Planescape 3.5 Opinions?

[Jackgar]

Has anyone around here tried out the Planescape Campaign setting made by the guys at http://www.planewalker.com ? I've been on a serious Planescape: Torment kick lately (Easter Egg Morte Tweak is godly), and was considering trying out this 3/3.5 brew.

So if anyone has, in fact, tried it out, what do you think of it?

[arguskos]

*saunters in, crashes in a chair, takes out a mug of bub*

"Oi cutter, sit and let ol' arg flail the bladder fer a spell. Ye got da basics o' da' chant, but yer a clueless yet, an outsider even. Th' City o' Doors, and Her Serenity, be nay a place fer ye clueless berks, but if ye got a few worms in yer brain-box, ye might just be at home in th' Cage."

*sips his bub, spits it out*

"Oi! Barkeep! I need an ale!"

Translation: Planescape is awesome. Go play it.

[Optimystik]

I never understood the need for glossolalia in Planescape threads. I find the setting interesting (moreso for breaking D&D stereotypes well before Eberron came about), but can never understand what people are actually saying about it.

[arguskos]

I never understood the need for glossolalia in Planescape threads. I find the setting interesting (moreso for breaking D&D stereotypes well before Eberron came about), but can never understand what people are actually saying about it.

I enjoy it. Nothing more. It's not hard to follow until folk start breaking out the truly obscure stuff (such as Cager Rhyming Slang or somesuch). For example, beyond the excessive contractions, all I said up there was that if you're a Primer (a native of the Prime Material), you're going to be very lost at first, but if you've got some smarts in your head, you'll fit right in in Sigil.

The setting itself is fascinating, that's true. It's a very philosophical setting in nature, which if you tend towards such things, you'll enjoy. I do however recommend getting your hands on the original source material from AD&D and using the fluff and setting from there, and using the 3.5 update for stats only. That's just me though.

Where's afro when you need him?

[Jackgar]

I never understood the need for glossolalia in Planescape threads. I find the setting interesting (moreso for breaking D&D stereotypes well before Eberron came about), but can never understand what people are actually saying about it.

glossolalia–noun
incomprehensible speech in an imaginary language, sometimes occurring in a trance state, an episode of religious ecstasy, or schizophrenia.

Well there ya go. Apparently, Planescape is capable of inducing religious ecstasy in people. Or Schizophrenia. Probably both. Also, +1 for using the word in the first place.


Anyway, I'm pretty familiar with the fluff, and alot of the reason I'm asking about this version is 1) how well are the stats translated and 2) how well does it work with the changes in the meta-plot, mostly concerning the downfall of the Factions?

[Optimystik]

I enjoy it. Nothing more.

I'm fine with that I'm just wondering if diving into the lingo is the best way to get an outsider acquainted with the setting.

From your passage above, I had no idea that "The Cage" was meant to be Sigil, (because you already called it "Th' City o' Doors" in the previous sentence) or what a "cutter" was. (I thought "berk" was the term for newcomers.) Gah, I'm confusing myself again.

And does everyone talk like that there? Elves too? Outsiders?

@ Jackgar - I'm afraid I can't answer the mechanics questions, so I won't be in the thread much longer, I promise

[Jackgar]

I'm fine with that I'm just wondering if diving into the lingo is the best way to get an outsider acquainted with the setting.

From your passage above, I had no idea that "The Cage" was meant to be Sigil, (because you already called it "Th' City o' Doors" in the previous sentence) or what a "cutter" was. (I thought "berk" was the term for newcomers.) Gah, I'm confusing myself again.

And does everyone talk like that there? Elves too? Outsiders?

I think they at least use the more common terms like berk and cutter. And Sigil's got a whole bunch of nicknames, depending on who you ask, and what context the conversation's in. Like if The Lady is somehow a factor of the conversation, people are more likely to call it The Cage. And if I'm not mistaken, "berk" is more of a catch-all way to refer to someone, like "bastard" or "jerk". "Clueless" seems to be the most oft-used term for newcomers.

[Warpwolf16]

I love Planescape as a setting, it's fun to play in. Ran a few encounters with a group of friends dealing with Exiled Gith's and the resurrection of dead gods and..they died horribly ^^ and only one of them knew victorian era slang and understood what most of everyone in sigil said.

[The Glyphstone]

Arguement about the Lady of Pain's omnipotence inbound in 10.....9.....

[Jackgar]

Arguement about the Lady of Pain's omnipotence inbound in 10.....9.....

SSSSSHHHH! Stop right there! We don't need any Mazing to happen, do we?

Besides, since she's never been given official stats, while everyone and their mom tends to get stated up just for the hell of it, that means she's "beyond" the mechanics, which I'd say makes her pretty darn powerful.

What type of characters do people tend to like better, in terms of the characters' familiarity with the setting? Is it generally more fun to be a Clueless and finding all the strangeness of the setting from those sorts of eyes, or to be someone who knows what the hell is going on, at least in a broader sense?

[Eldan]

Could we please stop these stupid LoP arguments? I'm a huge fan of the setting, sure, but people never seem to get the Lady. Especially not hte fans.


Anyway, Planewalker is pretty good. The stats for races and monsters work well, though a few of the feats are, well, questionable. The setting is different, as it's set a few years after the Faction War, introducing new groups and an advanced timeline.

And as for the slang:
Berk is originally Cockney Rhyming slang. It's a contraction of "Berkshire Hunt", which rhymes with the british slang word "berk" originally stood for. Can't go into more details here.

Cutter, on the other hand, actually means someone powerful or knowledgeable about the planes. A catch-all term for Planewalkers.

[arguskos]

Could we please stop these stupid LoP arguments? I'm a huge fan of the setting, sure, but people never seem to get the Lady. Especially not hte fans.

Amen. Her Serenity is important, but divisive. Let's leave her be, yes?

Anyway, Planewalker is pretty good. The stats for races and monsters work well, though a few of the feats are, well, questionable. The setting is different, as it's set a few years after the Faction War, introducing new groups and an advanced timeline.

This is why I recommend not using their timeline. The Factions were always one of my favorite parts of the setting, and with them gone/changed, it's much different.

And as for the slang:
Berk is originally Cockney Rhyming slang. It's a contraction of "Berkshire Hunt", which rhymes with the british slang word "berk" originally stood for. Can't go into more details here.

Huh. Never knew that.

Cutter, on the other hand, actually means someone powerful or knowledgeable about the planes. A catch-all term for Planewalkers.

Cutter is a catch-all term for Planewalkers, but a better term for the powerful and knowledgeable would be blood, IMO.

@Jackgar: If I'm playing in the setting, I tend to not be playing a berk or clueless. I want to be playing someone with the basics of the chant under control. Sure, there's no sense playing a hende blood (someone who is all that and a bag of chips), since they're so accomplished already. I'd rather play a native Cager who is an old hand in the city, but isn't much of a 'walker.

[Jackgar]

Amen. Her Serenity is important, but divisive. Let's leave her be, yes?


This is why I recommend not using their timeline. The Factions were always one of my favorite parts of the setting, and with them gone/changed, it's much different.


Huh. Never knew that.


Cutter is a catch-all term for Planewalkers, but a better term for the powerful and knowledgeable would be blood, IMO.

@Jackgar: If I'm playing in the setting, I tend to not be playing a berk or clueless. I want to be playing someone with the basics of the chant under control. Sure, there's no sense playing a hende blood (someone who is all that and a bag of chips), since they're so accomplished already. I'd rather play a native Cager who is an old hand in the city, but isn't much of a 'walker.

Have you ever tried a party that's a mix of the two? I imagine having a couple Cagers trying to help a couple Clueness not cross the wrong people would make for some interesting roleplay.

Also, we weren't arguing about The Lady anyway. Just a little joke. Although I'm guessing that's more of a "in general" thing, since I'd imagine her status tends to spark off alot of debate due to her statless nature.

[arguskos]

Have you ever tried a party that's a mix of the two? I imagine having a couple Cagers trying to help a couple Clueness not cross the wrong people would make for some interesting roleplay.

I don't play in the setting much, due to a dearth of DMs for it. Mostly, I run thought experiments and enjoy the ambiance.

Also, we weren't arguing about The Lady anyway. Just a little joke. Although I'm guessing that's more of a "in general" thing, since I'd imagine her status tends to spark off alot of debate due to her statless nature.

Of course not, but her presence tends to... anger people. I'll say no more, lest I draw attention to the issue.

[Jackgar]

I don't play in the setting much, due to a dearth of DMs for it. Mostly, I run thought experiments and enjoy the ambiance.


Of course not, but her presence tends to... anger people. I'll say no more, lest I draw attention to the issue.

Hah, while like I said earlier: SHHHHHHHHHHHH, or we'll get Mazed!

But I think if it were possible to get a dedicated Planescape group, it could be fun to do the mix thing.

[The Tygre]

Oi, pike it ya' cutters! Cry beef on the Lady and the barmies'll beat us by monkeys!

Now, you ain't buyin' no black diamond with the Cage. The Cage just one big berg, n'it? An' you got all the bergs and gates there is, see? This ain't no bricked beast's bellly; s'a whole new ride.

[Optimystik]

^

See, I just can't picture elves talking like that.

[afroakuma]

I am summoned.

What can I do for you?

[arguskos]

^

See, I just can't picture elves talking like that.

I'm currently playing the character my avatar represents and on occasion he talks like that.

I can imagine anything speaking in that fashion.

EDIT: Afro, it is about damnable time. Explain to them why Planescape is awesome.

[The Antigamer]

Just noticed the thread, and wandered in to talk about Afro's current Planescape game and how it's awesome, and see this.

I am summoned.

What can I do for you?

You're everywhere Afro.

[Eldan]

^

See, I just can't picture elves talking like that.

Well, elves aren't very common on most planes anyway. And at least in my games, that slang is mostly restricted to Sigilians, and even there mostly the lower classes (except adventurers. Those are a special case, social class-wise.)

[afroakuma]

Explain to them why Planescape is awesome.

Well, let me see.

Because Planescape is everything.

On top of being every other campaign setting plus the whole of the Inner, Outer and Transitive Planes and the city of Sigil (one of the most well-realized cities in tabletop roleplaying), Planescape maintains a steampunk, Victorian England aesthetic, rolls philosophy into the very nature of the setting and treats you to adventures not grounded in mortal concerns, but in thoughts, decision, investigation.

Also, modrons.

Planescape is made of concentrated awesome and is essentially the DM's ultimate campaign setting. I can't think of a broader, richer canvas on which to paint a game.

Just noticed the thread, and wandered in to talk about Afro's current Planescape game and how it's awesome, and see this.

You're still allowed to do that, you know...

argus? Any opinion on your game?

[The Antigamer]

You're still allowed to do that, you know...

I figured I'd let you get the ball rolling, and that summation was basically everything I could say that wasn't about your game directly. Planescape really is everything, you can go anywhere in it. Many games have an adventuring group's base or home city, a point to which they return to, and then go off on missions around there. In Planscape, Sigil is (usually) your base of operations, and your missions span all of the planes. Today you could be in the wilds of the Beastlands, tomorrow the oceans of the plane of Water, and later on the clockwork Mechanus. It is the ultimate in flexibility, wherever you want to go, whatever you want to do, you can do it, and you'll rub shoulders with every kind of being that exists. Planscape is founded on what you believe, you can even influence the planes themselves if you get enough people to believe with you. Many of my greatest games, both in front of and behind the DM's screen, take place in the Planscape multiverse.

Afro's game in particular is doing a great job of creating a sense that the planes are vast, and there's always something out there that's more powerful than you, and even things more powerful than you can imagine. You are not the center of the multiverse (Hell, there are 5 PC groups in Afro's game, and many more doing the same mission we are), but if you are skillful enough, lucky enough, and believe enough, you can influence the destinies of everything that exists.

[Jackgar]

Well, let me see.

Because Planescape is everything.

On top of being every other campaign setting plus the whole of the Inner, Outer and Transitive Planes and the city of Sigil (one of the most well-realized cities in tabletop roleplaying), Planescape maintains a steampunk, Victorian England aesthetic, rolls philosophy into the very nature of the setting and treats you to adventures not grounded in mortal concerns, but in thoughts, decision, investigation.

Also, modrons.

Planescape is made of concentrated awesome and is essentially the DM's ultimate campaign setting. I can't think of a broader, richer canvas on which to paint a game.



You're still allowed to do that, you know...

argus? Any opinion on your game?

And that's why I wondered if the 3.5 material was worth using. With that sort of incredible, open canvass to work with, there's literally no limit to the sort of games you could run and justify. And 3.5 adding in a bunch of races and classes that didn't exist in 2, and a whole extra world (Eberron) to add to the overall meta that is Planescape, I've been dying to play in it. But I've been so spoiled by 3.5 that I can't see myself ever going back to 2 for it.

[arguskos]

argus? Any opinion on your game?

I have one, yes. I actually suggested that you come and post due to being familiar with the setting.

If you wish to know, currently, it feels much like a standard planar adventure. The sense of wonder we had in Sigil has been replaced with a difficult, uphill crawl to just perform a simple delivery on the planes. For the moment, I wouldn't point to it as a shining example of Planescape as a setting. Instead, I would point to your notes about the campaign as a shining example of Planescape as a setting, for those notes exemplify the breadth and depth that the setting can hold.

The setting itself, well, it's best described through metaphor. Imagine a mural on a gigantic wall, a mural that is composed of hundreds of different art styles, and somehow, this mural has space for you to add whatever you wish and mesh it into the art already there. That's Planescape: the largest canvas possible for you to play in, full of promise and possibility, and yet empty enough for anyone to carve out their own destinies.

[afroakuma]

Admittedly, the delivery is far from simple, and you decided to go to Red Tape Central, so...

[arguskos]

Admittedly, the delivery is far from simple, and you decided to go to Red Tape Central, so...

Like I said, your notes are a better example, no matter what plane we hit. Each single party only gets a minor bit of the whole.

[Jackgar]

Admittedly, the delivery is far from simple, and you decided to go to Red Tape Central, so...

Red Tape Central?

Sounds like the Plane of Law, although I'm sure I'm wrong.

[arguskos]

Red Tape Central?

Sounds like the Plane of Law, although I'm sure I'm wrong.

Mechanus, yes.

[Jackgar]

Mechanus, yes.

Aaaaah, modrons.

Ya know, since the all-Warforged game I've been playing in started, I can't help but wonder what would happen if a Warforged and a Rogue Modron met. I imagine they'd have alot to discuss.