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Thread: Feat synergy

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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Feat synergy [3.5] PEACH

    Fighter are generally considered lackluster. They get a lot of feats, yes, but feats they can get are also generally considered lackluster. Furthermore, all other classes have access to feats too, and have class features to boot. Finally, feats stack instead of scaling, which means some low-level feats are useful only as prerequisites, and once you're done with a feat tree, your next choice is something that would've been appropriate levels ago.

    Some common solutions are to make feats scale according to BAB, HD or Fighter levels. However, when looking at Psionic Body, I began wondering about another solution.

    Psionic Body's effects depend on other [Psionic] feats. The more you have, the better, which also gives incentive to have more. My basic premise is to take this idea and run with it, eventually rewriting all [Fighter] feats in SRD to benefit from this effect (and some other, like Toughness and Standstill). Update: As of now, I have completed this goal and my work is ready for preliminary testing. I'm now expanding this project to all feats found in SRD, and will add some brand new ones as I progress too.

    The first batch of remade feats is in this post.
    Second batch is here
    Third is here
    Fourth is here
    Fifth is here
    Sixth is here
    Seventh is here
    Eighth is here
    Ninth is here.
    Tenth is here.
    Eleventh is here.
    Twelth is here.
    Thirteenth is here.
    Fourteenth is here.
    Fifteenth is here.
    Sixteenth is here.

    Hints for browsing the thread: Until the time I get the feats properly organized, it is suggested you use your browser's search function to search for specific feat names, or feat tags.

    In addition to remade core feats, this thread contains the following new feats: Melee Weapon Mastery, Ranged Weapon Mastery, Master of a Thousand Weapons, Scribe's Familiar, Armor Focus, Improved Shield Focus, Shield Stun, Implacable Man, Juggernaut, Death's Dervish, General's Orders, Move Mountains, Supreme Cleave, Fingers of the Devil, Only man may slay a Monster, Cheat Death, Fearsome Warrior, Heartstealer.

    Using Synergy:

    When using Synergy, all Epic uses of skills are available from level 1.

    There are multiple different tags that can be attached to a Feat. These are [General], [Fighter], [Psionic], [Item Creation], [Guile], [Finesse], [Brawn], [Tenacity], [Monastic], [Wild], [Tactical] [Metamagic], [Metapsionic], [Bardic], [Divine] and [Supernatural].

    [General] feats can be taken whenever your character level gives you a bonus feat, or when race or class feature allows you to freely pick a feat, provided you can meet the prerequistes.

    [Fighter] feats can be taken as Fighter bonus feat, as long as prerequisites are met.

    [Psionic] feats are available only to characters and creatures with the ability to manifest powers, with the exception of Wild Talent. In other words, they either have a power point reserve or have psi-like abilities.

    [Metamagic] feats are only available to characters with ability to cast spells. Likewise, [Metapsionic] feats are only available to characters with ability to manifest powers.

    [Item Creation] feats are only available to characters with ranks in at least one Craft skill, and a Profession skill relating to it, or when a class description specifically allows for choosing such a feat.

    [Psionic], [Metapsionic], [Metamagic], [Divine] and [Supernatural] feats are supernatural abilities—a departure from the general rule that feats do not grant supernatural abilities—they cannot be disrupted in combat (as powers can be) and generally do not provoke attacks of opportunity (except as noted in their descriptions). Supernatural abilities are not subject to power or spell resistance and cannot be dispelled; however, they do not function in areas where psionics or magic are suppressed, such as a null psionics field and anti-magic field. Leaving such an area immediately allows these feats to be used.

    Many [Psionic] feats can be used only when you are psionically focused; others require you to expend your psionic focus to gain their benefit. Expending your psionic focus does not require an action; it is part of another action (such as using a feat). When you expend your psionic focus, it applies only to the action for which you expended it.

    All other Feat tags denote thematic connection. Feats with similar tags will improve each others' functionality. For the purposes of synergy, a Feat counts as a feat of all types it has a tag for. For example, if you have Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization and Acrobatic, you have 2 [Fighter] feats and 2 [Finesse] to count towards Feat special abilities. In some rare cases, this interaction means that a Feat might be counted twice in favor of some special ability. Usually this is noted in the Feat description.

    The following Feats do not grant synergy:
    feats gained from use of spells or psionic powers, feats gained from wearing or using magic or psionic items, feats gained from use of supernatural, spell-like or psi-like power. They are considered to lack their proper Feat tags. Furthermore, such feats don't benefit from synergy either. They only bestow their basic effect. However, feats gained from wearing or holding magic or psionic items do benefit from synergy, as per normal Feat text. In rare cases, this might cause a Feat from such item to be useless due to user of the item lacking proper Feats to support it.

    Remade feats:

    Exotic Weapon Proficiency [General] [Fighter] [Monastic]
    When you take this feat, you gain proficiency with new exotic weapon type for each two [Fighter] feats you have, including this one. For each two new [Fighter] feats you gain, you get a new proficiency. At four [Monastic] feats, the damage dice for Exotic Weapons you're proficient with are doubled. (Examples: If you would normally roll 1d4 for damage, you will now roll 2d4. If you would normally roll 2d6, you now roll 4d6.) At eight [Monastic] damage for exotic weapons you are proficient with increases again, but only one more die is added. Example: 2d4 becomes 3d4, 4d6 becomes 5d6.
    Prerequisite: Base attack bonus +1, plus Str 13 for bastard sword or dwarven waraxe.
    Benefit: You make attack rolls with the weapon normally.
    Normal: A character who uses a weapon with which he or she is not proficient takes a -4 penalty on attack rolls.

    Weapon Focus [General] [Fighter] [Finesse]

    Choose one type of weapon. You can also choose unarmed strike or grappling (or ray, if you are a spellcaster) as your weapon for purposes of this feat. For each two [Fighter] feats you have or gain, you can apply this feat to a new weapon.
    Prerequisites: Proficiency with selected weapons, base attack bonus +1.
    Benefit: You gain a +1 bonus on all attack rolls you make using the selected weapon. For each two [Finesse] feats you have or gain, including this one, the bonus rises by +1.
    Special: A character must have Weapon Focus with a weapon to apply the Weapon Specialization feat to that weapon.

    If "Weapon Tricks" variant is in use, Weapon Focus allows you to use basic tricks with all your chosen weapons.

    Weapon Specialization [General] [Fighter]

    You deal extra damage when using weapons you have applied Weapon Focus to.
    Prerequisites: Proficiency with selected weapons, Weapon Focus with selected weapons, fighter level 4th.
    Benefit: For each two [Fighter] feats you have or gain, including this one, you gain a +2 bonus on all damage rolls you make using the selected weapons. Additionally, whenever your attack with a chosen weapon would drop your enemy to -10 or below, you can instead leave them alive at -9 and stable.
    Special: If "Weapon Tricks" variant is in use, Weapon Specialization allows all advanced uses with your chosen weapons.

    Improved Critical [General] [Fighter]

    You make critical hits more often with weapons you've applied Weapon Focus to.
    Prerequisite: Proficient with weapon, Weapon Focus with selected weapon, base attack bonus +8.
    Benefit: When using the weapons you selected, your threat range increases by one for each three [Fighter] feats you have or gain, including this one.
    Special: This effect stacks with any other effects that expands the threat range of a weapon. It is always applied last.

    Weapon Finesse [General] [Fighter] [Finesse]
    Prerequisite: Base attack bonus +1.
    Benefit: With a light weapon, rapier, whip, or spiked chain made for a creature of your size category, you may use your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier on attack rolls. If you carry a shield, its armor check penalty applies to your attack rolls.
    If you have three or more [Fighter] feats, including this one, you don't suffer -4 penalty to disarm rolls with light weapons.
    If you have four or more [Finesse] feats, you can also substitute your Dex modifier for Strenght when tripping or making grapple checks.
    If you have six or more [Finesse] feats, including this one, you can also add your Dex modifier to damage in place of your Str modifier.
    Special: Natural weapons are always considered light weapons for purposes of this feat.

    Combat Expertise [General] [Fighter] [Guile]
    Prerequisite: Int 13.
    Benefit: When you use the attack action or the full attack action in melee, you can take a penalty at most equal to your BAB on your attack roll and add the same number (+BAB or less) as a dodge bonus to your Armor Class. The changes to attack rolls and Armor Class last until your next turn.
    For each [Guile] feat you have or gain including this one, you gain +1 to all opposed rolls and skill checks against feinting, disarming and sundering when you use this feat.
    If you have five or more [Fighter] feats, including this one, you get +2 Dodge bonus for each -1 to attack rolls you take. If you have ten or more [Fighter] feats, the exchange rate becomes +4 Dodge bonus for each -1 to attack rolls. Your bonus to AC still can't exceed your BAB, however.
    Alternatively, if you have five or more [Guile] feats, you can force your opponent to roll twice for his next attack roll, and keep the worse result. using this option gives no penalty to attack.
    Normal: A character without the Combat Expertise feat can fight defensively while using the attack or full attack action to take a -4 penalty on attack rolls and gain a +2 dodge bonus to Armor Class.


    Improved Disarm [General] [Fighter] [Guile] [Finesse]

    Prerequisites: Int 13, Combat Expertise.
    Benefit: You do not provoke an attack of opportunity when you attempt to disarm an opponent, nor does the opponent have a chance to disarm you. You also gain a +4 bonus on the opposed attack roll you make to disarm your opponent.
    For each two [Finesse] feats you have or gain the bonus you get to opposed rolls increases by 1.
    If you have more [Guile] feats than your opponent and your opponent fails to disarm you, you can attempt to disarm him even if he has Improved Disarm feat as well.
    If you have five or more [Fighter] feats and fail the initial disarm attempt, you are immediatly entitled to a second try. This second try comes before any counter-disarm attempts of your opponent.
    Normal: See the normal disarm rules.

    Improved Feint [General] [Fighter] [Guile]
    Prerequisites: Int 13, Combat Expertise.
    Benefit: You can make a Bluff check to feint in combat as a move action.
    If you have three or more [Fighter] feats, you can feint as a swift action.
    If you have four or more [Guile] feats penalties for feinting non-humanoids and animals are reduced by 4 for you.
    Normal: Feinting in combat is a standard action.

    Improved Trip [General] [Fighter] [Brawn] [Finesse]
    Prerequisites: Int 13, Combat Expertise.
    Benefit: You do not provoke an attack of opportunity when you attempt to trip an opponent while you are unarmed. You also gain a +4 bonus on your Strength check to trip your opponent. For each two [Brawn] feats you have or gain, including this one, the bonus to your Str check increases by 1.
    If you trip an opponent in melee combat, you immediately get a melee attack against that opponent as if you hadn’t used your attack for the trip attempt. If you have eight or more [Fighter] feats you get two attacks.
    If you have five or more [Finesse] feats and fail the touch attack to initiate trip attempt, you are immediatly entitled to a second try.
    Normal: Without this feat, you provoke an attack of opportunity when you attempt to trip an opponent while you are unarmed.

    Whirlwind Attack [General] [Fighter] [Finesse]

    Prerequisites: Dex 13, Int 13, Combat Expertise, Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, base attack bonus +4.
    Benefit: As a full-round action, you may make a single melee attack at your highest base attack bonus against every foe you threaten. For each six [Fighter] Feats you have or gain, including this one, you can make one additional attack against each foe.
    For each [Finesse] feats you have or gain, including this one, you may move 5 ft. during this action. You are not limited by your normal movement speed(s) when moving this way. If this brings new foes within your reach, you can attack them as well. You may not turn more than 90 degrees in any single square. This movement never provokes attacks of opportunity.

    Dodge [General] [Fighter] [Finesse]
    Prerequisite: Dex 13.
    Benefit: You gain +1 dodge bonus to your AC. Once per round, you can declare a dodge to avoid all damage from a single attack as a free action. A condition that makes you lose your Dexterity bonus to Armor Class (if any) also makes you lose dodge bonuses, and makes you unable to avoid damage via this feat. Also, dodge bonuses stack with each other, unlike most other types of bonuses.
    Each two [Finesse] feats you have or gain increases the dodge bonus by 1.
    Each five [Fighter] feats you have or gain allow you to completely avoid damage from one additional attack per round.

    Mobility [General] [Fighter] [Finesse]
    Prerequisites: Dex 13, Dodge.
    Benefit: You get a +4 dodge bonus to Armor Class against attacks of opportunity caused when you move out of or within a threatened area. A condition that makes you lose your Dexterity bonus to Armor Class (if any) also makes you lose dodge bonuses. Dodge bonuses stack with each other, unlike most types of bonuses. Once per round, you can automatically move through a square occupied by any opponent, or a square covered in difficult terrain.
    For each two [Finesse] feats you have or gain the dodge bonus you gain increases by 1.
    For each three [Finesse] feats you have or gain you gain a 5' untyped bonus to your speed.
    For each three [Fighter] feats you have or gain you can bypass one more square per round.
    Normal: You can't move through squares occupied by hostile opponents, unless they're helpless or radically different size.

    Spring Attack [General] [Fighter] [Finesse]
    Prerequisites: Dex 13, Dodge, Mobility, base attack bonus +4.
    Benefit: When using the attack action with a melee weapon or unarmed strike, you can move both before and after the attack, provided that your total distance moved is not greater than your speed. Moving in this way does not provoke an attack of opportunity from the defender you attack, though it might provoke attacks of opportunity from other creatures, if appropriate. You can’t use this feat if you are wearing heavy armor.

    For each 5' you move before your attack, you gain +1 circumstance bonus to your attack rolls and damage, up to the number of [Finesse] feats you have, including this one. If you have eight or more [Fighter] feats, including this one, you can move before and after a Full Attack.

    Initially, you must move at least 5 feet both before and after you make your attack in order to utilize the benefits of Spring Attack. If you have five or more [Finesse] feats, including this one, you don't have to move before an attack, only after it.

    Combat Reflexes [General] [Fighter] [Finesse]
    Benefit: You may make a number of additional attacks of opportunity equal to your Dexterity bonus. With this feat, you may also make attacks of opportunity while flat-footed.
    For each [Fighter] feat you have or gain, excluding this one, all Tumble DCs to get past you without provoking attacks or opportunity rise by 3.
    For each two [Finesse] feats you have or gain, including this one, you can make on additional attack of opportunity.
    Normal: A character without this feat can make only one attack of opportunity per round and can’t make attacks of opportunity while flat-footed.
    Special: The Combat Reflexes feat only allows a rogue to use her opportunist ability more than once per round if said rogue has six or more [Finesse] feats.

    Improved Initiative [General] [Fighter] [Guile]
    Benefit:You get a +4 bonus on initiative checks. For each two [Fighter] feats you have or gain, this bonus increases by 1.
    If you have three or more [Guile] feats, including this one, you can at the start of combat swap initiative check results with any friendly character within 30' who scored lower than you. If you have six or more [Guile] feats, including this one, you can reroll your initiative check after taking this action.

    Blind-Fight [General] [Fighter] [Monastic]
    Benefit: In melee, all miss chances your opponents have are halved against your attacks. If you have six or more [Fighter] feats, including this one, you can make attacks of opportunity against targets with total concealment as long as you know which square they're in.

    An invisible attacker gets no advantages related to hitting you in melee. That is, you don’t lose your Dexterity bonus to Armor Class, and the attacker doesn’t get the usual +2 bonus for being invisible. The invisible attacker’s bonuses do still apply for ranged attacks, however.

    You take only half the usual penalty to speed for being unable to see. Darkness and poor visibility in general reduces your speed to three-quarters normal, instead of one-half. If you have eight or more [Fighter] feats, including this one, you take no penalty to speed at all.

    If you have six or more [Monastic] feats, you gain Lowlight vision up to three times the range of your normal vision. If you already have Lowlight Vision from some source, you get Scent ability up to 60' instead.
    Normal: Regular attack roll modifiers for invisible attackers trying to hit you apply, and you lose your Dexterity bonus to AC. The speed reduction for darkness and poor visibility also applies. You can't make attacks of opportunity against targets with total concealment.
    Special: The Blind-Fight feat is of no use against a character who is the subject of a blink spell.

    Improved Shield Bash [General] [Fighter] [Brawn]
    Prerequisite: Shield Proficiency.
    Benefit: When you perform a shield bash, you may still apply the shield’s shield bonus to your AC. For each [Fighter] feat you have or gain, including this one, the penalties to your attack rolls reduce by 1, to the minimum of 0.
    For each three [Brawn] feats you have or gain, including this one, the damage your shield does increases by one step, as if it'd grown one size category larger: 1d2, 1d3, 1d4, 1d6, 1d8, 2d6, 3d6, 4d6, 6d6, 8d6, 12d6. .
    If you have more than five [Brawn] feats, including this one, and hit with a shield bash, you may follow it up with a bull rush attempt as free action.
    Normal: Without this feat, a character who performs a shield bash loses the shield’s shield bonus to AC until his or her next turn.
    Special: A fighter may select Improved Shield Bash as one of his fighter bonus feats.

    Improved Unarmed Strike [General] [Fighter] [Monastic]
    Benefit: You are considered to be armed even when unarmed —that is, you do not provoke attacks or opportunity from armed opponents when you attack them while unarmed. However, you still get an attack of opportunity against any opponent who makes an unarmed attack on you.

    In addition, your unarmed strikes can deal lethal or nonlethal damage, at your option.
    Normal: Without this feat, you are considered unarmed when attacking with an unarmed strike, and you can deal only nonlethal damage with such an attack.
    For each five [Fighter] feats you have or gain, including this one, the damage of your unarmed strikes rise by one step, as if you'd grown one size larger: 1d2, 1d3, 1d4, 1d6, 1d8, 2d6, 3d6, 4d6, 6d6, 8d6, 12d6.
    For each ten [Fighter] feats you have or gain, including this one, your reach with unarmed strikes increases by 5'. You can still attack adjacent squares.
    If you have four or more [Monastic] feats, you get to add your Wisdom modifier (if positive) to your attack rolls as an Insight bonus.

    Deflect Arrows [General] [Fighter] [Monastic]
    Prerequisites: Dex 13, Improved Unarmed Strike.
    Benefit: Once per round when you would normally be hit with a ranged weapon, you may deflect it so that you take no damage from it. For each three [Fighter] feats after this one, you may deflect one additional attack.

    Initially, you must have at least one hand free (holding nothing) to use this feat and be aware of the attack and not flat-footed. If you have at least two [Monastic] feats, including this one, you no longer need free hands. If you have at least four [Monastic] feats, you can use this feat even when flat-footed and unaware of an attack.

    Attempting to deflect a ranged weapon doesn’t count as an action. Unusually massive ranged weapons can’t be deflected. Ranged attacks generated by spell effects can only be deflected if you have ten or more [Fighter] feats, including this one.

    Improved Grapple [General] [Fighter] [Brawn] [Finesse]
    Prerequisites: Improved Unarmed Strike and either Str or Dex 13
    Benefit: You do not provoke an attack of opportunity when you make a touch attack to start a grapple. You also gain a +4 bonus on all grapple checks, regardless of whether you started the grapple.
    For each two [Fighter] feats you have or gain the bonus to your grapple checks increaes by 1.
    For each five [Brawn] feats you have or gain, you can grab and hold an opponent one size category larger than normal. So, with five feats you can hold an enemy 2 categories larger, and with ten, an enemy 3 size categories larger.
    If you have at least three [Finesse] feats, you retain your Dex modifier to AC against opponents you aren't grappling.
    Normal: Without this feat, you provoke an attack of opportunity when you make a touch attack to start a grapple. You can't hold an enemy 2 or more size categories larger than you.
    Special: A monk may select Improved Grapple as a bonus feat at 1st level, even if she does not meet the prerequisites. A monk may substitute his number of [Monastic] feats for [Brawn] feats.

    Snatch Arrows [General] [Fighter] [Monastic]
    Prerequisites: Dex 15, Deflect Arrows, Improved Unarmed Strike.
    Benefit: When using the Deflect Arrows feat you may catch the weapon instead of just deflecting it. Thrown weapons can immediately be thrown back at the original attacker (even though it isn’t your turn) or kept for later use. You must have at least one hand free (holding nothing) to use this feat.
    If you have at least four [Monastic] feats, including this one, when throwing a snatched thrown weapon back at the original attacker, he doesn't gain his Dex modifier to AC against the attack. If you have six or more [Monastic] feats, you can instead throw the snatched weapon towards any foe within its range.
    If you have ten or more [Fighter] feats, including this one, you can spend additional use of Deflect Arrows and throw back a ranged attack generated by a spell.

    Stunning Fist [General] [Fighter] [Guile] [Monastic]
    Prerequisites: Wis 13, Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +5.
    Benefit: You must declare that you are using this feat before you make your attack roll (thus, a failed attack roll ruins the attempt). Stunning Fist forces a foe damaged by your unarmed attack to make a Fortitude saving throw (DC 10 + ˝ your character level + your Wis modifier + the amount of [Guile] feats you have), in addition to dealing damage normally. A defender who fails this saving throw is stunned for 1 round (until just before your next action). A stunned creature drops everything held, can’t take actions, takes a -2 penalty to AC, and loses his Dexterity bonus to AC. You may attempt a stunning attack (1 + the amount of [Fighter] feats you have + 1/4 your character level) times per day (but see Special), and no more than once per round. Constructs, oozes, plants, undead, incorporeal creatures, and creatures immune to critical hits cannot be stunned.
    Special: A monk who selects this feat may attempt a stunning attack extra number of times per day equal to her monk level, plus one more time per day for every four levels she has in classes other than monk. Finally, a Monk with at least three [Monastic] feats can opt to make his targed Nauseated for 1d3 rounds instead of stunning them.
    Last edited by Frozen_Feet; 2013-08-18 at 03:42 AM. Reason: Update
    "It's the fate of all things under the sky,
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Hummmm....would a +1 curimstance bonus per fighter feat be too much?

    Maybe make fighter trees. So noly some feats help each other.

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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    I'm not thinking just the flat +x bonuses to stuff. Some feats could conceivably be given completely new functions if enough other feats are gained; kinda like some psionic powers work when augmented.

    Besides, the worth of +x depends on what it is given to. I doubt a Fighter having +16 circumstance to hit at CL 20 would be all that broken, or even meaningful. In any case, just giving bigger numbers is not the main goal of the renovation.

    The idea of trees is a decent one, and one I've thought about quite a bit. I think I'll eventually give some [Fighter] feats an additionals tag, from [Brawn], [Finesse], [Tenacity] and [Guile].

    • [Brawn] will be given to feats that support Strenght. (Power Attack, Imp. Bullrush)
    • [Finesse] will be given to feats that support Dexterity. (Weapon Finesse, Dodge)
    • [Tenacity] will be given to feats that support Constitution. (Toughness, Endurance)
    • [Guile] will be given to feats that support mental stats. (Combat Expertise)


    So not only will all [Fighter] feats support each other, some feats get additional mileage from being used together. My only concern is that at high levels, this might get complicated and a level up might mean recounting many abilities of a character, but I'm not convinced it would be worse than, say, book-keeping for a Wizard or Psion is now.
    Last edited by Frozen_Feet; 2010-06-03 at 04:56 PM.
    "It's the fate of all things under the sky,
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    DragoonWraith's Avatar

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Well, (Greater) Weapon Focus/Specialization are four awful feats...

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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    As an example on how this might work, I present remodeled W. Foc., W. Spec. and Ex. Wep. Proficiency. I would've added G. Foc. anf G. Spec., but didn't have any great ideas for them yet. Scaling the base feats makes them sort of redundant.

    Exotic Weapon Proficiency [General] [Fighter]

    When you take this feat, you gain proficiency with new exotic weapon type for each two [Fighter] feats you have, including this one. For each two new [Fighter] feats you gain, you get a new proficiency.
    Prerequisite: Base attack bonus +1 (plus Str 13 for bastard sword or dwarven waraxe).
    Benefit: You make attack rolls with the weapon normally.
    Normal: A character who uses a weapon with which he or she is not proficient takes a -4 penalty on attack rolls.
    Special: A fighter may select Exotic Weapon Proficiency as one of his fighter bonus feats.

    Weapon Focus [General] [Fighter] [Finesse]


    Choose one type of weapon for each two [Fighter] feats you have, including this one. You can also choose unarmed strike or grapple (or ray, if you are a spellcaster) as your weapon for purposes of this feat. For each two new [Fighter] feats you gain, you can apply this feat to a new weapon.
    Prerequisites: Proficiency with selected weapons, base attack bonus +1.
    Benefit: You gain a +1 bonus on all attack rolls you make using the selected weapon. For each two [Finesse] feats you have or gain, including this one, the bonus rises by +1.
    Special: A fighter may select Weapon Focus as one of his fighter bonus feats. He must have Weapon Focus with a weapon to gain the Weapon Specialization feat for that weapon.

    Weapon Specialization [General] [Fighter]


    You deal extra damage when using weapons you have applied Weapon Focus to.
    Prerequisites: Proficiency with selected weapons, Weapon Focus with selected weapons, fighter level 4th.
    Benefit: For each two [Fighter] feats you have or gain, including this one, tou gain a +2 bonus on all damage rolls you make using the selected weapons.
    Special: A fighter may select Weapon Specialization as one of his fighter bonus feats.
    "It's the fate of all things under the sky,
    to grow old and wither and die."

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    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Quote Originally Posted by DragoonWraith View Post
    Well, (Greater) Weapon Focus/Specialization are four awful feats...
    Specialization no one would disagree with. Some would argue that Weapon Focus is a good feat, just bland.

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    DragoonWraith's Avatar

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    They would be wrong, though. +1 to attack rolls is not worth a feat, not ever. The only time anyone should ever take that feat is if it opens up a PrC.

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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Well, does the proposed fix make it any better or more interesting?

    Okay, I got it: weapon mastery tree needs souping up. Lets not get too hung up on that. What other lackluster feats there are? Toughness, Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack and Whirlwind Attack come to mind.
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Approximately 90% of non-metamagic feats are exceedingly lackluster. Good feats are ones that open up new opportunities, not ones that merely provide bonuses.

    For example, your improvements on Weapon Focus make it numerically stronger, but it's still boring and still fairly ineffective. The Fighter is GOOD at hitting things...it's just that hitting things is a terrible way to fight in standard 3.5.

    Good feats, in my opinion, are things like the Tactical feats (in theory, at least). They provide a number of new and interesting options, rather than small improvements to existing abilities. To make a valid Fighter, feats have to be able to replace or really complement class abilities, something that a +1 bonus to something can never do. A Wizard taking Forcecage suddenly has a completely new tactic to use in battle. Ideally, a Fighter taking Greater Weapon Focus (to pick a feat at random) should gain a completely new capability as well. He should look forward to new feats just like a Wizard looks forward to new spells: it's a chance to improve what he does, uncover new possibilities, and open up the possibility for more strategies.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    I agree with you Djinn, but what ways are there for feats to increase tactical versatility? Standstill, I reckon, is a good example because it allows you to do something you couldn't before with AoOs, and it controls placing and action ecnomy of the opponent.
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    I agree with the above: A +1 or even a +2 bonus is not something I spend a feat on.

    In terms of useful feats, Two-Weapon Fighting, Deadly defence, and Combat expertise spring to mind. Ditto on the best feats giving you something new to play with. At high levels, I tend to lean away from actual bonuses and more towards "Tricks".

    The non spell focus spellcasting feats are generally awsome.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Well, in core, Combat Expertise and Power Attack at least open up some options, namely hitting harder and defendind better. Combat Reflexes does too, in a way. Theoretically, Whirlwind Attack as well, but that on just sucks.

    Let's just go through the list, in fact:
    Combat Expertise, Whirlwind Attack, Combat Reflexes, Spring Attack, Deflect Arrows, Stunning Fist, Ride-by attack, Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Power Attack, Cleave, Quick Draw, Two-weapon fighting and Weapon Finesse all give new things for martial characters, and they are all at least a little interesting.
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Quote Originally Posted by DragoonWraith View Post
    They would be wrong, though. +1 to attack rolls is not worth a feat, not ever. The only time anyone should ever take that feat is if it opens up a PrC.
    To add insult to injury, Epic Prowess, an Epic feat, does nothing but give a paltry +1 to attack rolls.

    This feat sits next to Epic Spellcasting.

    Really, after taking my sweet time to read trough Epic feats again, I've realized damn near all of them offer only minor, static bonuses, or replicate effects that were available 10 levels ago in form of spells or magic items. Most of them will be made redundant or incorporated into earlier feats as I start working.
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Well, some epic feats are only epic because you can get them more than once and they stack. They still suck.

    I always thought tactical feats were awesome.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    The idea of Tactical Feats is awesome. The execution is awful.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    I agree with the above posts, Tactical feats are cool, but Have to high Pre-reqs and so damm many pre-reqs that it makes it quite hard to get them, and you're better off with something else. Perhaps something needs to be done about the availability of feats, for if we got a feat every level, maybe we'd look kindly on taking that +1 or +2 or think about getting a bunch of mediocre feats to get a tactical or other nice feat.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Quote Originally Posted by Cadian 9th View Post
    I agree with the above: A +1 or even a +2 bonus is not something I spend a feat on.
    What if those bonuses were doubled (tripled?) and applied to a weapon group instead?

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    I still don't think that's enough. A +numeric bonus, excepting +4 and higher, is just not something that compares well to a whole new "Trick" such as Improved Diversion or Quick Recontier.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    It's an old problem: basically, on high levels, the fighter can hit whatever he meets in close combat, even with some of his iteratives. If he is a charger or otherwise damage focused, he can usually also dish out enough damage to kill whatever it is in close combat.
    The problem is that there are many, many ways to make a fighter unable to find, reach or hit his enemy which don't rely on attack rolls, several ways to make yourself unkillable which more or less ignore damage (though those tend to be very cheesy), and ways to kill the fighter which neither allow saving throws nor use attack rolls.

    Therefore, even if you gave the fighter another +500 damage and +800 attack a turn, he won't kill any more creatures with it in an encounter his level: either they die to his normal damage output, or he can't really kill them anyway.
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Added a slew of tinkered feats to the first post. Because I'm feeling horribly uninspired for the moment, most had their prerequisites and basic functions left unchanged - however, now all of them get new or improved functionalities depending on other feats. Some of the more notable changes:

    • Dodge is basically Epic Dodge on steroids now. Yes, you read right; I came to the conclusion that fully dodging one attack in a round was not overpowered even for first level. Differing opinions are of course welcome.
    • Mobility allows movement through occupied squares.
    • Spring Attack increases damage and, with enough feats, allows movement with full attack.
    • Improved Feint eventually allows feinting as Swift action.
    • Improved Disarm and Trip eventually give second tries if the first attempt fails.
    • Whirlwind Attack allows movement between attacks, and thus attacking more foes than you could initially reach. Oh, and you eventually get more than one attack against each foe.
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Quote Originally Posted by Cadian 9th View Post
    I agree with the above posts, Tactical feats are cool, but Have to high Pre-reqs and so damm many pre-reqs that it makes it quite hard to get them, and you're better off with something else. Perhaps something needs to be done about the availability of feats, for if we got a feat every level, maybe we'd look kindly on taking that +1 or +2 or think about getting a bunch of mediocre feats to get a tactical or other nice feat.

    Dante
    Could that problem be fixed by the OP's original suggestion? Instead of the normal pre-reqs, just give each one a base ability, and gain the other abilities as you gain more fighter feats.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melayl View Post
    Could that problem be fixed by the OP's original suggestion? Instead of the normal pre-reqs, just give each one a base ability, and gain the other abilities as you gain more fighter feats.
    This is exactly what I'm doing, and one of the reasons many feats will become redundant and have to be reinvented from scratch.

    I'll eventually make a slew of Tactical feats that will use the new functions of the remade feats to do something nifty, such as a feat allowing instant disarm action when you use the negate damage function of the dodge feat, etc. Of coure, since Tactical feats will also have appropriate tags, not only will they allow new functions, they improve the former ones, making the prerequisites more meaningful at the same time.
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Whirlwind attack is still awful. Too many requirements and if you are facing more foes than you have extra attacks, they are either no threat or you are screwed anyways.

    Mobility is still a iffy (A tumble check does the same stuff, but better)

    Weapon Finesse needs to add dex to attack at some point.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    I congratulate you on this. My own feat remake went in a similar direction (i.e. I gave scaling bonuses), but I didn't completely remake any feats. Still, good for you.
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    For Whirlwind Attack, maybe this:
    Whirlwind Attack [Fighter] [Finesse] [Guile]
    Prerequisites:
    • Dex 13, Int 13
    • BAB +4
    • Combat Expertise
    • Dodge
    • Mobility
    • Spring Attack

    Benefit:
    As a full-round action, you may make a single melee attack at your highest base attack bonus against every foe you threaten. For every iterative attack to which you are entitled, you may move 5 ft. and do so again. For every feat you have with either the [Finesse] or the [Guile] descriptor (with the exception of this one), you may move 5 ft. and attack around you once again. You may not turn more than 90 degrees in any single square. This movement never provokes attacks of opportunity.
    When you get it, you're guaranteed to move at least 20 ft. and attack 5 times. Since getting this with only +4 BAB is unlikely, that'll go up. It's still situational so I'm not overly worried about the sheer number of attacks that get made, though I'm somewhat tempted to increase the BAB requirement to make sure we're talking about a point in the game where multiple attacks per round are expected.
    Last edited by DragoonWraith; 2010-06-05 at 10:39 AM.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    [QUOTE=Frozen_Feet;8621673]
    • [Brawn] will be given to feats that support Strenght. (Power Attack, Imp. Bullrush)
    • [Finesse] will be given to feats that support Dexterity. (Weapon Finesse, Dodge)
    • [Tenacity] will be given to feats that support Constitution. (Toughness, Endurance)
    • [Guile] will be given to feats that support mental stats. (Combat Expertise)

    I like this idea, but I think the fighter is a bit stretched as it is.

    A fighter needs a high physical score more then others, because he fights. Casters can buff themselves to compensate, fighters can't. Or atleast not well. This means they have to be more frontloaded with higher stats, and their their feat trees should stick to physical scores to cut them a break. It may not make good fluff, but fluff can work with anything, crunch can't...

    The feats need to be revamped, thats no doubt. And just increasing their power won't do anything unless it actually accomplishes giving the fighter some kind of niche.

    As in 4th edition, classes should aim for "controller, leader, striker, or defender".

    Fighters should have feats that revolve around making them inpenetrable. (Toughness, fast healing, damage reduction) Or actually hitting the oppoent. (Complete buffs to weapon focus/weapon specialization to apply to entire weapon groups)


    Some ideas...
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    Toughness [Defender, Fighter]
    Prequisite: Constitution 13 or higher
    Effect: You gain an additional 3HP. You may take this feat any amount of times, each time increasing the HP amount by 2. (So 3>5>7>etc)

    Improved Toughness [Defender, Fighter]
    Prequisite: Constitution 14 or higher, Toughness
    Effect: Whenever you are dealt damage, you may make a fortitude saving throw equal to damage dealt. If you succeed, you halve that damage.


    Finnese Attacker [Controller, Fighter]
    Prequisite: Dexterity 13 or higher
    Effect: All your attacks with a light weapon are treated as touch attacks.

    Improved Finnease: [Controller, Fighter]
    Prequisite: Dexterity 14 or higher, Finnease Attacker
    Effect: Whenever you succesfuly deal damage to a target with a light weapon, as an extraordinary ability, they take a -2 AC penalty for the remainder of the encounter. This effect can be used multiple times, but only once per target.


    Weapon Focus: [Striker, Fighter]
    Prequisite: Strength 13 or higher
    Effect: Gain +3 on all attack rolls with specified weapon group. You may take this feat multiple times, each time applying to a different weapon group.

    Improved Weapon Focus: [Striker, Fighter]
    Prequisite: Strength 14 or higher, weapon focus
    Effect: 1/day, as an extraordinary ability, you can increase the damage of your weapon attack by +2d8. You may take this feat multiple times, but only may apply a number of extra d8 in damage equal to your fighter level at one time.
    Last edited by Corporate M; 2010-06-05 at 11:19 AM.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Added Improved Initiative, Combat Reflexes and Blind Fight to the first post.

    Quote Originally Posted by DragoonWraith View Post
    For Whirlwind Attack, maybe this:

    When you get it, you're guaranteed to move at least 20 ft. and attack 5 times. Since getting this with only +4 BAB is unlikely, that'll go up. It's still situational so I'm not overly worried about the sheer number of attacks that get made, though I'm somewhat tempted to increase the BAB requirement to make sure we're talking about a point in the game where multiple attacks per round are expected.
    As much as I like your version, there's one problem with allowing to Whirlwind to hit same enemy every time you move: it's strictly better than full attacking. Always. With enough feats, you can dance circles around a single enemy and hit him a dozen times, each hit with your full BAB. I think the two - three hits a high level fighter will get per enemy in my version is sufficient. However, there was certain elegance in your writing, which I will be borrowing.

    Quote Originally Posted by deuxhero View Post
    Whirlwind attack is still awful. Too many requirements and if you are facing more foes than you have extra attacks, they are either no threat or you are screwed anyways.

    Mobility is still a iffy (A tumble check does the same stuff, but better)

    Weapon Finesse needs to add dex to attack at some point.
    I'm not sure I get your point about Whirlwind; what exactly are you referring to with 'extra attacks'? Iteratives? And what correlation does that have with number or toughness of foes?

    Consider, for a moment, that getting Whirlwind is possible at level 4. A human fighter with my version of Whirlwind can have the 6 requisite fighter feats to get a second attack, at his highest BAB. Even against a single enemy, for such a character using Whirlwind would be better than full attacking. Against multiple enemies, it would be significantly better.

    The amount of requirements was a problem because the requirements sucked, something I'm trying to fix here. Also, part of the idea with Synergy is that picking just the right feat this level is not as important, because just picking any feat with right tags will improve all your previous feats.

    I think Mobility has it's place, as it's ability to bypass occupied squares does not rely on a skill check. See my remake of Combat Reflexes for why this could be significant.

    I'll consider about allowing Wep. Finesse to add to damage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Corporate M View Post
    I like this idea, but I think the fighter is a bit stretched as it is.

    A fighter needs a high physical score more then others, because he fights. Casters can buff themselves to compensate, fighters can't. Or atleast not well. This means they have to be more frontloaded with higher stats, and their their feat trees should stick to physical scores to cut them a break. It may not make good fluff, but fluff can work with anything, crunch can't...

    The feats need to be revamped, thats no doubt. And just increasing their power won't do anything unless it actually accomplishes giving the fighter some kind of niche.

    As in 4th edition, classes should aim for "controller, leader, striker, or defender".

    Fighters should have feats that revolve around making them inpenetrable. (Toughness, fast healing, damage reduction) Or actually hitting the oppoent. (Complete buffs to weapon focus/weapon specialization to apply to entire weapon groups)
    The goal is that eventually, you can build a viable fighter based solely on either strenght, dexterity, constitution or mental stats. Similarly, I believe that with right feats, a fighter should be able to work as any of the four archetypes you listed; their overlap with the four categories I chose is not co-incidental.

    As stated, I'll rework all SRD fighter feats, which will eventually include Toughness, Fast Healing and Damage Reduction. Most of your ideas will be incorporated to different feats as synergy bonuses.

    Currently, my rework of Weapon Focus tree already allows it to apply to multiple weapons. As many weapon groups only have few or even no good weapons, I'm not convinced applying Wep. Foc. to a group is better than applying it to multiple singular weapons of your choice.
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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Quote Originally Posted by Corporate M View Post
    Some ideas...
    Toughness [Defender, Fighter]
    Prequisite: Constitution 13 or higher
    Effect: You gain an additional 3HP. You may take this feat any amount of times, each time increasing the HP amount by 2. (So 3>5>7>etc)

    Improved Toughness [Defender, Fighter]
    Prequisite: Constitution 14 or higher, Toughness
    Effect: Whenever you are dealt damage, you may make a fortitude saving throw equal to damage dealt. If you succeed, you halve that damage.
    I wouldn't use Improved Thoughness in any of my games... That kind of ability may be great, but lags the game too much. Roll for attack, then fortitude save... every single time it hits. There's going to be too many dice rolling.

    Maybe give DR/- equal to half your CON mod? It scales, but not enough to turn the fighter into an unstoppable machine, but makes for a very fun ability, specially when you run into a fight with a bunch of lvl1 kobolds and just flat-out ignore all damage dealt by them. Which you should, by a certain point in the game.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    As much as I like your version, there's one problem with allowing to Whirlwind to hit same enemy every time you move: it's strictly better than full attacking. Always.
    You've burned five feats on this - shouldn't it be?

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    With enough feats, you can dance circles around a single enemy and hit him a dozen times, each hit with your full BAB.
    That was pretty much the intention, yes. If you like, you could have your Iteratives be a limit, gaining you 5 ft movement + attack for every [Finesse] and/or [Guile] feat, but only up to the number of attacks to which you would be entitled in a full-attack. Also, a stacking BAB penalty for each move would not be unreasonable, now that I think about it, that should have been in there from the beginning.

    I'd also probably have special rules for dual-wielding - if you have TWF and are wielding two weapons, you may make an attack with each at a -2 penalty in the your original position. If you have ITWF, you may do so again after moving one. If you have GTWF, once again you can move and attack with both. After that, you must use only one weapon, I'd think.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    I think the two - three hits a high level fighter will get per enemy in my version is sufficient.
    There seems to be disagreement on that. Honestly, yeah, I'm not convinced it is sufficient. That is so many feats you need to put into this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    However, there was certain elegance in your writing, which I will be borrowing.
    Heh, well I'm glad I could contribute something.

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    Default Re: Feat synergy

    Epic feats remade A-V and epic feats remade W-Z.

    Those might give you a few ideas, though that project was more about making epic..."epic," not the fighter more fun.

    Anyway, I thought that might help.

    By the way, this reminds me of Fax's d20r feat system.

    I always thought Fax made pretty cool feats with this, this, and this. They have a lot in them, however. The 1/encounter thing balances that a little.

    I support this project, in other words. Don't let it die.
    Last edited by Temotei; 2010-06-05 at 01:45 PM.
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