Wait? Big T is NOT immune to mind-effecting stuff? [3.5]

[deuxhero]

I just noticed that. Seriously, I knew it was pathetic (toughness, nuff said) but I never realized it was that bad. It even has a pathetic will save, it's as though you were meant to use dominate monster on it.

It also seems to lack Polymorph immunity, though they target the good saves.

[Jack_Simth]

I just noticed that. Seriously, I knew it was pathetic (toughness, nuff said) but I never realized it was that bad. It even has a pathetic will save, it's as though you were meant to use dominate monster on it.

It also seems to lack Polymorph immunity, though they target the good saves.

Yes, a Wiz-17 with a high Int score can keep Mr. T Dominated for a long, long time. Just hope Mr. T doesn't have a lucky streak at some point. He's not invulnerable.

[Anxe]

Spell Resistance gets in the way for it too.

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

Big T's problem is a lack of reliable options on offense, to the point where a Wiz-17 often has much better things to dominate.

[chiasaur11]

Yeah. It's kinda sad, really.

Got a kind of tragic poetry about it.

[Runestar]

That's why PHB2 printed steadfast determination.

What?!? You didn't notice how it seems to benefit monsters more than players?

Even if you don't dominate it, a heightened slow reduces it to 1 pathetic bite attack each round. Return to filing your nails while the fighters beat it into submission.

Alternatively, slap on the monster of legend template.

[Marriclay]

Alternatively, slap on the monster of legend template.

all things considered, that should probably be done anyway

[VirOath]

Guys, just changing around the feats makes a world of difference. Putting in the Spring Attack line turns the Big T into a landshark supreme. Dig speed, remember? It's not being played right if it just acts like a beat stick and stands topside the whole fight.

And remember, spring attack sucks.

[Elfin]

Yea...I always feel sorry for T, especially as it's a favorite of mine.

As was said on a recent Tarrasque thread, it should have such resistance to magic that melee combat is the only viable way to take it on, rather than the other way around.
Though really, even a decently optimized melee warrior could take Big T down pretty easily.

[Beorn080]

Even better, Big T doesn't have a balance score, at least on the SRD. Guess what FIRST level spell requires balance checks, and guess who's movement speed normally is a mere 20' per round. With his dex, he gets a +3 to balance checks. So, while he is VERY unlikely to fall, at best Big T can move a mere 10' a round, which leave him still inside the first casting and requiring another balance check and a mere 10' of movement that round too.

Who knew a first lvl sorc can, if not defeat, at least get away from Big T.

Edit: Dig speed? The SRD has no dig speed listed, though I'd understand if another source gave it one.

[nargbop]

That's why the tarrasque always has a Beholder mage in his belly wearing a ring of Acid Immunity, chewing slowly on the magical remains of the previously-digested.

[Jack_Simth]

That's why PHB2 printed steadfast determination.

What?!? You didn't notice how it seems to benefit monsters more than players?

Even if you don't dominate it, a heightened slow reduces it to 1 pathetic bite attack each round. Return to filing your nails while the fighters beat it into submission.

Alternatively, slap on the monster of legend template.

Heh, yes. Mr. T has a very poor feat selection. Zap all of those pesky "toughness" feats, replace one of them with Improved Toughness, and what do you know: He's got *more* hit points, and five loose feats. What could Mr. T do with the extra feats?

Maybe....
Toughness 1 -> Improved Toughness
Toughness 2 -> Steadfast Determination
Toughness 3 -> Martial Study (Shadow Jaunt)
Toughness 4 -> Martial Study (Shadow Stride)
Toughness 5 -> Martial Study (Shadow Blink)
Toughness 6 -> Martial Stance (Balance on the Sky)
?

[Ravens_cry]

That's why the tarrasque always has a Beholder mage in his belly wearing a ring of Acid Immunity, chewing slowly on the magical remains of the previously-digested.

Where does a beholder mage, at least one that is an actual beholder and not some cheesed out humanoid PC, wear a facking, feking, ficking. . .well I guess we can skip the next two, ring?

[Beorn080]

Where does a beholder mage, at least one that is an actual beholder and not some cheesed out humanoid PC, wear a facking, feking, ficking. . .well I guess we can skip the next two, ring?

Around an eyestalk? Really, it has room for, what is it, nine?

[KillianHawkeye]

Maybe....
Toughness 1 -> Improved Toughness
Toughness 2 -> Steadfast Determination
Toughness 3 -> Martial Study (Shadow Jaunt)
Toughness 4 -> Martial Study (Shadow Stride)
Toughness 5 -> Martial Study (Shadow Blink)
Toughness 6 -> Martial Stance (Balance on the Sky)
?
Profit!

Fixed that for you.

[Runestar]

Guys, just changing around the feats makes a world of difference. Putting in the Spring Attack line turns the Big T into a landshark supreme. Dig speed, remember? It's not being played right if it just acts like a beat stick and stands topside the whole fight.

And remember, spring attack sucks.

You must mean pounce, since spring attack limits it to just 1 attack/round, and isn't really spectacular with its 20ft speed. At least there is the dire charge epic feat. Plus we can replace its save-booster feats with the epic equivalents. Spellcasting harrier might be useful, as well as rend (draconomicon).

The thing is, the way it is built, it is supposed to be able to stand in place and be a beat-stick/immovable blob.

I think the designers might be on to something with that 30-headed tarrasque variant.

[Keld Denar]

Where does a beholder mage wear a ring?

According to Lords of Madness, the definative source for all things tenticley.

• One headband, hat, or phylactery on the body. A beholder can only wear a helmet specially designed to fit over the creature’s entire body.
• Three pairs of eye lenses or goggles over the central eye and up to two eyestalks (one pair per eye or eyestalk).
• Three amulets, brooches, medallions, necklaces, periapts, or scarabs on up to three eyestalks (one item per eyestalk).
• One belt worn about an eyestalk.
• One pair of bracers or bracelets on a pair of eyestalks.
• Up to three rings on up to three eyestalks (one ring per eyestalk).

So yea, you could fit a beholder inside of a tarrasque with a ring to give him acid immunity and have him devour/magic drain anything that the tarrasque might devour.

[Ravens_cry]

Around an eyestalk? Really, it has room for, what is it, nine?

Does that count as a ring slot? I doubt a giants fingers count as a neck slot, though they might be as thick around as a humans neck.
EDIT: So it does. Huh.

[Glyphic]

Hand of glory.

Bling Beholder!

[Jack_Simth]

Fixed that for you.

The question mark was mostly a matter of hinting that I was also possibly looking for alternate suggestions. Is there something scarier that can be quickly done, just swapping out the toughness feats? Or is a flying, teleporting Mr. T scary enough?

[Keld Denar]

I think that the Big T should take 5 levels of Crinti Marauder. You know, cause I fully embrace the idea of a fully operational shadow pouncing *bamf* OMG ITS EATING MY ARM!!! OH THE HUMANITY! MAKE IT STOP!!!!! DEAR GODS!!!!!

[Jack_Simth]

I think that the Big T should take 5 levels of Crinti Marauder. You know, cause I fully embrace the idea of a fully operational shadow pouncing *bamf* OMG ITS EATING MY ARM!!! OH THE HUMANITY! MAKE IT STOP!!!!! DEAR GODS!!!!!

Yes, but that would, quite rightly, change Mr. T's CR (associated class levels) - merely changing the feats out makes him tougher, but without officially altering the CR.

[Beorn080]

One wonders what a truly optimized feat list for the Big T would look like.

[Thurbane]

Bit T pity the fool that makes him roll a Will save!

[Raistlin1040]

Bit T pity the fool that makes him roll a Will save!

This is what I thought this thread would be about when I clicked the title. Mr. T doesn't need a Will Save though. He wears Bling of +9001 Resistance.

[Eric Tolle]

Yea...I always feel sorry for T, especially as it's a favorite of mine.

As was said on a recent Tarrasque thread, it should have such resistance to magic that melee combat is the only viable way to take it on, rather than the other way around.

Wouldn't that require melee combat to be a viable way to take on anything at high level?

[VirOath]

You must mean pounce, since spring attack limits it to just 1 attack/round, and isn't really spectacular with its 20ft speed. At least there is the dire charge epic feat. Plus we can replace its save-booster feats with the epic equivalents. Spellcasting harrier might be useful, as well as rend (draconomicon).

The thing is, the way it is built, it is supposed to be able to stand in place and be a beat-stick/immovable blob.

I think the designers might be on to something with that 30-headed tarrasque variant.

No, I meant spring attack, just for the really freaking basic, sucky version of what a smart Dm can pull with it. Since it has a Dig Speed and Tremor Sense ((IIRC)) it can make use of it's size and reach. 10ft up to the surface, swallow hole, 10 ft down. Dig speed can opt not to leave tunnels.

Rinse and repeat.

[paddyfool]

No dig speed or tremor sense listed on the SRD.

[Kami2awa]

Yes, a Wiz-17 with a high Int score can keep Mr. T Dominated for a long, long time. Just hope Mr. T doesn't have a lucky streak at some point. He's not invulnerable.

But he is helluva tough!

[ZeroNumerous]

No dig speed or tremor sense listed on the SRD.

He might be working off Pathfinder's version.