Cleric Help 3.5

[Noedig]

So my party and I are going to be in the middle of a war we are sort of responsible for starting soon. We'll likely be definitely be fighting drow, whatever slaves they have, and maybe illithids and whatever slaves they have. There may be also be undead involved on both sides, but we're good at those.

These two things in mind, I would like to know if there are any combat oriented spells on the cleric lists that dont allow SR, and also good AoE stuff for dealing with lots of enemies in tight quarters.

[aeauseth]

I've tried to get around SR with my Cleric and it isn't easy. The only saving grace was Assay Spell Resistance (Spell Compendium). Other than that I used Divine Power, picked up a morning star with both hands, swapped in a crystal of XXX and pretended I was a badass fighter.

Turns out that most buff spells overcome SR.

Obscuring Mist can be very useful. You only have to take on a few foes at a time in melee. If the army attacks they can't range you very well, forces them to engage in melee.

If you still want to go the attack spell route then check out http://www.imarvintpa.com/dndLive/FindSpell.php


As for undead you can always turn. I personally like the Unearthed Arcane alternate rules called Destory undead, does damage instead of making them run away.

[Keld Denar]

The attack spell issue is certainly helped by the feats Arcane Mastery and Divine Spell Power. Despite its name, Arcane Mastery functions for divine spells as well, since it mearly allows you to take 10 on CL checks. SR is a CL check. That means that you just need to get your CL up to your enemies SR-10, IE if your foe has SR20, and you are CL10, you automatically overcome his SR.

Divine Spell Power can increase your CL by -4 to +4, depending on your turn check. Since a turn check is a Charisma check, anything that boosts Cha checks will increase you spell power. DSP comes with a built in +3, so thats easy. A Circlet of Persuasion increases all Cha checks as well, and anything that increases your Cha score. 5 ranks in Knowledge: Religion also increases your turn check by another +2. If you are shopping for a PrC, Sacred Exorcist gives you a persistant Consecrate, for another +3. If you can rig it so you have a +10, then you get to 11 even on a roll of 1, you'll never get a negative CL. If you roll well, you'll get a +1 to +4 bonus on CL, making it easier for you to overcome SR.

One feat that is GREAT for clerics is Quick Recovery (Lords of Madness). You have a GREAT will save thanks to your strong will progression and wis focus, and Quick Recovery allows you to recover from a botched save vs Illithid Mind Blast and similar disable effects. It also allows you to recover from stuns and disables that have NO save, like Blasphemy. Very useful.

[Noedig]

Sweet spell finder. Should take me a minute to learn though.

What are your feelings on Consumptive field and Negative Energy Aura, particularly in concert with each other?

[Keld Denar]

The only problem with Consumptive Field is that its not friendly-fire friendly. If one of your allies drops in battle, their soul gets sucked just the same as the guys you are fighting. Its great for an uncaring NPC evil cleric who's minions are disposable, but I'm sure the other players at your table will be a bit miffed if the simple act of getting dropped is gonna lead to their death.

Other than that, if your party is good with it, go with it.

[Noedig]

I don't think I'll be using it while standing next to them. Luckily our standard practice is to have a bit of distance between each other to avoid being caught in a single spell.


A question on saving:
I'm 11th level, and with a buff I've got a 28 WIS, which would make this specific save a DC 23 Will. Acceptable?

A question on SR:
Drow racial SR is 11+level right? How hard is it to hit them with spells as an 11th level cleric?

[Tokuhara]

I don't think I'll be using it while standing next to them. Luckily our standard practice is to have a bit of distance between each other to avoid being caught in a single spell.


A question on saving:
I'm 11th level, and with a buff I've got a 28 WIS, which would make this specific save a DC 23 Will. Acceptable?

A question on SR:
Drow racial SR is 11+level right? How hard is it to hit them with spells as an 11th level cleric?

1. its decent. If you can buff your Wis with spells, it goes up

2. Its 11+ Their Level. So if you're facing a 5th level drow fighter, its SR 16

my suggestion: Pick up domains. Lots of them.

PrCs that offer Domains:

Sovereign Speaker (FoE): 9/10, but 10 free domains
Contemplative 1 (CD): 10/10, plus 1 domain
Radiant Servant of (insert Sun God Here) (CD): 10/10, plus 2 bonus domains
Divine Oracle 1 (CD): 10/10 with 1 domain
Church Inquisitor (CD): 10/10 with Inquisition Domain
there are others, but these are my go-to PrCs

[aeauseth]

Drow racial SR is 11+level right? How hard is it to hit them with spells as an 11th level cleric?

A Drow is +2 ECL, so expect a 9 HD Drow, for a SR of 20. Your Caster Level is 11 so you need to roll a 9 or better. So you are about 55% likely to get thru a Drow's SR (give or take).

[Noedig]

Aside from items and owls wisdom is there a buff that will raise it even higher?

Is there a 'Mass' version of Assay Spell Resistance?

[Telonius]

If you're on the defensive, have a day to prepare, and some money to spend, something as simple as Hallow can give you quite a few benefits. Death Ward is a good spell to attach to it for this purpose.

[ericgrau]

Wall of stone is one of the best crowd control spells and it is on the cleric list. There is no SR, and if you can manage to place it out of reach of the monsters there's no save either.

[Keld Denar]

Again, Arcane Mastery will help you a TON with SR, since you can take 10 on the check. If your foes all have SR equal to 11+their HD, then you just have to make sure your CL is always higher than their HD by 1 and you'll never have to worry about it. Divine Spell Power will help you here, as will various CL boosts like domain powers, Orange IWIN Stones, and a Crystal Mask of Penetration.

Also, Tokuhara, you got it backwards...RSoP gives 1 bonus domain (chosen from Glory, Purification, or one offered by your god), while Contemplative grants 2 (one at 1st, the other at 6th IIRC).

[Noedig]

Orange Ioun Stones may not be out of the question but they're a tad expensive.

@ericgrau: How exactly are you using Wall of Stone?

A tactic I wanted to try out with the party wizard was to do Wall of Stone behind a group of enemies, and then have him drop a Cloud Kill that would advance toward the wall. Problem is the wizard dropped out and we have to find another one. But problem aside, is this a feasible tactic?

[ericgrau]

Generally you isolate some enemies from the fight with wall of stone. It works best indoors where you can connect it to 1 or 2 existing walls. After your party easily finishes off their allies, they can easily finish off the ones you isolated. Half a fight is far easier than a whole fight. You don't need to kill them in the meantime, you need to ignore them for a bit and focus on the ones that aren't walled off.

[Andion Isurand]

Another good buff to know when using Divine Power is the Bane Weapon spell (Clr 4, Sor/Wiz 4) from Dragon #279 (pg. 47) in the "Revenge of the Spider Queen" article.

It can allow you to reach a weapon enhancement bonus over +5 as you near epic level.

It has a close range and lasts for 10 min/level. Good for chain spell too.

[KingoftheTrees]

Divine Spell Power can increase your CL by -4 to +4, depending on your turn check. Since a turn check is a Charisma check, anything that boosts Cha checks will increase you spell power. DSP comes with a built in +3, so thats easy. A Circlet of Persuasion increases all Cha checks as well, and anything that increases your Cha score. 5 ranks in Knowledge: Religion also increases your turn check by another +2. If you are shopping for a PrC, Sacred Exorcist gives you a persistant Consecrate, for another +3. If you can rig it so you have a +10, then you get to 11 even on a roll of 1, you'll never get a negative CL. If you roll well, you'll get a +1 to +4 bonus on CL, making it easier for you to overcome SR.

Don't forget to increase your turning level. So if you wind up turning "your level +2", you can have "your level" be higher than your actual level for a further increase in your caster level for SR checks and other variables.

[Keld Denar]

Doesn't work that way. DSP isn't actually turning undead, and it isn't boosted by +effective turning level items or feats. Its simply a turning check that increases your CL.

[KingoftheTrees]

Are you sure? The feat description says you add any other modifiers you would normally apply to your turn check (with a special +3).

[Keld Denar]

Yea, to your turn CHECK. Many things, like a Phylactery of Undead Turning or the Improved Turning feat, add to your turn LEVEL. Two different things. Only the results of the check matter, not what your overall turning level is.