A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Post Help with CR on homebrew cretaure

    Well, folks i made a creature for somebody on the request a homebrew thread, but the problem is he specifically requested a creature of approx CR16, and I for the life of me canīt push it that high. According to the Vorpal Tribble method of determining CR-which goes thusly:
    1.Divide its average HP by 4.5 to 6,
    4.5 for 5 HD or lower, 5 for 6-10 HD, 5.5 for 11-15 HD, 6 for 16-20 HD.
    2.Add 1 for each five points above 10 its AC is, minusing 1 for every 5 below.
    3.Add 1 for each special attack (+2 to +5 or more if its got a decent number of spells in its spell-like abilities).
    4.Add 1 for each quality unless you deem it worthy of more. Add 1 for each resistance and 10 points of DR it has, and 2 for each immunity.
    5.Add 1 for every two bonus feats it has.
    6.Divide by 3.
    The monsterīs CR is only cca 11. And I donīt think of any ways how to make it go to 16. So please help me.
    The monster is here :
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    Horror in the waves
    Huge Magical beast (Aquatic)
    18d10 HD (118p)
    Speed 20 ft (4 squares) Swim 80 ft. (16 squares); fly 80 ft (16 squares) (poor)
    Init:+8 (+4 dex, +4 improved initiative)
    AC 12; touch 10; flat-footed 10
    (+4 dex, -2 size)
    BAB +13 Grp +31(+12 BA-B, +8 Size +6 Str. mod. +4 racial mod.)
    Attack Tentacle 13 (2d8 +6 plus dreadful strike)
    Full-Attack 8Tentacles +13 melee ((1d6 +6 plus dreadful strike)Bite+11 melee (1d6, +3 plus dreadful strike)
    Space 15 ft.; Reach 15ft
    Special AttacksConstrict( 1d8+6+dreadful strike)Aura of despair, Drain water, dreadful strike , Improved grab
    Special Qualities Telepathy 60 feet Dakvision 60 feet[Low-light vision, Chromatophores
    Saves Fort +11 Ref +11 Will +6
    Abilities Str 23, Dex 18, Con 15, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 15
    SkillsIntimidate +21 Jump+10 Listen +5 Search+2 Spot+5 Swim+10 Hide+6
    Feats Alertness, Dodge, Improved initiative,Mobility, Power attack<sup.>B</sup> Spring attack, Multiattack<sup.>B</sup>
    Environment Temperate aquatic, temperate plains,
    OrganizationSolitary, gang (2-4) or school (5-30) (commonly domesticated)
    Challenge Rating X
    Treasure None
    Alignment usually Lawful
    Advancement 12-18 HD (Huge) 18-22 (Gargantuan)
    Level Adjustment +X

    A Horror stands 20 feet fall from head to tips of tentacles and weights about 3,5 tons because as a cephalopod most of its body is composed of water- Despite itīs size and Buckley body it it well maneuverable both on seas and land, and because it is fast observant an and determined tracker, Therefore the merfolk use it a as watcher and a guard to track down intruders and criminals.:Their fearsome appearance an the ability to crush the opponents hearts with horror and despair is a great asset in .this.
    Horrors in the waves speak Aquan and Common but the are quiet and taciturn,- even among their friend and allies, using their telepathic abilities to communicate instead.

    Combat
    The Watcher most commonly hunts in packs like a wolf would with lathe lead up front to c intimidate their prey and attempt to wear down it morale by the aura of despair.. In single combat it uses it agility a skill in psychological warfare for itīs hit and run tactics, usually followed by a full attack with tier tentacle and beak or a grapple- An opponent can sunder the Horrorīs tentacles as with a sqiud( 10 hit points each, severing it does 5 points of damage to the creature

    Aura of despair (Su) Th horror in the waves may cause a deep despair to fall over any creature within a 30 feet radius around it that can see it unless the creature makes a DC 21 Will save. Affected creatures take a -4 morale penalty on ability check attack roll damask rolls saving throws and skill checks.. This effect stacks with with fear effects. An opponent that succeeds on the saving throw is immune to that same Horrorīs aura of despair for 24Ļ hours. The save DC is Charisma based.
    If a panicked creature is affected with an aura of despair, it loses all hope and attempts to commit suicide by the fastest and most efficient means possible. (as death urge psychic power) unless it makes a Will save against the lower DC of the two effects.

    Dreadful strike (Su)
    A creature that is struck by the Watcher in melee combat must make a Will save against DC 18 or be shaken for 1d6 round. A creature that successfully saves cannot be affected by that same Horrorīs dreadful strike for one minute.

    Drain water (Ex) As water based creatures the Horrors need a regular supply of water, as much as four gallons a day To maintain a regular supply while travelling overland the Horrors have developed the ability to drain water from other creatures with their tentacles. in a disturbing and disgusting invasion of their opponentīs personal space. A Horror can suck blood from a living victim with its tentacles by making a successful grapple check. If it pins the foe, it drains water, dealing 1d4 points of Constitution damage each round the pin is maintained. It drains and drinks a gallon of water per each point of constitution damage dealt, possibly causing dehydration.

    Tentacle autototomy Ex)
    If a Horrorīs tentacle is severely damaged, or it would prove advantageous, the creature can choose to,,let it got” as a free action, severing it and letting it fall into its space or any square within itīs reach as it chooses. The Horror usually chooses not to The severed tentacle as well a any appendages that might have been severed continue to twitch for 1d4 rounds and any creature present the same space as a tentacle at that time must make a Reflex saving throw against DC 25 or be entangled for as long as the tentacle moves. The save DC is Strength based. The Hoorror usually chooses not to use this ability if it has four or less tentacles remaining.

    Chromatophores(Ex)
    A horror in the waves has special cells in tissues that let it change colour to better blend into surroundings, giving it a +6 circumstance bonus to Hide checks It can also use them t mesmerise opponents with a swirl or rapidly shifting colours. As a full round action a horror can use use thir gaudy skin colour to fascinate any creature within a 40 ircle centered on the Horror that can see them This mind affecting effect lasts 1d4 rounds. They can make a Will save against DC 21 to avoid it.
    Constrict (Ex)
    A giant squid deals 1d6+8 points of damage with a successful grapple check.

    Jet (Ex)
    A gHorror in the waves can jet backward while swimming or flying once per round as a full-round action, at a speed of 320 feet while swimming or at a speed of 160 feet while flying. It must move in a straight line, but does not provoke attacks of opportunity while jetting.

    Improved Grab (Ex)
    To use this ability, Horror must hit an opponent of any size with a tentacle attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If it wins the grapple check, it establishes a hold and can constrict. *A Horror in the Waves d has a +4 racial bonus on grapple checks.

    Skills
    A Horror in the waves has a +8 racial bonus on any Swim check to perform some special action or avoid a hazard. It can always choose to take 10 on a Swim check, even if distracted or endangered. It can use the run action while swimming, provided it swims in a straight line. A Horror in the waves has a +5 racial bonus on Jump checks,.It has chromatophores that let is change colour (see above) giving it a +6 competence bonus to Hide and Intimidate checks. These bonuses are already included in stat block.

    Magical beast traits
    -Darkvision out to 60 feet and low-light vision.
    -Proficient with its natural weapons only.
    -Proficient with no armor.
    -Magical beasts eat, sleep, and breathe.

    b]Horror in the water lore[/b]
    DC 28 A Horror in the waves is a huge octopus-like creature that can instil misery and despair in others with itīs appearance. They are capable of flight a well as survival on land for extended periods of time. This reveal all magical beast traits.
    DC:33 The touch of their tentacle can frighten opponents, A horror may detach them to entangle opponents. The have the the ability to change their skin colour, an use it to hide from and befuddle other creatures.
    DC 38:If a panicked creature a afflicted by a Horrorīs despair, itīs mind is broken, and it attempts to end itīs life as fast as possible.

    So thank you in advance for your efforts and also PEACH please.
    Last edited by ScIaDrd; 2010-06-05 at 02:03 PM.
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  2. - Top - End - #2
    Troll in the Playground
     
    PirateGirl

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    Default Re: Help with CR on homebrew cretaure

    Okay, I'll take a look at this

    It reminds me of an advanced Octopus so you aren't grabbing me with originality. The name doesn't grab me. A Horror in the Waves sounds like it should be an Aberration and not a Magical Beast. That said, let's get to the meat of this thing. It is more powerful than you originally thought.

    Type: Magical Beast (Aquatic). This means that it cannot breathe air unless it also has the Amphibious special quality.

    Hit Dice is missing bonus hp from Con. It gets 36 bonus hp from it's Con and HD.

    Hit Dice: 18d10+36 (135 hp)

    Speed: you gave it a fly speed but did nothing with it. It feels tacked on. You don't mention how it flies when it attacks and it has no feats for flying creature. Flight isn't something that you just "give" to a creature it should be part of of its anatomy like having wings. I'd recommend losing the flight speed since it can't breath out of water as it doesn't have the Amphibious special quality as I stated earlier.

    BAB is + 18 because it is a Magical Beast. It gets Full BAB just like a Fighter.
    Grapple is +36. (BAB +18, Size +8, Str +6, racial +4l)

    BAB/Grapple: +18/+36

    Attack numbers are wrong: BAB + Str + Size = 18 + 6 -2 for a total of +22

    Attack: Tentacle +22 melee (1d8+6 plus dreadful strike)
    Full Attack: 8 tentacles + 22 melee (1d8+6 plus dreadful strike) and bite +20 melee (1d6+3 plus dreadful strike)

    List your special abilities and special qualities in alphabetic order so you don't forget something. Jet is missing from the list.

    You have the wrong number of feats. Bonus feats don't count towards the full number of feats. It should have 7 feats plus bonus feats. Multiattack and Power Attack aren't bonus feats for this creature. It has enough HD that it qualifies for those feats. It you want to give it another feat, that feat would be the bonus feat.

    Debby
    Last edited by Debihuman; 2010-06-06 at 01:13 PM.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Colossus in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Help with CR on homebrew cretaure

    Personally, I would put its CR somewhere around 8-10, mainly because its to-hit is a joke and nobody is going to be failing those saves above those levels
    Quote Originally Posted by Inevitability View Post
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    1. Describing basically the exact same monster but with twice the RHD.
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  4. - Top - End - #4
    Titan in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Help with CR on homebrew cretaure

    Its AC is a joke. At level 16 a fighter can easily have have a +23/+18/+13 to hit without magical weapon enhancements...

    Maybe with a +15 or more to natural armor...

    EDIT: With tentacles and bite it should have an additional +6 to hit from strength.
    Last edited by PersonMan; 2010-06-06 at 07:31 PM.
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  5. - Top - End - #5
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Post Re: Help with CR on homebrew cretaure

    I īm back ..finally (sorry about that, real life kinda caught up to me), but with a new and improved creature and (I hope)with 95% of the mechanical bugs ironed out. So here goes:
    (and I sure like using parentheses way too much do I?)
    Spoiler
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    Horror in the waves
    Huge Magical beast (Aquatic)
    18d10 HD (126 HP)
    Speed 20 ft (4 squares) Swim 80 ft. (16 squares); fly 80 ft (16 squares) (poor)
    Init:+8 (+4 dex, +4 improved initiative)
    AC 31,touch 12; flat-footed 27
    (+10 base,+4 dex, -2 size +19 natural])
    BAB +18 Grp +36(+18 BAB, +8 Size +6 Str. mod. +4 racial mod.)
    Attack Tentacle +23 meele (2d8 +6 plus dreadful strike)
    Full-Attack 8Tentacles +23 melee ((1d6 +6 plus dreadful strike)Bite +19 melee (1d6 +3) (10+ 19 Base attack bonus, +6 Strength, -2 size)
    Space 15 ft.; Reach 15ft
    Special Attacks Aura of despair,Constrict( 1d8+6+dreadful strike), Drain water, Dreadful strike Forceful blast. Gaze of hopelessness, Improved grab
    Special Qualities Amphibous Chromatophores Dakvision 60 feet, Low-light vision,, Jet Telepathy 60 feet Spell resistance 20
    Saves Fort +11 Ref +11 Will +6
    Abilities Str 23, Dex 18, Con 15, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 15
    SkillsIntimidate +21 Jump+10 Listen +5 Search+2 Spot+5 Swim+10 Hide+6
    Feats Ability focus (Aura of despair) <sup.>B</sup> Alertness, Dodge, Flyby attack <sup.>B</sup> Improved initiative,Mobility, Power attack,Spring attack, Multiattack,
    Environment Temperate aquatic, temperate plains,
    OrganizationSolitary, gang (2-4) or school (4-16)
    Challenge Rating 15
    Treasure None
    Alignment usually Lawful
    Advancement 18-22 HD (Huge) 23-27 (Gargantuan)
    Level Adjustment +X

    A Horror stands 20 feet fall from head to tips of tentacles and weights about 3,5 tons because as a cephalopod most of its body is composed of water- Despite itīs size and bulky body it it well maneuverable both on seas and land, and because it is fast observant an and determined tracker, Therefore the merfolk use it a as watcher and a guard to track down intruders and criminals.:Their fearsome appearance an the ability to crush the opponents hearts with horror and despair is a great asset in .this.
    Horrors in the waves speak Aquan and Common but the are quiet and taciturn,- even among their friend and allies, using their telepathic abilities to communicate instead

    Combat
    The Watcher most commonly hunts in packs like a wolf would with a leader up front to intimidate their prey and attempt to wear down it morale by the aura of despair.. In single combat it uses it agility a skill in psychological warfare for itīs hit and run tactics, usually followed by a full attack with their tentacle and beak or a grapple- An opponent can sunder the Horrorīs tentacles as with a sqiud ( 10 hit points each, severing it does 5 points of damage to the creature)

    Aura of despair (Su) Th horror in the waves may cause a deep despair to fall over any creature within a 30 feet radius around it that can see it unless the creature makes a DC 23 Will save. Affected creatures take a -4 morale penalty on ability checks, attack roll, damage rolls, saving throws and skill checks.. This effect stacks with with fear effects. An opponent that succeeds on the saving throw is immune to that same Horrorīs aura of despair for 24Ļ hours. The save DC is Charisma based.
    If a panicked creature is affected with an aura of despair, it loses all hope and attempts to commit suicide by the fastest and most efficient means possible. (as death urge psychic power) unless it makes a Will save against the lower DC of the two effects.

    A Horror stands 20 feet fall from head to tips of tentacles and weights about 3,5 tons because as a cephalopod most of its body is composed of water- Despite itīs size and bulky body it it well maneuverable both on seas and land, and because it is fast observant an and determined tracker, Therefore the merfolk use it a as watcher and a guard to track down intruders and criminals.:Their fearsome appearance an the ability to crush the opponents hearts with horror and despair is a great asset in .this.
    Horrors in the waves speak Aquan and Common but the are quiet and taciturn,- even among their friend and allies, using their telepathic abilities to communicate instead

    Combat
    The Watcher most commonly hunts in packs like a wolf would with lathe lead up front to c intimidate their prey and attempt to wear down it morale by the aura of despair.. In single combat it uses it agility a skill in psychological warfare for itīs hit and run tactics, usually followed by a full attack with their tentacle and beak or a grapple- An opponent can sunder the Horrorīs tentacles as with a sqiud ( 10 hit points each, severing it does 5 points of damage to the creature)

    Aura of despair (Su) Th horror in the waves may cause a deep despair to fall over any creature within a 30 feet radius around it that can see it unless the creature makes a DC 23 Will save. Affected creatures take a -4 morale penalty on ability checks, attack roll, damage rolls, saving throws and skill checks.. This effect stacks with with fear effects. An opponent that succeeds on the saving throw is immune to that same Horrorīs aura of despair for 24Ļ hours. The save DC is Charisma based.
    If a panicked creature is affected with an aura of despair, it loses all hope and attempts to commit suicide by the fastest and most efficient means possible. (as death urge psychic power) unless it makes a Will save against the lower DC of the two effects.


    Dreadful strike (Su)
    A creature that is struck by the Watcherītentacle slap in melee combat must make a Will save against DC 18 or be shaken for 1d6 round.s A creature that successfully saves cannot be affected by that same Horrorīs dreadful strike for one minute.

    Drain water (Ex) As water based creatures the Horrors need a regular supply of water, as much as four gallons a day To maintain a regular supply while traveling overland the Horrors have developed the ability to drain water from other creatures with their tentacles. in a disturbing and disgusting invasion of their opponentīs personal space. A Horror can suck blood from a living victim with its tentacles by making a successful grapple check. If it pins the foe, it drains water, dealing 1d4 points of Constitution damage each round the pin is maintained. It drains and drinks a gallon of water per each point of constitution damage dealt, possibly causing dehydration.

    Tentacle autototomy Ex)
    If a Horrorīs tentacle is severely damaged, or it would prove advantageous, the creature can choose to,,let it got” as a free action, severing it and letting it fall into its space or any square within itīs reach as it chooses. t to The severed tentacle as well as any appendages that might have been severed continue to twitch for 1d4 rounds and any creature present the same space as a tentacle at that time must make a Reflex saving throw against DC 25 or be entangled for as long as the tentacle moves. The save DC is Strength based. The Horror usually chooses not to use this ability if it has four or less tentaclse remaining.

    Constrict (Ex)
    A giant squid deals 1d6+8 points of damage with a successful grapple check. It also automaticly use itīs dreadful strike attack.

    Jet (Ex)
    A Horror in the waves can jet backward while swimming or flying once per round as a full-round action, at a speed of 320 feet while swimming or at a speed of 160 feet while flying. It must move in a straight line, but does not provoke attacks of opportunity while jetting.
    Forceful blast (ex)
    A horror can emit a mighty blast of air or water at itīpray in a manner similar to jetting.,up to 60 feet The target must make a Fortitude save against DC 21 or be stunned for 1d3 rounds and blown back (duration of stun*2 ) feet. This value is for Medium creatures. Double the multiplier for each size category below Medium Large or larger creatures are unaffected. A Horror cannot use Jet or this ability for 1d4 round after using Forceful blast. The save DC is Constitution based.

    [Gaze of hopelessness (Su)
    Any creature within that 30 feet meets the Horrorīs gaze must make a Will save against DC 21 of b afflicted with a bout of melancholy ,taking a -4 penalty t on attack rolls, ability checks, Damage roils, initiative rolls and saving throws for 1d3 rounds. During that time it stand around moping and flat-footed. If it fails the save by 3 or more they must spend their next turn attacking themselves and automaticly dealing a critical hit. If this is not possible they try to injure themselves on the environment, or offer an opening to the nearest enemy,, provoking an attack of opportunity. This is a mind affecting compulsion effect. The save DC is Charisma based.

    Improved Grab (Ex)
    To use this ability, Horror must hit an opponent of any size with a tentacle attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If it wins the grapple check, it establishes a hold and can constrict. *A Horror in the Waves d has a +4 racial bonus on grapple checks.

    Special qualities

    Chromatophores (Ex)
    A horror in the waves has special cells in itīs tissues that let it change colour to better blend into surroundings, giving it a +6 circumstance bonus to Hide checks It can also use them t mesmerise opponents with a swirl or rapidly shifting colours. As a full round action a horror can use use their gaudy skin colour to fascinate any creature within a 40 circle centered on the Horror that can see them This mind affecting effect lasts 1d4 rounds. They can make a Will save against DC 21 to avoid it. The save DC is Charisma based.

    Magical beast traits
    -Darkvision out to 60 feet and low-light vision.
    -Proficient with its natural weapons only.
    -Proficient with no armor.
    -Magical beasts eat, sleep, and breathe.
    Skills
    A Horror in the waves has a +8 racial bonus on any Swim check to perform some special action or avoid a hazard. It can always choose to take 10 on a Swim check, even if distracted or endangered. It can use the run action while swimming, provided it swims in a straight line. A Horror in the waves has a +5 racial bonus on Jump checks.It has chromatophores that let ti change colour (see above) giving it a +6 competence bonus to Hide and Intimidate checks. These bonuses are already included in stat block

    Horror in the waves lore (Knowledge skill:Arcana)
    DC 28 A Horror in the waves is a huge octopus-like creature that can instill misery and despair in others with itīs appearance. They are capable of flight a well as survival on land for extended periods of time. They can travel fast using a sudden burst of air or water, and can use this effect to stun enemies.This reveals all magical beast traits.
    DC:33 The touch of their tentacle can frighten opponents, A horror may detach them to entangle opponents. They have the the ability to change their skin colour, and use it to hide from and befuddle other creatures. Their gaze can induce a suicidal gloom in the weak-willed. They are resistant to spells.
    DC 38:If a panicking creature a afflicted by a Horrorīs despair, itīs mind is broken, and it attempts to end itīs life as fast as possible.

    The only two problems I have with this no, are a) that the bunch of ablities feels a bit overblown--like a bad Christmas tree (but I coundenīt have thought of a better way to up the CR) and b) Itīs still 1 CR point off, the guy who requsted it wanted CR 16 or there so.I think itĺl be okay though, but if you ha an idea for a nice 1 CR ability, feel free to suggest it.
    Thank you again a lot.
    EDIT: Holy wall oītext in a marinade, Batman! Spoilering now.
    Last edited by ScIaDrd; 2010-06-19 at 05:51 PM.
    78% of DM's started their first campaign in a tavern. If you're one of the 22% that didn't, copy and paste this into your signature.

    I started mine in the Playersī house in a large elven city.
    Boring, duh.
    GENERATION 17: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. social experiment

    My Paladinīs to-be motto:
    Peace and love through superior firepower and divine righteousness.
    If you approve, copy and paste this into your signature.

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