Flaming Whips?

[Tyger]

If you use DFI to set your weapons alight, and you hit an armoured target with your flaming whip, do you get to roll the xd6 that DFI gave you?

Normally whips do non-lethal damage, and deals no damage to armoured (or heavily natural armoured) targets. DFI says you deal an "extra" xd6 fire damage...

I know that the Damage Reduction and Energy Resistance rules let the flame damage hurt a target even if the DR reduces the weapon damage to 0, but what about this flaming whip of mine???

[Jack Zander]

I'd say yes, its not broken in any way, but it's probably up to DM interpretation.

[Tyndmyr]

Damage is damage. DR still affects nonlethal damage exactly the same, so I don't see any reason it'd be different.

[Tyger]

Damage is damage. DR still affects nonlethal damage exactly the same, so I don't see any reason it'd be different.

Tyndmyr, I am not certain what that means... Do you think the firey whip would damage (albeit only fire damage) a fighter in plate?

Might be interesting to have a Duskblade use a Whip with Channel Arcana to get 15' reach on touch attack spells. Though there are probably better ways to do it.

And yes, that is a good combination! Reminds me to point out Whip to the Duskblade in our group.

[DragoonWraith]

Might be interesting to have a Duskblade use a Whip with Channel Arcana to get 15' reach on touch attack spells. Though there are probably better ways to do it.

[Keld Denar]

The whip would deal 0 + xd6 fire damage. Simple as that.

[Flickerdart]

RAW, I don't think so, as the damage is still dealt by the whip, which normally deals no damage against that target. However, there's nothing broken about allowing this to work.

[Tyger]

RAW, I don't think so, as the damage is still dealt by the whip, which normally deals no damage against that target. However, there's nothing broken about allowing this to work.

Except DR can reduce the weapon damage of, for example, a flaming longsword, to 0 sword damage, but DR does nothing to reduce the fire damage, which requires Energy Resistance.

From the SRD

Whenever damage reduction completely negates the damage from an attack, it also negates most special effects that accompany the attack, such as injury type poison, a monk’s stunning, and injury type disease. Damage reduction does not negate touch attacks, energy damage dealt along with an attack, or energy drains. Nor does it affect poisons or diseases delivered by inhalation, ingestion, or contact.

emphasis mine

[Tyndmyr]

Tyndmyr, I am not certain what that means... Do you think the firey whip would damage (albeit only fire damage) a fighter in plate?

I see no rule stating it wouldn't.

[Marnath]

The whip would deal 0 + xd6 fire damage. Simple as that.

This is the correct answer. Assuming you hit, obviously.

[Greenish]

Except DR can reduce the weapon damage of, for example, a flaming longsword, to 0 sword damage, but DR does nothing to reduce the fire damage, which requires Energy Resistance.

From the SRD emphasis mine

Interestingly, it seems that Wraithstrike and Emerald Blade ignore all DR.

[RS14]

Except DR can reduce the weapon damage of, for example, a flaming longsword, to 0 sword damage, but DR does nothing to reduce the fire damage, which requires Energy Resistance.

But this isn't DR. The whip has a special rule,

It deals no damage to any creature with an armor bonus of +1 or higher or a natural armor bonus of +3 or higher.

which doesn't really leave much room for interpretation. By RAW, no. That said, it's not broken to allow it, and makes more sense.

[Fax Celestis]

But this isn't DR. The whip has a special rule,



which doesn't really leave much room for interpretation. By RAW, no. That said, it's not broken to allow it, and makes more sense.

The whip deals no damage. The fire surrounding the whip still does.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Just dip a level of Pyrokeneticist to have a Flame Lash which is a touch attack and does more fire damage on top of the DFI... problem solved.

[Volthawk]

Just dip a level of Pyrokeneticist to have a Flame Lash which is a touch attack and does more fire damage on top of the DFI... problem solved.

So that means your fire is on fire, then?

[Redshirt Army]

So that means your fire is on fire, then?

Yo dawg...

[Flickerdart]

So that means your fire is on fire, then?

Not only that, but the Pyro has an ability that sets his weapon on fire (Weapon Afire, appropriately enough). So your flaming fire whip is now on fire.

It works even better with a Necklace of Natural Attacks, because you can use both Hand Afire and Nimbus to set your hand on fire.

[Fax Celestis]

It works even better with a Necklace of Natural Attacks, because you can use both Hand Afire and Nimbus to set your hand on fire.

...and then UPD a scroll of produce flame?

[Dusk Eclipse]

If this is going to de-rail into a how much fire you can fit into a character?

I have to say that I approve

[Piedmon_Sama]

The whip would deal 0 + xd6 fire damage. Simple as that.

This is how we agreed to handle it IMC, it's simple and rewards the innovation. (Of course my game being low-magic, my rogue plans to treat her whip in naptha and just ready a tinder strip before wrapping it around a target. Fire Resist 5 lets her get away with this.)

[Flickerdart]

...and then UPD a scroll of produce flame?

I think you can also slot in a crystal of elemental assault (fire).

[The Glyphstone]

And be a half-fire elemental fire genasi.

[ericgrau]

There's a monster with a flaming whip so it better work. 0 + xd6 also seems to be right by common sense and the RAW someone posted, just go with it and don't split hairs.

[Tyndmyr]

And be a half-fire elemental fire genasi.

I actually played such a character once. Dual wielding flaming whips. In an epic campaign.

Terrible build, in retrospect, since EVERYTHING has DR by then, but at least it looked awesome.