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  1. - Top - End - #571
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    I agree, with most/all points.
    you obviously haven't written only area spells are acceptable, you can use multiple spells, even the same one more than once (second level: prestidigitation+2x 1/2 prestidigitation), and it just doesn't reflect on the monster.

    Also, to limit the player some, you should limit switching your spell up to within the same school, and really, it is really hard to read. For example, each of the entries in regard to meta-magic is really off. How are they supposed to function? (rhetorical, don't answer that) And, living miracle is just plain broken, even for a capstone.

    This class really, really, needs reworking. right now. from scratch.
    Last edited by flabort; 2011-04-10 at 12:41 PM.
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  2. - Top - End - #572
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by monkman View Post
    Death knight(Template)

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    Prerequisite: Need to be evil and at least lv 6

    {table=head]Level|BAB|Fort|Ref |Will|Special

    1st|
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +2
    |Undying Body,Death touch, Natural armor,Abyssal blast 1+str

    2nd|
    +1
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +3
    |Immunities,Damage Reduction,Spell Resistance +1str

    3rd|
    +1
    |
    +1
    |
    +1
    |
    +3
    |Fear Aura,Undead Followers or mount, bonus against turning +1str [/table]
    HD:D12

    Skills: 2+int mod. A death knight has no class skills.

    Proficiencies: A death knight gains profecienty with all armor, and shield(including tower sheild) all simple weapons and all martial weapons.

    Undying Body:Unlike other monster classes, the Death knight doesn't lose his racial ability modifiers, but he does gain undead traits:
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    * No Constitution score.
    * Darkvision out to 60 feet.
    * Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects).
    * Immunity to poison, sleep effects, paralysis, stunning, disease, and death effects.
    * Not subject to critical hits, nonlethal damage, ability drain, or energy drain. Immune to damage to its physical ability scores (Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution), as well as to fatigue and exhaustion effects.
    * Heals naturaly.
    * Immunity to any effect that requires a Fortitude save (unless the effect also works on objects or is harmless).
    * Uses its Charisma modifier for Concentration checks.
    * Not at risk of death from massive damage, but when reduced to 0 hit points or less, it is immediately destroyed, unless it has activated it's fast healing ability.
    * Not affected by Raise Dead and reincarnate spells or abilities. Resurrection and True Resurrection can affect undead creatures. These spells turn undead creatures back into the living creatures they were before becoming undead.
    * Death knights don't need to breath, eat, or sleep. However, a death knight may do any of the three if desired.


    Death touchThe death knight’s touch attack uses negative energy to deal damage equal to 1d8 + the death knight’s Charisma bonus to living creatures. Each successful touchattack also deals 1 point of Constitution damage. A Will save(DC 10 + 1/2 death knight’s HD + death knight’s Charisma
    modifier) reduces the damage by half and negates the Constitution damage.A death knight can channel the touch through Melee weapons.FOr two weapon fighting it appiles for both weapons.

    Natural armor: a death knight gains natural armor equal to it's str modifier

    Abyssal blast A death knight can use this ability 1 per 4 HD Per day.It creates a giant fire ball that damages 1d6/HD and has a ranged of 200+40/HD.Half the damage is fire base and half the damage is divine.A Reflex save (DC 10 + 1/2 death knight’s HD + death knight’s Charisma modifier)

    Immunities : Death knights are immune to cold and gain resitances to electricity and polymorph equal to his HD
    Damage ReductionAt 2th level, a death knight gains Damage Reduction equal to 1/2 its HD, This is DR/bludgeoning and magic

    Spell resitance: : Death Knights gain Spell resitance equal to 11+HD

    Fear Aura Death knights are shrouded in a dreadful aura of death and evil. All Creatures within 5ft/2HD of a death knight must succeed at a Will save (DC 10 +1/2 death knight’s HD + death knight’s Charisma modifier).If lower tha half the death knight HD, if the pesron fail's he is panicked,if they succed , they are shaken. IF a person of more then half the death knight's HD fails, they are shaken, If they succed nothing happens. this only affect's enemies.
    Undead Followers or mount: Death knights gain undead as followers(Skeletons,zombies,ghast,etc)the combined ECL should be equal or lower to double the HD of the Death Knight , These undead remain in the service of the death knight untill they are destored.
    Instead of having undead followers a death knight can chose a mount form the blackguard list. The mount has a ECl of -1 compared to the death knight HD
    If either are destroyed, new ones appear in a week.

    Bonus against turning : A death knight gains a bonus against turning. He is considered 3 lvs higher for a turning check made by a enemy.
    I think that this is the final copie, i did what you told me to do and it looks good
    Last edited by monkman; 2010-09-25 at 11:33 AM.
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  3. - Top - End - #573
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by Oslecamo View Post
    Doppelganger

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    HD:d8
    {table]Level|Bab|Fort|Ref|Will|Feature
    1|+ 0|+ 0|+ 2| +2 |Doppelganger body, Copycat, Adapt +1
    2|+1 |+ 0|+ 3| +3 |Mind read, Adapt +2
    3|+ 2|+ 1|+3 | +3 |Weaver of lies, Adapt +3
    [/table]
    Skills: 8+int modifier, quadruple at 1st level. All skills are class skills for the doppelganger.

    Proefeciencies:simple weapons, his own natural weapons.

    Features
    Doppelganger body:At 1st level a doppelganger loses all racial bonus it had and gains monstruous humanoid traits (basically dark vision 60 feets). He's a medium monstruous humanoid with base speed 30 and a natural slam attack dealing 1d6+1,5 Str damage.

    In adition, it gains a bonus to nat armor equal to his Int modifier.

    Copycat:
    2/day for each HD it has, a doppelganger can assume the shape of any Small or Medium humanoid as per the change shape ability. In humanoid form, the doppelganger loses its natural attacks. A doppelganger can remain in its humanoid form until it chooses to assume a new one. A change in form cannot be dispelled, but a doppelganger reverts to its natural form when killed. A true seeing spell or ability reveals its natural form.

    Adapt:
    The doppelganger gains a total bonus to one of his ability scores as shown on the table. He can choose to divide this bonus across several of his ability scores. He can change to where this bonus is applied as a swift action. So at 3rd level, the doppelganger could get +3 to str, or +2 to Str and +1 to Con, or +1 to Str, +1 to Con and +1 to Dex for example.


    Mind read:
    A doppelganger can continuously use detect thoughts as the spell (caster level equal to HD; Will DC 10+1/2HD+Int modifier negates). It can suppress or resume this ability as a free action, but can only use it a total number of rounds per day equal to his HDxInt modifier.

    In addition, the doppelganger is now immune to sleep and charm effects.

    Weaver of lies: the doppelganger gets a bonus on bluff and diguise checks equal to his HD. If he's sucessfully reading the mind of the person he's trying to fool, this bonus doubles.

    In adition, if using the change shape ability, he gets an extra +10 on disguise checks(wich is not double if sucessfully reading minds).



    Comments:
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    The doppelganger is an cunningg monster with little combat ability but powerfull trickery skills to infiltrate humanoid societies. He also gets two good saves and powerfull skills.

    It is definetely better suited for urban and/or political heavy campaigns where his sick disguise and bluff bonus not to mention his mind read ability can be well applied. Rogue/factotum multiclassing is advised once all the class levels are taken.


    I don't understand the natural slam attack, does it do 1d6+1 damage and 5 Str damage, or does it do 1d6+(1.5xStr) damage?
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  4. - Top - End - #574
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    it's supposed to be 1.5 but a comma was accidentally put there instead apparently. So, one and a half strength modifier damage.
    Avatar by the wonderful BeckyPages. My OC Curtain Call.

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  5. - Top - End - #575

    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by monkman View Post
    I think that this is the final copie, i did what you told me to do and it looks good
    Just a minor nitpick, the fear aura should only affect enemies as discussed on the last page. Also the grammar could use some cleaning up, but otherwise looks great!

  6. - Top - End - #576
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    First of all spell progression is not arbitrary.
    It is based directly on the formula of CR = Level, and the Living Spell’s CR.

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    CR= Highest Level Spell +1/2 Caster level.

    Because the caster level should always = HD, and the Level always =CR
    And Level is going to equal HD...

    HD= Highest level spell +1/2 HD

    Or

    ½ HD= Highest level of spell.

    If multiple spells exist

    CR= Highest level of spell+ ½ the sum of the additional spells (Min +1) +1/2 HD

    So again

    HD= Highest Level of Spell +1/2 additional spells +1/2 HD

    Or

    ½ HD= Highest level of Spell + (1/2 addititonal spells)

    As for the metamagic feat versions of the Living spell this was both recommended, and does not really break away from the original Living spell.

    Granted, Descriptor immunity and School resistance and ‘Relearn’ are new, and perhaps school resistance is a bit much, but other than that the class follows the living spell’s progressions.

    Perhaps with less bonuses to charisma it would seem less broken. And perhaps you could limit the number of times per day the Living spell could affect creatures by it’s spells, but that seem to defeat the point of a Living spell.

    The language is difficult, especially around the Primary Spell Slot and Secondary Spell slot area, and help with it would be appreciated, I struggle in simplifying such things.

    Flarbot: The living spell template specifically states that two spells can be made into a living spell. And it has no restriction on using the same spell twice. Honestly I hadn’t thought of this, but it is easily mended.
    I forgot to mention that only Area and Effect spells were legal, but There is a recommendation list for ‘Legal spells’ as that the Living Spell’s own Template has some Legal Spells that either don’t make sense or are broken.

    As for living Miracle, I figured this would be better than allowing players to play the CR 18 creature that a Living Miracle would actually be.

    Would increasing the time it takes to change out it’s spells represented balance this, or limit it to a number of times per day?
    Last edited by AugustNights; 2010-09-25 at 12:07 PM.
    Come with me, time out of mind...

  7. - Top - End - #577

    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    HD= Highest level spell +1/2 HD
    You're forgeting that the Caster level is rounded down for the CR of the Living Spell, thus you can have a lv 1 spell with CL 1 at CR 1. Yours cannot.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    As for the metamagic feat versions of the Living spell this was both recommended, and does not really break away from the original Living spell.
    Except that by your words it's not clear at all how it works. Does an empowered fireball counts as a fifth level spell or a third? How much time can you heighten a spell since you have no actual spell slots?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    Granted, Descriptor immunity and School resistance and ‘Relearn’ are new, and perhaps school resistance is a bit much, but other than that the class follows the living spell’s progressions.
    You're forcing them to start with cantrips, and do not give the option for sacrificing CL for having more spells, as the Living spell can do.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    Perhaps with less bonuses to charisma it would seem less broken. And perhaps you could limit the number of times per day the Living spell could affect creatures by it’s spells, but that seem to defeat the point of a Living spell.
    You could start by making the DCs tied to spell level and not HD, because the living spell isn't actualy using SLAs and it will already scale by itself.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    The language is difficult, especially around the Primary Spell Slot and Secondary Spell slot area, and help with it would be appreciated, I struggle in simplifying such things.
    Then by all means, first worry about clarifying the main abilities, then worry about filling in dead levels.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    I forgot to mention that only Area and Effect spells were legal,
    Area or effect, not targeted spells, not spells that create creatures.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    but There is a recommendation list for ‘Legal spells’ as that the Living Spell’s own Template has some Legal Spells that either don’t make sense or are broken.
    I fail to find said list. I only see the fire hands and cloudkill sugestions.

    You on the other hand put acid splash, disrupt undead, ray of frost and other targeted spells.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    As for living Miracle, I figured this would be better than allowing players to play the CR 18 creature that a Living Miracle would actually be.
    Miracle, allowing for target spells and creation of creatures, is automatically illegal for a Living Spell to pick.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    Would increasing the time it takes to change out it’s spells represented balance this, or limit it to a number of times per day?
    1/day, after 1 hour meditation, and that's pushing it. Acess to every spell from every list (even with the limitation) is as

  8. - Top - End - #578
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by Oslecamo View Post
    You're forgeting that the Caster level is rounded down for the CR of the Living Spell, thus you can have a lv 1 spell with CL 1 at CR 1. Yours cannot.
    If you are proposing an even more fluid design that allows for players to pick their Caster level as well as spells, I am going to need a lot of help for clarity.

    You could start by making the DCs tied to spell level and not HD, because the living spell isn't actualy using SLAs and it will already scale by itself.
    I figured by modifying the save of the Secondary spell slot (and now heavily penalized) one could avoid more complication. If you want spells DCs and fluid caster levels I'm going to have to either let it sit where is or let someone else come up with the wording for it.

    You on the other hand put acid splash, disrupt undead, ray of frost and other targeted spells.
    I believe the parentheses imply that it cannot be a Targeted Spell, not that it cannot be a Area or Effect spell that has Targets. As that that would be the Third Kind of spell, and the Summon monster restrictions are not in parenthesis.

    'As in I would like chocolate or strawberry ice-cream (not vanilla) but not in a cone.'

    Miracle, allowing for target spells and creation of creatures, is automatically illegal for a Living Spell to pick.
    Actually, it read effect that is a living creature. Miracle's effect is not a living creature. So it's not illegal by the book, unless you were using it to summon a creature.

    1/day, after 1 hour meditation, and that's pushing it.
    How about 1/week?
    Come with me, time out of mind...

  9. - Top - End - #579

    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    I believe the parentheses imply that it cannot be a Targeted Spell, not that it cannot be a Area or Effect spell that has Targets. As that that would be the Third Kind of spell, and the Summon monster restrictions are not in parenthesis.
    In the srd Rays are under the Effect section. The parenthesis are clearly applying to Targeted Effects, otherwise there's no sense for puting the parenthesis there.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    Actually, it read effect that is a living creature. Miracle's effect is not a living creature. So it's not illegal by the book, unless you were using it to summon a creature.
    Enough misreading of the rules. Just because it can be used for other things doesn't change that Miracle can be used for geting creatures. Not just summon, but call and create them, wich are all illegal by Living Spell. Summon monster was only an example in the book. There's plenty of other ways to get monsters, and none of them are valid for a living spell.

    That's the kind of wording problems you need to be carefull about.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    How about 1/week?
    Again, we'll bother about filling dead levels when the main abilities are properly worded. Wich I'll do now since you insist:

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    Anima: Every level of this class a Living Spell gains 2 Anima, wich can be used to purchase the following:

    -Increase Caster level by 1 (the Living Spell starts with 1 free CL)

    -Purchase a primary spell, costing two Anima per spell level. A Living spell must have a CL equal to 2*(spell Level)-1 to learn a spell. 0th level spells cost 1 Anima. They must be spells that create an area or effect (not targeted spells), but not a spell whose effect is already a creature (such as a summon monster spell).

    -Purchase any number of secondary spells, of the same level or lower than the primary spell, following the same restrictions, except that they only cost half the normal Anima.

    Whenever a new Living Spell level is gained, you can choose to re-make those choices, so you can "forget" lower level spells for higher level ones.

    For example, a Living Spell 4 has 8 anima, four of them invested into caster level to get CL 5, two for a burning hands primary spell, and Ventriloquism and Color Spray as secondary spells.

    Upon gaining a new Living Spell level, it has 10 total anima, so he can either learn two new secondary first level spells (or four cantrips), or it can "forget" all it's spells and learn fireball as it's primary spell.



    Speaking of wich, please remove all the spell speech thingy. Just clogging up the class right now. Just say they can speak.
    Last edited by Oslecamo; 2010-09-25 at 01:35 PM.

  10. - Top - End - #580
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Malebranche
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    {table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort|Will|Refl|Feature
    1|+1|+2|+0|+2|Body for War, +1 Str
    2|+2|+3|+0|+3|Cruel Intent, Natural Armor Bonus, +1 Str
    3|+3|+3|+1|+3|Hidden Cunning, +1 Str, +1 Con
    4|+4|+4|+1|+4|Improved Grab, +1 Str, +1 Con
    5|+5|+4|+1|+4|Spell Resistance, +1 Str
    6|+6/1|+5|+2|+5|Improved Body for War, +1 Str, +1 Con
    7|+7/2|+5|+2|+5|Resistance, +1 Str, +1 Con
    8|+8/3|+6|+2|+6|Growth, +1 Str, +1 Con
    9|+9/4|+6|+3|+6|Malicious Intent, +1 Str
    10|+10/5|+7|+3|+7|Diabolic Vision, +1 Str, +1 Con
    11|+11/6/1|+7|+3|+7|Improved Resistance, +1 Str, +1 Con
    12|+12/7/2|+8|+4|+8|Greater Body for War, +1 Str, +1 Con
    13|+13/8/3|+8|+4|+8|Devilish Presence, +1 Str, +1 Con
    14|+14/9/4|+9|+4|+9|Perfect Body for War, Sinister Intent, Growth, +1 Str, +1 Con[/table]

    Hit Die: d8
    Class Skills: Balance, Climb, Escape Artist, Intimidate, Knowledge (The Planes), Listen, Sense Motive, Search, Spot, Use Magic Device
    Skill Points: 6+Int Mod (Or 4 x 6+Int Mod at first level)

    Proficiencies: You are proficient with Simple and Martial Weapons, and with Light Armor.

    Body for War: Congratulations! You are a Malebranche! Remove all racial modifiers and abilities. You are Medium Sized. You gain a Gore Attack that deals 1d8+Strength Modifier damage. You also gain Power Attack as a Bonus Feat. You have a base land speed of 30 ft. You are an Outsider (Baatezu, Evil, Extraplanar, Lawful).

    Ability Enhancements: You gain:
    +1 Strength: Every Level
    +1 Constitution: At every level except at 1st, 2nd, 5th and 9th

    Cruel Intent: You care not for paltry tricks, and everyone you face knows it. At 2nd Level, your Melee attacks (Both Natural and Manufactured) have a 25% to ignore Concealment, Cover and Damage Reduction from any source.

    Natural Armor Bonus: Your skin becomes more resilient the more and more you grow, rivaling that of Magical Armor. At 2nd level, you gain a Natural Armor Bonus equal to your Constitution Modifier.

    Hidden Cunning: Others may take you as nothing but an oaf. Even more will take you as a tool. But you know better. And you make sure anyone who tries to take control of you knows better. At 3rd Level, you gain a +2 Bonus to Will Saves against Mind-Affecting Spells and Spell-Like Abilities. At every odd level afterwards, this bonus increases by 1.

    Improved Grab: As the Ability.

    Spell Resistance: Your time fighting has made you adapt to the mysteries of the Arcane and Divine. You gain SR equivalent to 11+HD.

    Improved Body for War: Your time in hell has made you into a more formidable foe. You grow to Large Size. Your Gore Attack increases to deal 2d6+StrMod damage. You gain two Claws, each dealing 1d8+StrMod damage. Your ability scores do not change due to your increased size, but you do gain the normal bonuses and penalties of being Large sized. You grow Wings with a flight speed of 70 ft. (Average). Additionally, you gain the Rend

    Resistance: Being exposed to so many different forms of combat has trained your body to resist some of the crueler methods of death. Upon reaching 7th level, you gain Fire Resistance equal to your HD. Additionally, you gain a bonus to your saves equal to your Constitution Modifier against Poisons.

    Growth: At 8th Level you grow to Large Size. Your ability scores do not change due to your increased size, but you do gain the normal bonuses and penalties of being Large sized. At 14th Level you grow to Huge Size. You gain all benefits of an increase in size, but your ability scores do not change because of it.

    Malicious Intent: You grow tired of having others attempt to dodge your blows or resist them. At 9th Level, your Melee attacks (Both Natural and Manufactured) have a 50% to ignore Concealment, Cover and Damage Reduction from any source.

    Diabolic Vision: The illusions of the world hold no merit over you! Starting at 10th level, you gain a +2 to any Save to any spell of the Illusion School. This bonus increases by 1 for every 3 HD you have. Additionally, if you have struck the creature at least once, you are treated as having True Seeing on that Creature for a number of rounds equal to your Constitution Modifier.

    Improved Resistance: Time in battle has exposed you to more and more elements of warfare. You lose your Fire Resistance and your Bonus against Poisons, but gain Immunity to Fire and Poison. Additionally, you gain Acid and Cold Resistance equal to your HD.

    Greater Body for War: Your name is whispered by lower Devils, and your body has grown and changed... along with your mind. At 12th Level You gain Improved Initiative as a Bonus Feat. You gain DR [x]/Magic equal to 1/2 HD. Additionally, your base land speed increases to 40 ft. your flight speed increases to 100 ft. (Average).

    Devilish Presence: At 13th Level you gain a Fear Aura (Will Save DC: 15+Con Mod) that spreads out 20 ft. from you. On a failed save, creatures are panicked for 10 rounds. On a successful save, a creature cannot be affected by the your Aura for the next 24 Hours. Other Baatezu are not affected by this. Allies are not affected by this Aura.

    Sinister Intent: Each blow you deal hits hard, taking most creatures aback at how powerful each one is. At 14th Level, your Melee attacks (Both Natural and Manufactured) have a 75% to ignore Concealment, Cover and Damage Reduction from any source.

    Perfect Body for War: You're a fearsome sight to behold. Countless demons speak of your kind, and those who meet you or see you, are reassured of the intimidating tales. You gain Telepathy (100 ft.), and Regeneration equal to 1/2 your HD. Your regeneration is bypassed only by Fire (If your immunity is somehow blocked or removed) and Acid. Your flight speed increases to 120 ft. (Average).


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    As I'm finishing this up, I'm remembering that Malebranche have 16 HD from the Entry.
    Probably made some sort of mistake here, but I'll find out when people pick this apart.
    Last edited by Cardea; 2010-09-27 at 07:31 AM.
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  11. - Top - End - #581
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Um, there are no creatures that start out larger than medium. Also only creatures that can't walk and have other limiting factors like no hands and stuff get flight at 1st level.
    Really really really awesome avatar thanks to neoseph7

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by demidracolich View Post
    Um, there are no creatures that start out larger than medium. Also only creatures that can't walk and have other limiting factors like no hands and stuff get flight at 1st level.
    Changed to account this. Thank you.
    I currently do not check the playground forums. If you would like to reach me, you can find me on twitter as HTTPaladin.

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Minor Thing: you need to say what bypasses it's Regeneration, if nothing does it's Fast Healing.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard View Post
    Minor Thing: you need to say what bypasses it's Regeneration, if nothing does it's Fast Healing.
    Taken into account. Muchos gracias, Senior Kobold-Bard.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Cardea:First I would like to point you at the monster creating rules in the first post wich give several base guidelines you seem to have missed.
    -Unless you have a really good reason (like the phoenix that has no hands or melee ability, or the rakasha that has few abilities and is a sorceror two levels behind), no all good saves+full bab. Most fiends here have just two good saves+full bab.
    -Natural armor should be equal to Con.
    -SR should be 11+HD and DR only half HD.
    -You should spread out abilities more. At 2nd level you gain a couple of stats, at 6th level you grow, gain flight, two extra natural attacks and two stats. On the same vein, on levels 13 and 14 you hardly gain anything, then at level 15 you gain a butload of stuff at the same time again. You should move some of the stuff from those "super" levels (6, 12, 15) to the more empty levels.
    -Energy resistances and regeneration should be based on HD.
    -Remove the couple +4 Str scores on the middle of the progression. Again, we're trying to avoid super-scores here.
    -Proefeciencies?

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    say when you get wings.please.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by Oslecamo View Post
    Cardea:First I would like to point you at the monster creating rules in the first post wich give several base guidelines you seem to have missed.
    -Unless you have a really good reason (like the phoenix that has no hands or melee ability, or the rakasha that has few abilities and is a sorceror two levels behind), no all good saves+full bab. Most fiends here have just two good saves+full bab.
    -Natural armor should be equal to Con.
    -SR should be 11+HD and DR only half HD.
    -You should spread out abilities more. At 2nd level you gain a couple of stats, at 6th level you grow, gain flight, two extra natural attacks and two stats. On the same vein, on levels 13 and 14 you hardly gain anything, then at level 15 you gain a butload of stuff at the same time again. You should move some of the stuff from those "super" levels (6, 12, 15) to the more empty levels.
    -Energy resistances and regeneration should be based on HD.
    -Remove the couple +4 Str scores on the middle of the progression. Again, we're trying to avoid super-scores here.
    -Proefeciencies?
    1. My apologies.
    2. Will change to Good Fort and Refl only.
    3. The entry in the Fiendish Codex didn't give him any armor, a penalty because of his size, and a penalty because of his Dex, to AC. Thus him having an abnormally high Natural Armor. Could I simply change it out to a much slower progression?
    4. Alright and alright. Will change.
    5. Will change.
    6. How would I change it to HD for the Resistances? And for Regeneration, probably 1/2 HD.
    7. Got it.
    8. I assumed that would be covered in Outsider, but alright.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardea View Post
    3. The entry in the Fiendish Codex didn't give him any armor, a penalty because of his size, and a penalty because of his Dex, to AC. Thus him having an abnormally high Natural Armor. Could I simply change it out to a much slower progression?
    That's the idea behind Con to armor. It starts small and then grows slowly as your Con improves.

    Plus since you don't get Dex penalty, that helps AC too.

    And a quick dip on another class can give armor proefeciency as well. Heck, leather armor has no penalty even if you're not proefecient.

    One thing we however do around here is give +1 free nat armor when you grow size (speaking of wich, specify you do not get more nat armor just for growing size).

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardea View Post
    6. How would I change it to HD for the Resistances? And for Regeneration, probably 1/2 HD.
    In this case both equal to 1/2 HD.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardea View Post
    8. I assumed that would be covered in Outsider, but alright.
    Not here, you don't gain the automatic proefeciencies of each type, they're customised to fit the monster.

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Alright. Edited the problem issues that were raised. Thank you for pointing them out Oslecamo.

    I added in more abilities, and spread out the Body of War abilities.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    The Planetouched has no HD listing, btw.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Can you take my name off your versions of the Styx and Pyroclastic dragons? They aren't enough like mine to warrant being called "final tweaks" so much as "almost completely redone:"
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by Oslecamo View Post
    In the srd Rays are under the Effect section. The parenthesis are clearly applying to Targeted Effects, otherwise there's no sense for puting the parenthesis there.
    Still I disagree, however your project, your rules.

    Enough misreading of the rules. Just because it can be used for other things doesn't change that Miracle can be used for geting creatures. Not just summon, but call and create them, wich are all illegal by Living Spell. Summon monster was only an example in the book. There's plenty of other ways to get monsters, and none of them are valid for a living spell.
    A discussion for another time to be sure. However I am not misreading anything, I am interpreting them differently than you, and I did not know the way you interpreted the 'effect of a spell' Since the effect of miracle is based on the spell it mimics, I would say it's valid as long as it doesn't mimic an invalid spell. However it is your thread, and your project, and again, I have changed the class to fit your preferences.

    Again, we'll bother about filling dead levels when the main abilities are properly worded. Wich I'll do now since you insist:
    Thank you. Simplified wording of class features is not my forte, even in RL I struggle to simplify my thoughts.

    Speaking of wich, please remove all the spell speech thingy. Just clogging up the class right now. Just say they can speak.
    Done.

    Ideas for dead levels?
    Last edited by AugustNights; 2010-09-26 at 09:41 AM.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    monkman:You've made the fear aura on your Death Knight only affect allies, it was suposed to be only enemies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardea View Post
    I added in more abilities, and spread out the Body of War abilities.
    -Now that I went to skim trough Fiendish Codex I notice the Malebranch is CR 14, thus the class should only have 14 levels. You can move the telepathy and regeneration to earlier levels.
    -Remove the extra Nat armor bonus at last level, remove light armor proefeciency, remove Wis bonus (it has no abilities tied to it, so it isn't doing much there) and the rend mention you do.
    -Reduce flight maneuverability to average (really perfect flight is just for truly natural fliers like the will'o'wisp and lantern archon), Nat armor just equal to Con modifier, DR to 1/2 HD.
    -Make fear aura only affect oponents.
    -Nice job on the custom abilities!

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    Still I disagree, however your project, your rules.
    Think for a moment. Why would anyone bother to pick area spells when you can be firing multiple rays a turn? Why bother to pick area effects limited to your own body when you can pick normally single-target effects and inflict them into multiple oponents at once?

    It's not "my" rules. It's rules that won't make your average DM throw your work out the window because you're a ray of enfeeblement/shivering touch/enervation/ray of stunning/energy drain living spell rolling over every ecounter.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    Done.

    Ideas for dead levels?
    -Instead of your current metamagic system, let the Living Spell pick metamagics from a limited list at certain levels, and apply each X times per day to it's slams (where X is dependant on the metamagic power).
    -Flight. Never understood why the original monster doesn't have it.
    -Feedback: creatures striking the living spell in melee or casting spells against it suffer the spell.
    -Ability to divide himself into smaller independent parts, dividing HP between them but otherwise each as strong as the original(besides the smaller size).
    -Weaker minions based on himself (have same spells as you, altough they may have less).
    -Heal itself whenever someone else casts a spell nearby (minions don't count for this).
    -Move the random skill bonus you gave it at first level to other levels?(a living spell has an easier time hiding? Really? Big balls of glowing crackling energy are stealthy now?)
    -Con bonus.
    -Proefeciency with slam may be usefull.

    Niezck:
    Warn Gorgondantess, I can't exactly edit it myself.

    Kyuubi:
    I'll change it to contribution then.
    Last edited by Oslecamo; 2010-09-27 at 04:33 AM.

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by Oslecamo View Post
    monkman:You've made the fear aura on your Death Knight only affect allies, it was suposed to be only enemies..
    well it's done and i'll start looking for another project
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Quote Originally Posted by Niezck View Post
    The Planetouched has no HD listing, btw.
    Good call. Edited; it's d8.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Movanic Deva

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    HD: d8
    {table]Level|Bab|Fort|Ref|Will|Feature
    1|+1 |+0|+2|+0 |Movanic Body, Heavenly Soul, +1 Dex
    2|+ 2|+0 |+3|+0|Deva, +1 Cha
    3|+ 3|+1|+3|+1|Soothing Presence of Nature, +1 Dex
    4|+ 4|+1|+4|+1|Wings, +1 Cha
    5|+5 |+1|+4 |+1 |Lesser Protective Aura, +1 Dex
    6|+6 |+2|+5 |+2 |Heavenly Deflection, +1 Cha
    7|+ 7|+2|+5|+2|Divine Equilibrium, +1 Dex
    8|+ 8|+2|+6|+2| Greater Protective Aura, +1 Cha
    9|+ 9|+3|+6|+3 |Cleansing Weapon, +1 Dex, +1 Cha
    [/table]
    Skills: 2+int modifier, quadruple at 1st level. Class skills are Concentration, Diplomacy, Disguise, Heal, Intimidate, Knowledge (Any), Listen, Perform, Sense Motive, Spellcraft, Spot, Survival.

    Proefeciencies: Movanic Deva are proficient with simple weapons, two martial weapons of their choice and no armor.

    Features
    Movanic Body:At 1st level a Movanic Deva loses all racial bonuses it had and gains outsider traits (basically darkvision 60 foot). It is a medium outsider with base speed 40 ft and a Nat Armor bonus equal to her Con modifier.

    Heavenly Soul: At each Movanic Deva level she becomes able to use soma SLAs a certain number of times per day, acording to the following list. Save DCs are 10+1/2HD+Cha Mod.

    1-Aid, Detect Evil, each 2/day for every HD she has
    2- Bless Weapon, Remove Fear, each 1/day for every HD she has
    3-Consecrate, Continual flame*, Cure Serious Wounds, each 1/day for every 3 HD she has
    4- Protection from Arrows, Daylight, each 1/day for every 2 HD she has
    5-Create food and Water, prayer, Discern Lies, each 1/day for every 3 HD she has
    6- Remove curse, remove disease, each 1/day for each 3 HD she has
    7-Death Ward, Divination, Holy Smite, each 1/day for every 4 HD she has
    8-Polymorph, Neutralize poison, Hallow, each 1/day for every 4 HD she has
    9- Attonement, Raise Dead, Commune, Ethereal Jaunt, each 1/day for every 5 HD she has.

    *Note: unless she pays the material component, a Movanic Deva's Continual Flame only last 1 minute per HD.

    A Movanic Deva who multiclasses for a divine casting class can count her Movanic Deva levels as levels of that class for purposes of CL and for the purposes of learning new spells and geting new spell slots. So for example, a Movanic Deva 2 who took 1 level of cleric could choose to have CL 3 and get 2 2nd level spell slots (1 normal and 1 domain). She wouldn't get the spell knowns and spell slots of a cleric 2 however, neither would her Movanic Deva levels count towards turn undead and domain abilities.

    In adition, a Movanic Deva may always use Charisma as her key ability score in any class she takes, instead of the normal one (like wisdom for normal clerics).

    Ability Increase:the Movanic Deva gains +1 Dex at levels 1, 3, 5, 7, 9 and +1 Cha at levels 2, 4, 6, 8, 9, for a total of +5 Dex and +5 Cha at level 9.

    Deva: At 2nd level, gains a bonus on saves against petrification and resistance to Acid, Cold and Electrecity equal to her HD, and a bonus on saves against poison and resistance to Fire equal to half her HD.

    Soothing Presence of Nature: At 3rd level, unless magically compelled to do so, no animal or plant will attack a Movanic Deva.

    In adition, she gains SR equal to 11+HD and DR/magic equal to ½ her HD.

    Wings: At 4th level, the Movanic Deva grows beatifull featherly wings that allow her to fly at a speed of 10 foot per HD with good maneuverability.

    Lesser Protective Aura: At 5th level, as a free action, a Movanic Deva can surround herself with a nimbus of light that acts as circle of protection against evil with a radius of 20 feet, with CL equal to her HD. The circle can be dispelled as normal but the Movanic Deva can create a new one as a free action at the start of her next turn.

    Heavenly Deflection:As an immediate action, as long as she's holding a melee weapon, a Movanic Deva can deflect any ranged attack targeted against her, as well as spell and supernatural abilities, as long as they have the Movanic Deva as a specific target. This includes rays, orbs and spells with a single target that don't have attack rolls.

    To suceed the Movanic Deva must suceed ona Reflex Save with DC 20+Enanchment of the weapon (in the case of a ranged attack)/Level of the spell(in the case of spell or SLA)/ half the HD of the attacker (if it isn't a spell, SLA or weapon). If the Deva suceeds the attack is deflected and completely nullified.

    The Movanic Deva must be aware of an attack to try to deflect it.

    Divine Equilibrium:Movanic Devas are immune to the harmfull effects of Positive-dominant or Negative-dominant planar energy traits.

    Greater Protective Aura: The Movanic Deva's aura now replicates a minor globe of invulnerability with 20 feet radius, CL equal to her HD, in adition to the magic circle against evil.

    Cleansing Weapon: 1/day per HD, as a free action, the Movanic Deva may grant any weapon she wields the flaming property for 1 round.


    Comments:
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    My favorite celestial, the Movanic Deva is suposed to be the lowest ranking angel of all, but still kicks a lot of ass thanks to her high mobility combined with a wide array of defensive abilities.

    Heavenly deflection is the main ability here, allowing to negate most ranged non-area attacks, and eventualy minor globe of invulnerability allows you to ignore lesser magics. Scaling flying speed allows for air superiority, SR, multiple energy resistances, Dex bonus and a wide array of defensive SLAs covers up any left holes.

    For the offensive the Movanic Deva counts with her full Bab and couple of martial proefeciencies and combat buffs to dish out the pain, and eventualy can make her weapons flaming for free.

    On the downside, the Movanic Deva has just one good save and low skill points per level to make up for all of the above.

    So if you want to play a resilient warrior angel that focuses on speed and defense the Movanic Deva's for you!

    Last edited by Oslecamo; 2010-09-29 at 05:31 PM.

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Goristro
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    {table=head]Level|BAB|Fort|Ref|Will|Special

    1st|
    +1
    |
    +2
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |+1str,+1 con,Goristro body

    2nd|
    +2
    |
    +3
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |+1 con, natural armor

    3rd|
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +1
    |
    +1
    | +1 str,+1 con, spell resitance

    4th|
    +4
    |
    +4
    |
    +1
    |
    +1
    |,+1 con, growth

    5th|
    +5
    |
    +4
    |
    +1
    |
    +1
    |+1str,+1 con, DR

    6th|
    +6
    |
    +5
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |+1 con, Stamp

    7th|
    +7
    |
    +5
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |+1str,+1 con, rock throwing

    8th|
    +8
    |
    +6
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |,+1 con, growth

    9th|
    +9
    |
    +6
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |+1str,+1 con, Trample

    10th|
    +10
    |
    +7
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |,+1 con, see invisblity

    11th|
    +11
    |
    +7
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |+1str,+1 con, improved damage reduction

    12th|
    +12
    |
    +8
    |
    +4
    |
    +4
    |+1 con, growth

    13th|
    +13
    |
    +8
    |
    +4
    |
    +4
    |+1str,+1 con [/table]
    HD=D12
    2 Skill points+int per level, quadruple at 1st level. Class skills Balance,Climb,Intimidate,Jump,Listen and Spot

    Proefeciencies a goristro is profient with his natural attack , simple and martial weapons

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    Goristro body:The goristro loses all other racial bonus and gains outsider traits (basicaly darkvision 60 feets). It's a medium sized outsider with base 40 feets and two natural slam attacks dealing 1d8 damage each. the slam attack are considered 2 handed weapons for purpose of appyling extra damage from his strenght bonus and from abilities like power attack

    Natural armor: A Goristro gains natural armor queal to his con modifier

    Spell resitance: A goristro gains spell resitance equal to 11+HD

    Growth: At 4th lv a Goristro grows to large size
    At 8th lv a Goristro grows to huge size
    At 12th lv a goristro grows to gargantuan size.
    Every time there is a size increase, the base mouvement speed increases by ten.

    DR A goristro gains Damage reduction/siver or good equal to half his HD.

    improved DR At 11th lv a gorstro gains Dr silver and good and Dr equal to his HD

    Trample Trample: At ninth level, as a full-round action, The Goristro can move up to twice his speed and literally run over any opponents at least one size category smaller than itself. The goristro merely has to move over the opponents in its path; any creature whose space is completely covered by the Goristro's space is subject to the trample attack. If a target’s space is larger than 5 feet, it is only considered trampled if the Goristro moves over all the squares it occupies.

    See invisblity A goristro has the constant effect of see invisbility.

    Stomp: 1 time per 3 HD per day, a Goristro can produce a shock wave that fuction like earthquake for 1 round. It has a range of 80+5ft/HD.

    Rock throwing At 7thlevel, the goristro may begin throwing boulders or other large objects. A goristro at least Large size can hurl rocks weighing 40 to 50 pounds each (Small objects) up to 900 feet. A Huge goristro can hurl rocks of 60 to 80 pounds (Medium objects). A Gargantuan goristro can hurl rocks of 90 to 120 pounds (large objects).



    it's not done, i know, i need some suggestions.this comes from fiendish codex 1
    Last edited by monkman; 2010-09-30 at 04:45 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    -Instead of your current metamagic system, let the Living Spell pick metamagics from a limited list at certain levels, and apply each X times per day to it's slams (where X is dependant on the metamagic power).
    Done.

    -Flight. Never understood why the original monster doesn't have it.
    Ha! I thought the same thing, my original had it, but I didn't think you'd like it. I was wrong again, and yet the world keeps spinning.

    -Feedback: creatures striking the living spell in melee or casting spells against it suffer the spell.
    Done.

    -Ability to divide himself into smaller independent parts, dividing HP between them but otherwise each as strong as the original(besides the smaller size).
    Favored this over minions.

    (A living spell has an easier time hiding? Really? Big balls of glowing crackling energy are stealthy now?)
    In a thunderstorm, or a battle where there is a wizard? Totally.
    Also, I can't imagine a Living Silence spell being terribly easy to spot.
    But you are right, this bonus to hide was accidental. Resolved.

    -Con bonus.
    -Proefeciency with slam may be usefull.
    Done and Done.
    Come with me, time out of mind...

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    Right. So, not being able to bear it anymore, I made an image for the Reth Dekala. Basically, they're described as cursed warriors composed mostly of green flame with ornate armor, so I took a legion of fire archons and ran it through a green tint and animation filter. What do you think?

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    Last edited by The Tygre; 2010-09-29 at 04:48 PM.
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    My Characters
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved monster classes(2.0):adapting creatures for player use-taking reque

    @Tygre: Thank you! I'll edit it into the Reth Dekala right away.

    @Oslecamo: It's Movanic Deva, not Monavic. Weren't you the one who was saying I couldn't do the Movanic Deva because it was your favorite and all that? At least I would've had the decency to spell its name right.

    Also: due to a... personal affront, I'll not be monitoring this thread any more. If anyone wants me to edit something, or have some input on one of my creations, or questions, please do so in a PM as opposed to a post here.
    Last edited by Gorgondantess; 2010-09-29 at 05:31 PM.
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