Combat Necromancer [3.5]

[EdroGrimshell]

Okay, i have a character concept to create a necromancer gish.

The guy would have a heavy grim reaper theme, including wielding a scythe, an emphasis on undead grafts, and creating undead from people he's killed (Fell Animate Chill Touch wil help here).

My scores are 12, 14, 15, 16, 17, and 18.

Dread necro or focused necromancer is possible going to be the base spellcasting class

[Keld Denar]

So...yes?

I'd go Dread Necro, they have better BAB IIRC, and are proficient with a single martial weapon AND can cast in armor. They eventually get DR and have a method of healing themselves. While they don't get the REALLY good defensive buffs like an Abjurant Champion's augemented Shield spell or things like Greater Mirror Image, they can still get False Life for temp HP to increase survivability and whatnot.

[Mr.Christie]

Most of what you said is true except that a Dread Necromancer has the same BAB as a wizard

[Keld Denar]

Eh, my bad. Oh well, as you said, the rest of it is true.

[Escheton]

Dread necro ftw.
For the first couple of lvls they are good selfhealing fighters.
Then they become awesome fearbased debuffers.
Then they have so many minions it all doesnt matter anymore.

[EdroGrimshell]

Dread necro ftw.
For the first couple of lvls they are good selfhealing fighters.
Then they become awesome fearbased debuffers.
Then they have so many minions it all doesnt matter anymore.

No i won't. Quality over quantity.

The build i had in mind is as follows

01-Dread Necromancer
02-Dread Necromancer
03-Dread Necromancer
04-Dread Necromancer
05-Dread Necromancer
06-Dread Necromancer
07-Pale Master
08-Pale Master
09-Abjurant Champion
10-Abjurant Champion
11-Abjurant Champion
12-Abjurant Champion
13-Abjurant Champion
14-?
15-?
16-?
17-?
18-?
19-?
20-?

The rest, so long as i get at least a +16 BAB or higher and 9th level spells i'm fine. Any suggestions for modifications would be useful

[Maho-Tsukai]

I second Dread Necromancer. Also, however cheesy and lame it sounds, an evil cleric would fit what your looking for. Clerics after all have better BAB then wizards and DNs, get heavy armor, shields and have some of the best buffs in the entire game. They also are great necromancers, with access to Desecrate and Animate Dead as a level 3 spell. Oh, and they can take the deathbound domain too which gives them more minions. Not to mention clerics get rebuking just like DNs and also have some awesome necromancy spells that wizards and DNs miss out on such as Heat Stop(or Heartclutch..I forget the exact name of this spell..it's a save or die.), General of Undeath(MOAR minions!) and the aforementioned Desecrate.

However, if you really don't want to play a cleric, then just take a dread necromancer and some gishy PrC. Make sure however to take tomb tainted soul for infinite out of battle self heals. Also, while it's not the most optimal of choices, a Pale Master seams to be kinda what your looking for as well. They get some nice abilities for a necro-gish such as many different resistances which are very nice and an undead arm with some nasty touch attacks, one of which I believe actually animates a person if you kill them with it. The only downside to Pale Master is you lose one CL, which despite not sounding like much is a BIG deal, even more so if your a Dread Necromancer. If you want to take pale master you may want to take a necromancy-specialized wizard as entry rather then the DN but it's really up to you what you do.

[Dusk Eclipse]

[Shameless self plug] check the void reaper in my signature[/shameless self plug] assuming you are willing to use homebrew

[Fouredged Sword]

If you start low level then go DN for the great self healing that will make you tankier than anything else on the field.

If you start high level I would take a in with wizard / palemaster / abjurent champion, but I would dip a single level in warblade for martial weapon prof and some nice strikes and a stance that helps you out.

A low level warblade / dread necromancer would be nice gish. Don't take to many levels of warblade, as you want spellcasting.

[*.*.*.*]

No i won't. Quality over quantity.

The build i had in mind is as follows

01-Dread Necromancer
02-Dread Necromancer
03-Dread Necromancer
04-Dread Necromancer
05-Dread Necromancer
06-Dread Necromancer
07-Pale Master
08-Pale Master
09-Abjurant Champion
10-Abjurant Champion
11-Abjurant Champion
12-Abjurant Champion
13-Abjurant Champion
14-?
15-?
16-?
17-?
18-?
19-?
20-?

The rest, so long as i get at least a +16 BAB or higher and 9th level spells i'm fine. Any suggestions for modifications would be useful

Bone Knight?

[Maho-Tsukai]

Bone Knight requires divine casting or something else divine based as far as I remember, which means that he would have to talk to his DM about changing it from a divine class to an arcane one, which not every DM will allow, especially with the existence other options presented here. Or he could just play an evil cleric to get into bone knight if he really wanted to use that class. There are other options which require no rules bending, though, and most of them have already been mentioned.

[Private-Prinny]

Note: I'm no expert, so take all of the below advice at your own risk.

If you're going for a Dread Necromancer, then you need at least 3 things.

1. Tomb-Tainted Soul. Infinite out-of-combat self-healing is useful at all levels. Alternatively, you could be a Necropolitan, but that carries its own issues.
2. You want at least 8 levels of Dread Necromancer, for that sweet, sweet Undead Mastery ability.
3. Corpsecrafter feats. Your hordes need all the help they can get.

The Divine Might feat (CW 106) can use a Rebuke Undead use to get Cha -> Damage, which is good for you, but you may have trouble hitting.

Something like Dread Necromancer 8/Abjurant Champion 5/Spellsword 1/Warblade (or Crusader) 1/Jade Phoenix Mage 5 gets +16 BAB and 18th level DN casting, but there are probably a slew of problems with something like that.

Something as simple as DN 8/Abj Champ 5/Eldritch Knight 7 can work, but, again, there are probably better options.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Dread Necro/Crusader technically qualifies for Ruby Knight Vindicator, although since RKV specifies it only advances Divine casting, it won't advance DN casting. Which sucks, because otherwise it would be a shoe-in for doing what you want it to do. Still, a 2 level dip would be enough to be able to blow Rebuke attempts to refresh maneuvers as a Swift action, which may be of use for spamming maneuvers.

[NelKor]

Death Master is pretty fun, cleric bab i believe, some light armour prof, free undead minion at all times, also get animate dead extremly early and also get desecration.

[Hyooz]

Why two levels of Pale Master? It doesn't get you that much, and you have the basically empty 1st level.

[EdroGrimshell]

Why two levels of Pale Master? It doesn't get you that much, and you have the basically empty 1st level.

I just needed the spell-like ability animate dead.

Already have a cleric in the party.

No ToB, ToM, or homebrew.

spellsword requires all armor prof, eldritch knight requires all weapon prof.

I'm a necropolitan.

I'm using a wizard instead of a dread necro


Some added rules to the game
All characters gain any one regional feat from the Forgotten Realms books (although Otherwordly is banned)
Starting at 3rd level
2 flaws, 1 trait
Free +1 LA

[WinWin]

Craft wonderous items. Spellstitch undead. Better for intelligent undead, so if you go Necropolitan, spellstich yourself. SLA''s depending on your wisdom. Costs a fair amount of XP. Probably a better way of getting Animate Dead as an SLA than Pale Master.

[EdroGrimshell]

Craft wonderous items. Spellstitch undead. Better for intelligent undead, so if you go Necropolitan, spellstich yourself. SLA''s depending on your wisdom. Costs a fair amount of XP. Probably a better way of getting Animate Dead as an SLA than Pale Master.

Wisdom is 12

[Xallace]

You know, you could be a warlock. You get better HD and BAB than wizard or Dread Necro, not to mention DR and other nice abilities. Take The Dead Walk and Eldritch Glaive (refluffed as a scythe?), along with some other necromantic or refluffed invocations (Curse of Despair springs to mind).

You can take Corpse Crafter and other such feats to enhance your undead created with The Dead Walk. You can also spend a feat on an actual scythe, if you desire. Not to mention, if you really want all those necromantic spells, Eldritch Theurge isn't a bad class.

[EdroGrimshell]

You know, you could be a warlock. You get better HD and BAB than wizard or Dread Necro, not to mention DR and other nice abilities. Take The Dead Walk and Eldritch Glaive (refluffed as a scythe?), along with some other necromantic or refluffed invocations (Curse of Despair springs to mind).

You can take Corpse Crafter and other such feats to enhance your undead created with The Dead Walk. You can also spend a feat on an actual scythe, if you desire. Not to mention, if you really want all those necromantic spells, Eldritch Theurge isn't a bad class.

I've actually done that before, it was fun but i lagged to far behind the rest of the party.

So far, i was thinking strait wizard for the first 5 levels with the Militia regional feat, which gives me all martial weapon proficiencies, then 2 levels of pale master, a level of eldritch knight, five levels of abjurant champion, and the rest as eiher eldritch knight or another appropriate PrC.

Also taking light armor proficiency (using a flaw) for when i get my +1 Githcraft Twilight Studded Leather later or +1 Mithral Twilight Chain Shirt (whichever i can mooch off of the party artificer).

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

If you're a Necropolitan, say the individual who turned you into one was a Dread Necromancer 8+ with the entire Corpsecrafter line of feats from LM, and that he did it within the area of a Desecration spell with an evil altar present. That will get you a permanent +4 Enhancement bonus to Str and Dex, +6 HP per level, +4 turn resistance, +2 natural armor, +1d6 cold damage on natural attacks and unarmed strikes, +4 initiative, and +10 ft. to your base land speed.

An Illumian Dread Necromancer with Naenhoon can effectively DMM: Persist two spells per day, if you spend the feats on Extend and Persistent Spell. Put at least a 14 on Wisdom and get Arcane Disciple for any domain which grants Divine Power (Competition, Orc, Pride, or War) and you can Naenhoon: Persist that to get full BAB and +6 Str all day, every day, as early as level 6 with Versatile Spellcaster.

A bit cheesy, but if you have Versatile Spellcaster you can spend your Dread Necro spell slots to spontaneously cast any spell you know. Dipping a single level into (Cloistered) Cleric will get you that entire class spell list as spells known, and you'll be able to cast any Cleric spell using your Dread Necro caster level and Cha score. That will give you access to Divine Power and every other Cleric buff, cast spontaneously, regardless of how low your Wisdom score is. You'll also get two domains, which I'd probably get Celerity and Travel for the nice bonuses and because you would know all the spells they grant. Planning and Travel would be my second choice, to get Extend Spell for free, though Hasted undead minions are just amazing.

[Ashiel]

Levels of cleric have better BAB, HD, and rival dread necromancers in undead mastery; while also being able to cast in heavy armor, and get full benefit from ruby knight vindicator; which would make for an excellent gish.

Just a thought.

[DwarvenExodus]

Obligatory Necromancer's Handbook link

[Vizzerdrix]

Most of what you said is true except that a Dread Necromancer has the same BAB as a wizard

Fixable by getting Divine Power on the spell list with Arcane Devotion.

And if they can get shield on the list, then Abjurant Champion makes a suberb filler for levels 9~13, leaving 7 to play with. Another Arcane Devotion should do it.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Fixable by getting Divine Power on the spell list with Arcane Devotion.

And if they can get shield on the list, then Abjurant Champion makes a suberb filler for levels 9~13, leaving 7 to play with. Another Arcane Devotion should do it.

If I was going to get Arcane Devotion, I'd grab Evil for Desecrate, since for some unknown reason, it's an Evocation spell, and thus unable to be picked up by Advanced Learning...

Either that, or find a way to get into True Necromancer (UrPriest maybe?) to get Aura of Desecration, then ditch it for something more... useful.

[Roga]

One level of Dragon Slayer from Draconomicon gives you +1 BAB, +1 Spell caster level, and Immunity to fear. Useful if you ever face another master of your trade. It does require Iron will and Dodge though. Dodge is useless by Iron will is a stepping stone to Reserves of Strength, which rocks for any out of combat casting.

Reserves of Strength is out of the Dragonlance Campaign setting.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

One level of Dragon Slayer from Draconomicon gives you +1 BAB, +1 Spell caster level, and Immunity to fear. Useful if you ever face another master of your trade. It does require Iron will and Dodge though. Dodge is useless by Iron will is a stepping stone to Reserves of Strength, which rocks for any out of combat casting.

Reserves of Strength is out of the Dragonlance Campaign setting.

If you have a dip in Swordsage, you can instead get Desert Wind Dodge, which qualifies as Dodge for purposes of prerequisites, and is much better.