it is the primary source to end all primary sources?

[Dracons]

Well, I think the exception is fine, seeing as Rules Compendium was one of the very last books released.

[casper]

Sacred Fist's bonus to speed. By RAW it doesn't stack with Monks. But it seems to stack for Sample Sacred Fist.

[Kobold-Bard]

Isn't there something about the Master of Nine being impossible to qualify for because of IL issues? Or am I misremembering.

[nedz]

The example Abjurant Champion[CM] who gets +9 bonus from his Mage Armour

[Tokiko Mima]

Of course there's examples right in the PHB.

Obligatory Burning Hate reference; Jozan, a cleric of Pelor (a NG God) is shown casting Symbol of Pain a spell with an evil descriptor clerics of good aligned gods specifically cannot cast.

[Tokiko Mima]

The example Abjurant Champion[CM] who gets +9 bonus from his Mage Armour

Well, because of the Abjurant Armor class feature he got at level 1 for being an Abjurant Champion Caspian LaMont is allowed to add his class level to any abjurantion spell that gives a bonus to AC. This is what is giving him a +9. The confusing part is that Mage Armor is constantly referenced in the class description as being an Abjuration spell, when it is in fact a Conjuration school spell.