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2010-06-12, 07:31 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
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Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
So, I've got a character in the works; a Sorcerer/Mindbender/Recaster. The Recaster gets an ability to add two spells to their spells known from any class list, and I'm curious as to what spells should be used for those two abilities.
The only real problem is both spells need to be 3rd level or lower, as the first time I'll be getting that class ability is at Sorcerer 7, and the second is at Sorcerer 9.
Currently, my spell list looks like this:
0th: acid splash, arcane mark, dancing lights, detect magic, ghost sound, mending, prestidigitation, read magic
1st: charm person, feather fall, mage armor, magic missile, shield
2nd: baleful transposition, glitterdust, wings of cover
3rd: manyjaws, shivering touch
4th: greater mirror image
And a Runestaff that provides access to phantom steed, shrink item, enlarge person and reduce person 3/day, as well as rope trick 1/day.
I'm not really sure where I'm going with my spells at the moment; right now I'd like to have some blasting capability, some BFC, and anything, ANYTHING but buffs (unless those buffs scale hard).
Any suggestions?Now if you don't mind, I am somewhat preoccupied telling the laws of physics to shut up and sit down.
I cast irresistable phantasmal killer as a 4th level spell. No save, just die.
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2010-06-12, 07:36 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2009
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Do you have any fondness for rays? I know you said no buffs, but what about DEbuffs?
Seriously, a Ray of Enfeeblement is a nice level 1 spell. Also, I like the idea of Ray of Clumsiness(haven't actually had a chance to use it in a game).Last edited by Protecar; 2010-06-12 at 07:38 PM.
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Results
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2010-06-12, 07:38 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2009
- Location
- Runite
- Gender
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2010-06-12, 07:38 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Now if you don't mind, I am somewhat preoccupied telling the laws of physics to shut up and sit down.
I cast irresistable phantasmal killer as a 4th level spell. No save, just die.
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2010-06-12, 07:39 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2007
- Location
- Tampa, FL
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Sorcerer's Handbook
The Mailman Build
There are great low-level spells in these.
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2010-06-12, 07:42 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Now if you don't mind, I am somewhat preoccupied telling the laws of physics to shut up and sit down.
I cast irresistable phantasmal killer as a 4th level spell. No save, just die.
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2010-06-12, 07:45 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2005
- Location
- GI Joe Headquarters
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
1st
Grease
Mage armor
Identify
Charm person
Sleep
2nd
glitterdust
Web
See invisibility
Invisibility
Alter self
Bull’s strength
Knock
Rope trick
3rd
Dispel magic
Deep slumber
Heroism
Hold person
Ray of exhaustion
Fly
Blink
Gaseous form
Slow
4th
Black tentacles
Dimension door
Solid fog
Charm monster
Enervation
Polymorph
Stone shape
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2010-06-12, 07:48 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2009
- Location
- Elemental Plane of Paper
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Definitely going to suggest waiting a level with another PrC before going into Recaster. You'd much rather get higher level better spells with Expanded Knowledge. I'd wait even for levels for some great higher level spells, but that's up to you.
2nd:
Barkskin (PHB) - Nice defensive spell
Divine Insight (SpC) - Useful for skill checks
3rd:
Anyspell (SpC) - Very versatile if you can swing it
Blindsight (SpC) - Nice detection spell
Glibness (PHB) - Great, great spell
Metamagic Item (ECS) - Awesome if you're allowed
4th:
Divine Power (PHB) - Gish-in-a-spell
Last Breath (SpC) - Fun and great in Contingencies
5th:
Surge of Fortune (CC) - Worth waiting for
7th:
Giant Size (CA) - Very worth waiting forLast edited by PId6; 2010-06-12 at 07:49 PM.
Rogue Handbook | Warmage Rebuild | Diablo's Assassin | Revised Classes
Potpourri Creation Contest II Winner: Desert Martial Adept Substitution Levels
Potpourri Creation Contest III Best Characterization: Edward the Sly's Lucky Spells
Prestige Class Contest XXI Submission: Child of the Seelie Court
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2010-06-12, 07:48 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2009
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Might I suggest Charm Monster and perhaps Glibness from the bard list? Charm Monster is always a fun spell, and Glibness, what with your Sorc Charisma, will let you Bluff your heart out, so between the two, you can charm and bluff anything under the sun. I know you said no buffs, but Glibness is on of those buffs that is just fun.
Edit: I missed the non Sorc/wiz spell part. Perhaps not charm monster then. Maybe something like Snare then. I'm not really sure. I don't have much other then the SRD at the moment.Last edited by Beorn080; 2010-06-12 at 07:54 PM.
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2010-06-12, 07:54 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Unfortunately, Recaster fits the character, and I've already stretched my resources to the limit dipping Mindbender, so there's not a lot I could dip into again so I could pick up at least a 4th level spell with the second Expanded Knowledge.
FFFFFFFFFF... I forgot that Glibness was 3rd. I thought it was Bard 6. That's the first one for sure, because if there's any social intrigue I'm using my Minor Shape Change to create disguises and Glibness to bluff my heart out.Now if you don't mind, I am somewhat preoccupied telling the laws of physics to shut up and sit down.
I cast irresistable phantasmal killer as a 4th level spell. No save, just die.
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2010-06-12, 07:55 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2009
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Wings of Cover is pretty good.
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2010-06-12, 07:58 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2007
- Location
- Tampa, FL
- Gender
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2010-06-12, 08:01 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Unfortunately, such handbooks either A: Only cover the PHB, or B: Only mention a handful of spells that apply to what that build's doing and/or boost what that build's good at.
Not exactly great for perusing spell lists, to be honest.
Solo's guide, for instance (I <3 his Sorc guide) mentions a now-defunct spell critique list, and only covers PHB spells. The Mailman guide only mentions Blasty spells and Arcane Fusion/GAF.Last edited by RelentlessImp; 2010-06-12 at 08:02 PM.
Now if you don't mind, I am somewhat preoccupied telling the laws of physics to shut up and sit down.
I cast irresistable phantasmal killer as a 4th level spell. No save, just die.
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2010-06-12, 08:02 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2009
- Location
- Elemental Plane of Paper
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Rogue Handbook | Warmage Rebuild | Diablo's Assassin | Revised Classes
Potpourri Creation Contest II Winner: Desert Martial Adept Substitution Levels
Potpourri Creation Contest III Best Characterization: Edward the Sly's Lucky Spells
Prestige Class Contest XXI Submission: Child of the Seelie Court
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2010-06-12, 08:22 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
- Location
- Department of Smiting
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
You can get Haste as a 1st-level spell from the Trapsmith spell list (I know you don't want buffs, but first-level Haste!), or Cure Moderate Wounds as 1st-level and Cure Serious Wounds as 3rd-level from the Runescarred Berserker list.
I'd probably go with Manyjaws and Wings of Cover myself, but I like straightforward spells.
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2010-06-12, 08:25 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2009
- Location
- Elemental Plane of Paper
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Rogue Handbook | Warmage Rebuild | Diablo's Assassin | Revised Classes
Potpourri Creation Contest II Winner: Desert Martial Adept Substitution Levels
Potpourri Creation Contest III Best Characterization: Edward the Sly's Lucky Spells
Prestige Class Contest XXI Submission: Child of the Seelie Court
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2010-06-12, 08:32 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
- Location
- Department of Smiting
- Gender
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2010-06-12, 08:49 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2007
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Now if you don't mind, I am somewhat preoccupied telling the laws of physics to shut up and sit down.
I cast irresistable phantasmal killer as a 4th level spell. No save, just die.
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2010-06-13, 12:23 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2004
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
If you get strong spells at a lower spell level such as 1st level Haste, or anything from the Telflammar Shadowlord spell list, be sure to pick up a Circlet of Rapid Casting from MIC.
If you want to further expand your spells known, consider taking a (non-native) bloodline feat (page 112+).
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2010-06-13, 12:39 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2008
- Gender
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2010-06-13, 12:40 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2006
- Location
- Seattle, WA
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
If you can delay to get a 4th level spell, and you want a decent spell, check out Moon Bolt from the SpC. 1d4 Str damage per 3 CLs. Undead struck must instead will save or be struck helpless for 1d4 rounds.
Let me say that again...1d4 Str damage per 3 CLs.
Use your Recaster ability to slap a free Empower on there, and you are gonna make someone's day VERY unpleasant.
Oh, and it can hit up to 2 targets, assuming they are standing within 15' of each other. Still, its strong enough that even if you COULD only hit one foe, it would be worth the action.
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2010-06-13, 12:36 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2007
- Location
- Tampa, FL
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Are we reading the same handbooks?
Post 4 of the Cleric Handbook has spell suggestions for each spell level, and I see great suggestions from Spell Compendium, Lords of Madness and even Lost Empires of Faerun.
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2010-06-13, 12:50 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2009
- Location
- Iceland
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Darkbolt! 5th level on the Darkness domain list, but 3rd level on the already linked Telflammar Shadowlord list. Mmmm.
Guidance of the Avatar to make the Rogue cry. (Or leap in joy, as you cast it on him.)
Favour of the Martyr, if you can stretch it into getting 4th level spells with Recaster. Doubly so if you are going to cast Celerity.Halfling healer avatar by Akrim.elf.
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2010-06-13, 01:03 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
- Location
- Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
- Gender
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
You can get Haste and Dispel Magic at level 1 from Trapsmith's list.
Since you have a few touch spells, Knight's Move (Cleric 2) might help you (and your fellow Rogue won't he sad about it at all).
The Bite of X series might also seem interesting. Too bad Sirine's Grace is so high in level, it would be a very good spell for you.
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2010-06-13, 01:10 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2009
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
I recall once, seeing a guide for a divine class, that was effectively a wizard divine caster, who got his spells at the level the class he scribes them got it.
Ah, the Archivist. Here is a list of the lowest level divine spells possible, here
http://web.archive.org/web/200805020...d.php?t=515321
Girallon’s Blessing
An extra set of arms is always handy for the party fighter.Last edited by Beorn080; 2010-06-13 at 01:22 PM.
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2010-06-13, 03:20 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2009
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Ring of Blades is a decent "Get away from me!" attack. It has the potential of dealing 11-16 damage on everything around you with no saving throw. It counts as a silvered, magic, slashing weapon for damage resistance. It's a 3rd level Cleric/Warmage spell.
Sandblast is a 10 ft burst 1st level druid spell that deals 1d6 non-lethal damage. The bonus is that it stuns anyone in the area that fails its reflex save. Heighten it for better results.
The Scent spell is a great utility spell. Scent is an oft-overlooked ability and can provide a valuable tool. 2nd level druid, 1st level ranger. Lasts 10 minutes per caster level.Last edited by Hague; 2010-06-13 at 03:30 PM.
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2010-06-13, 03:32 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2010
- Location
- Finland
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Entangle is a great battlefield control spell. Level 1, huge area, long duration, Save every turn and suck even if you pass the save.
Spike Growth might be interesting with right Metamagic. Large area, duration measured in hours, 1d4 damage for every 5' that the enemy moves, halved movement speed if you fail a ref save you likewise have to make for each 5' you move. No save for the damage, and Fell Draining Spike Growth is only 4th level spell.Quotes:Praise for avatar may be directed to Derjuin.Spoiler
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2010-06-13, 03:34 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2008
- Location
- In an Octopus's Garden
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Everything is better with Fell Drain.
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2010-06-13, 03:37 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2010
- Location
- Finland
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Last edited by Greenish; 2010-06-13 at 03:37 PM.
Quotes:Praise for avatar may be directed to Derjuin.Spoiler
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2010-06-13, 03:53 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2009
Re: Best 3rd Level and Lower Spells [3.5, Advice]
Yet another way to start the Wightopcolypse. Cast it at every small village you come across while flying around. Hmm, I could see a crazy druid doing that.
Druid: Well, Wights don't eat plants, so turning every animal into a wight would save my precious trees.