Non-magical swordsage build?

[Kinslayer777]

To all those experienced swordsage players out there, is there a non-magical swordsage build? If so, what do you recommend?

[Snake-Aes]

To all those experienced swordsage players out there, is there a non-magical swordsage build? If so, what do you recommend?

What do you define as nonmagical? Strictly speaking, the only things the swordsage does that could be "magical" are the supernatural maneuvers...so you can just avoid those.

[Zore]

Pick maneuvers from Diamond Mind, Tiger Claw and Stone Dragon mostly. Don't pick most of Setting Sun, Desert Wind or Shadow Hand though there are a few in those schools that aren't supernatural.

[Greenish]

Pick maneuvers from Diamond Mind, Tiger Claw and Stone Dragon mostly. Don't pick most of Setting Sun, Desert Wind or Shadow Hand though there are a few in those schools that aren't supernatural.

At quick glance, there isn't a single Supernatural maneuver in the entire Setting Sun school.

[Prime32]

To all those experienced swordsage players out there, is there a non-magical swordsage build? If so, what do you recommend?

Swordsages can't cast spells.

[Zore]

At quick glance, there isn't a single Supernatural maneuver in the entire Setting Sun school.

Ah, my mistake then. I never use Setting Sun and thought there were SU maneuvers in there.

[hamishspence]

Swordsages can't cast spells.

"Magical" can refer to supernatural abilities, spell-like abilities, and whatnot, as well as spells.

It doesn't usually cover Extraordinary abilities though.

[Greenish]

"Magical" can refer to supernatural abilities, spell-like abilities, and whatnot, as well as spells.

It doesn't usually cover Extraordinary abilities though.

There are a number of maneuvers which clearly aren't mundane, yet haven't been tagged as Supernatural, for example the Shadow Hand teleports. Disappearing in a poof of shadow and reappearing 50' away in a blink of an eye is clearly magical, but the maneuvers are all Extraordinary.

That said, only two swordsage schools employ blatantly magical abilities, and even then contain a number of more mundane maneuvers. Making a swordsage focused on the non-magical mastery of arms is relatively painless.

[Frosty]

I think the Monk is actually more magical than the Swordsage...

[hamishspence]

Some Shadow Hand abilities do seem overtly magical despite not being explicitly called out as such- One with Shadow, that makes you incorporeal, is a good example.

Maybe it was an oversight?

[Greenish]

Some Shadow Hand abilities do seem overtly magical despite not being explicitly called out as such- One with Shadow, that makes you incorporeal, is a good example.

Maybe it was an oversight?

Who knows? Maybe the errata clears the things out… oh, wait.

[El Dorado]

I'd avoid Desert Wind and Shadow Hand maneuvers for this. Should be fine otherwise.

[Eldariel]

I'd avoid Desert Wind and Shadow Hand maneuvers for this. Should be fine otherwise.

Desert Wind actually has a few maneuvers of interest; Wind Stride, Flashing Sun & Zephyr Dance are all fine, non-magical maneuvers. Shadow Hand offers the stances; Island of Blades and Assassin's Stance in particular. I'm really a bit disappointed they didn't make a "non-Magical Rogue"-school and a separate "Magical Rogue"-school. That woulda been nice, but we'll work with what we get.

Basically, avoid all "Su"-tagged maneuvers and the few obviously Su non-tagged maneuvers in Shadow Hand, and you're fine. It's not really much of a restriction; you are barely restricted aside from the teleportation, which admittedly hurts a bit to leave behind but at the same time, you can't pick every maneuver ever anyways, and the teleports can be refluffed (since they require Line of Effect and Sight to work) as just some superfast jump or w/e if you want to use them. Though One With Shadow is a loss, but c'est la vie.

[Kinslayer777]

Thanks for the input everybody. If you're interested, I decided to take from the swordsage and customize a class for myself. Your criticism would be appreciated. Click here.