(4E) Good classes to use guns/crossbows?

[Binary.tobis]

I'm starting a pirate-themed game, and I've decided to specialize in guns, which we are treating like crossbows I believe. I was going to put a religous slant on my character and make an Avenger or Invoker, but it doesn't seem like I would get much gunplay out of them. Are there any good classes to use with ranged weapons in 4e other than Ranger?

Thanks!

[tcrudisi]

The Seeker. Also, the Rogue has some ranged attacks, although it would require a little bit of "house-ruling" to allow you to sneak attack with them.

*edited to add* Also, the Prescient Bard can used ranged weapons, me thinks.

[Urpriest]

The rogue can sneak attack just fine with crossbows. There's even a rogue build that focuses on them, and gains +1 to hit with them. You can't flank, but a Cunning Sneak rogue can be hidden much of the time if the DM provides interesting terrain (which you should get on a ship).

[Nefarion Xid]

Martial Power 2 has lots of love for crossbow rogues. Arcane Power puts ranged weapons in the hands of the Bard to great effect. The archer bard looks really fun to play, but I haven't seen it in action. And there's the Seeker from PHB3, who I haven't seen played either, but I was pretty underwhelmed when I read through the class and powers.

If you're looking for even more options, consider reflavoring wands and rods as guns as well so you could make a pirate gunslinger out of the Warlock.

[Boci]

If you're looking for even more options, consider reflavoring wands and rods as guns as well so you could make a pirate gunslinger out of the Warlock.

Depends. There are few ways to be disarmed, but some people may be bothered by the fact that a rod or wand is not neccissary for a rnaged attack. Then again, it might not bother him. Could refluff them to fix that issue, but that is a lot of refluffing.

[tcrudisi]

Depends. There are few ways to be disarmed, but some people may be bothered by the fact that a rod or wand is not neccissary for a rnaged attack. Then again, it might not bother him. Could refluff them to fix that issue, but that is a lot of refluffing.

Eh, I would take the easy route, if I were going to do that:

The crossbow/gun counts for all intents and purposes as a rod or wand, even down to what enchantments can go onto it. You gain no +prof bonus, nor do you use the damage of the crossbow/gun, instead you use the damage of the power.

So basically, I would just say "gun = rod" where a warlock was concerned, if they really wanted to do that. Then just change the flavor of the powers description to make it fit to help describe what effects occur.

[Boci]

Eh, I would take the easy route, if I were going to do that:

The crossbow/gun counts for all intents and purposes as a rod or wand, even down to what enchantments can go onto it. You gain no +prof bonus, nor do you use the damage of the crossbow/gun, instead you use the damage of the power.

So basically, I would just say "gun = rod" where a warlock was concerned, if they really wanted to do that. Then just change the flavor of the powers description to make it fit to help describe what effects occur.

You would still face the problem of ammunition and what happens if your crossbows are taken away. Might not bother some players, since the first could be overlooked and the second may never happen, but it would bother others. To get around that you would need some fluff like the weapons were grafted to your flesh and fueled by your own blood/soul/whatever. Which IMO would be pretty cool, but might not be what the OP wants.

[Nefarion Xid]

Well, you don't have to change things so much that a Warlock is no longer a caster. I was thinking more along the lines of "an arcanist who uses a gun as an implement." He's still a warlock if his gun gets taken away, but a decidedly less dangerous one.

And... show of hands, who actually tracks ammunition? I mean, I suppose if ammunition really was a concern you could call it an "Eldritch Pistol" and suppose it shoots arcane energy instead of actual bullets.

Random suggestion for sea-faring campaigns in 4E: Consider the "Imposter's" enchantment for anyone who might be in heavy armor. A minor action turns it into a set of plain clothes and gets rid of the speed and skill penalty (and the AC). Also the Floating Shield! It's all fun and games until the paladin drowns...

[CakeTown]

I'd definitely go with a Rogue. Take the Two Fisted Shooter feat and you'll be able to wield a hand crossbow in your off hand, as well as reload it one handed. This allows you to dual wield hand crossbows if you want, as well as wield a hand crossbow and a melee weapon. As others have said, Cunning Sneak is a very good ranged build for a rogue. If you take the Distant Advantage feat, you'll be able to get combat advantage against enemies your allies have flanked, and you won't always need to hide.

[mobdrazhar]

I'd definitely go with a Rogue. Take the Two Fisted Shooter feat and you'll be able to wield a hand crossbow in your off hand, as well as reload it one handed. This allows you to dual wield hand crossbows if you want, as well as wield a hand crossbow and a melee weapon. As others have said, Cunning Sneak is a very good ranged build for a rogue. If you take the Distant Advantage feat, you'll be able to get combat advantage against enemies your allies have flanked, and you won't always need to hide.

may have to tell that idea to one of my players

[Nefarion Xid]

A crossbow rogue can't go wrong with Vicious Advantage (CA against slowed or immobilized targets). And plenty of rogue powers will slap on those effects.

[Meta]

My friend has a ranger who uses guns. I can ask him to post his rules and homebrew if that interests you

[ninja_penguin]

And... show of hands, who actually tracks ammunition? I mean, I suppose if ammunition really was a concern you could call it an "Eldritch Pistol" and suppose it shoots arcane energy instead of actual bullets.

Unless it's one of those consumable items as ammunition, we always just played something like 'buy X rounds of ammunition right now. You now never need to worry about running out of ammunition'.

[Binary.tobis]

Thanks for the replies!

[Tengu_temp]

Martial Power 2 also has a ranged warlord, although this class is better with bows unless you happen to spend a feat on Superior Crossbow proficiency (which is very worthwhile).

[dsmiles]

This site = WIN!

[Binary.tobis]

Does anyone know some cool crossbow enchantments if my character is starting at level 8?