Melee fighter taking advantage of speed

[WarKitty]

Our group includes a Fighter 4 who wants to build a fast fighter type. She would like to stay in armor that doesn't restrict her movement speed or her dex bonus. Her dex isn't great but it isn't awful (14 I think)? She definitely wants to be in melee but also definitely wants to retain her movement. Her primary weapon is a scythe.

So here's my challenge for you - what dips, feats, and/or level-appropriate magic items would you recommend for her to best take advantage of the style she seems to prefer? She wants to be mobile rather than straight tank-ish.

[crazedloon]

xeph psychic warrior with the feat which allows extra attacks from Comp Psi this will allow her to boost her speed with the xeph move around with powers and throw down alot of attacks and keep moving

[Marnath]

Assuming this is in play already, I'd suggest Boots of striding and Springing as a starting point. If she's not too late to change class, a reclass to scout would be a good idea, they're built to be mobile like you describe.

[The Shadowmind]

Travel devotion or spirit lion barbarian.
Possible:Animal devotion as well(works with either of the above choices).

[DeltaEmil]

What sort of armor? Full plate? Aside from that, the standard answer would be to take something like a few levels in warblade or lion totem barbarian, which have both stuff to make a melee person run faster, kill stuff with more strength, pouncing to full-attack after walking around, or stuff that grants extra movement and a special attack, and the old and trusted shock-trooper-leaping attack-feat combo as ubercharger.

And if walking around in full-plate, then mithral is always good.

[WarKitty]

No changing classes or pisonics allowed. I figured to get the totem barbarian for grab, but we'd like to either get her a way to hit and get out of retaliation range or get better AC.

Edit: player absolutely refuses to wear anything heavier than breastplate. And frankly none of us have the gold at this point for mithral.

[Ernir]

Swordsage is my go-to class for this kind of thing, but if the ToB isn't on your table (or this particular player doesn't like it, or the character is a no-wis type), there's always the good old Dervish. Neither should require a rebuild, especially not the Swordsage.

[gallagher]

No changing classes or pisonics allowed. I figured to get the totem barbarian for grab, but we'd like to either get her a way to hit and get out of retaliation range or get better AC.

Edit: player absolutely refuses to wear anything heavier than breastplate. And frankly none of us have the gold at this point for mithral.

the only way i can think of at the present moment is either spring attack or get a pair of anklets of relocation or whatever they are called. the ones that allow you to have a 10 foot teleport (i think as an immediate action) 3 times a day?

also, why would she want to hit and run? she wont be able to use her extra attacks then

[Chipp Zanuff]

No changing classes or pisonics allowed. I figured to get the totem barbarian for grab, but we'd like to either get her a way to hit and get out of retaliation range or get better AC.

Dip Cleric for Travel Devotion (Complete Champion).

Unless by "No changing classes" you mean "No Multiclassing" in addition to no Retraining (PH2).


The problems with this strategy is that the Core classes are not made for it (save for Paladins, Rangers, and Druids, no class can get a Move+Full Attack off without Pounce).


And by Lion Totem, he means Complete Champion version (not Unearthed Arcana/SRD). CC version gives Pounce for Full Attacks after a charge.

[Shade Kerrin]

there's always the good old Dervish.

Seconded. Will cost 4 feats to qualify, but fits the need perfectly

[herrhauptmann]

If multiclassing, perhaps a swiftblade will provide the character with what they want.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070327

[WarKitty]

No retraining is what I mean. To be honest the player is a bit too much of a "rp over optimization" for our group. Not that the rest of us don't roleplay or take the occasional flavor feat, but...well it ends up putting her below the power level of the rest of the group. So a couple of us took it upon ourselves to figure out how to build this character.

[Fax Celestis]

Dodge (preferably Desert Wind Dodge, or if your group allows Monte Cook's Book of Experimental Might, Defensive Moves) > Mobility > Spring Attack > Bounding Assault > Rapid Blitz. Maybe Evasive Reflexes and/or Elusive Target. There's a PrC somewhere that gives accelerated Skirmish, which could also help.

[Chipp Zanuff]

No retraining is what I mean. To be honest the player is a bit too much of a "rp over optimization" for our group. Not that the rest of us don't roleplay or take the occasional flavor feat, but...well it ends up putting her below the power level of the rest of the group. So a couple of us took it upon ourselves to figure out how to build this character.

Fighter 4/Swordsage 16 will get the job done then. As long as this player sticks with Desert Wind, it will fit the flavor she is going for.

If Swordsage isn't an option, Dervish.

[Eldariel]

Fighter 4/Swordsage 16 will get the job done then. As long as this player sticks with Desert Wind, it will fit the flavor she is going for.

If Swordsage isn't an option, Dervish.

Pretty much this. Fighter 4 is a fine cut-off point for a Dervish (gets you Melee Weapon Mastery) & you only need 1-2 more levels (something that grants feats probably) to enter, and then you can just go all the way. And Swordsage does the same, better, if allowed.

[Thurbane]

I would suggest two things from ToM:

Tooth of Savnok (item) - unslotted item allows you to ignore movement restrictions from armor.

Binder (3 or 4) dip - with the Improved Binding feat, you can bind Paimon, who gives some great abilities for a mobile melee type: +4 untyped bonus to DEX, Dance of Death 1/5 rounds (attack every creature you pass in a move action)...plus some other things like bonuses to Tumble and Whirlwind Attack.

[Dr.Epic]

Take one level of barbarian: rage is great ability and you gain fast movement.

[El Dorado]

More of a long term solution: Swiftblade.

[Snake-Aes]

No changing classes or pisonics allowed. I figured to get the totem barbarian for grab, but we'd like to either get her a way to hit and get out of retaliation range or get better AC.

Edit: player absolutely refuses to wear anything heavier than breastplate. And frankly none of us have the gold at this point for mithral.

Then she's stuck with a chainshirt until she can pay up a mithral breastplate, which is the heaviest armor she'll ever use before magic.
Travel Devotion is a feat she simply must take. Since she'll be on light armor all the time, Dervish is a good class to take. I am at a loss on magic items he could use.

[Amphetryon]

She could dip Totemist 2 for the Blink Shirt.

[Snake-Aes]

She could dip Totemist 2 for the Blink Shirt.

Blink shirt's power relies on a high shaper level. With a dip like that you're stuck with a 10' standard action teleport, which doesn't really help the case.

[Amphetryon]

Blink shirt's power relies on a high shaper level. With a dip like that you're stuck with a 10' standard action teleport, which doesn't really help the case.

No, if she binds it to her totem chakra it's a move action teleport, per page 61 of Magic of Incarnum, currently in my hand. If this was errata'd, please link.

[Demons_eye]

I would suggest two things from ToM:

Tooth of Savnok (item) - unslotted item allows you to ignore movement restrictions from armor.

Binder (3 or 4) dip - with the Improved Binding feat, you can bind Paimon, who gives some great abilities for a mobile melee type: +4 untyped bonus to DEX, Dance of Death 1/5 rounds (attack every creature you pass in a move action)...plus some other things like bonuses to Tumble and Whirlwind Attack.

Seconded

No, if she binds it to her totem chakra it's a move action teleport, per page 61 of Magic of Incarnum, currently in my hand. If this was errata'd, please link.

Still rather slow

[Snake-Aes]

No, if she binds it to her totem chakra it's a move action teleport, per page 61 of Magic of Incarnum, currently in my hand. If this was errata'd, please link.

I thought it was the heart bind?
Regardless, you're still limited by your essentia in how far you can blink, which is still bad as a totemist 2, where you are stuck teleporting 30' as a move action. 2 levels into a separate class just to replace the normal "30' move" with "30' teleport" is kind of a waste, given there are better options out there.

[Greenish]

Blink shirt's power relies on a high shaper level. With a dip like that you're stuck with a 10' standard action teleport, which doesn't really help the case.

It's 10' per point of Essentia invested, and binding it to totem chakra, as noted, makes it a move action (though you still can't take other actions after using it).

[Snake-Aes]

It's 10' per point of Essentia invested, and binding it to totem chakra, as noted, makes it a move action (though you still can't take other actions after using it).

Yeah, which I corrected in my second post and still makes for a subpar movement alternative if you aren't actually investing in the class. Travel devotion alone surpasses "totemist 2 with bound blink shirt" by far because it lets you move your speed (which will always be at least 30' for a character worried about speed) as a swift action for 10 rounds. And it doesn't break your class composition.

[Amphetryon]

It's 10' per point of Essentia invested, and binding it to totem chakra, as noted, makes it a move action (though you still can't take other actions after using it).

Exactly. Fax suggested Desert Wind Dodge; using Midnight Dodge instead would get another point of Essentia, for instance, and you'd have 2 points just from the 2 level dip. Remember also that a 2 level dip into Totemist gets you 3 Soulmelds. By way of example, those other two Soulmelds could be a Brass Mane for +4 Intimidate, and a Krenshar Mask for +4 on Jump and Move Silently. Those aren't the only options, of course. Add in the 'free' +3 FORT and +3 REF from the dip, and it's a pretty decent deal.

[Person_Man]

I see most of the good advice has been given. You may wish to peruse the Pounce and Free Movement thread. If she doesn't want to retrain, I would say that her best option would be Fighter 4/Cleric 1/Warmind 10. Cleric for access to Travel Devotion, Warmind for access to Hustle, Psionic Lion's Pounce, and Psionic Dimension Door.

Alternatively, she could just ride a mount. Even something cheap like a normal warhorse or a figurine of wondrous power (Sandstorm) would drastically improve mobility without having to invest any feats or class levels.

But as others have opined, the best solution would be retraining, or suicide to get another character. Swordsage, Binder, Totemist, Paladin, and Cleric are all much more mobile options.

[Demons_eye]

Exactly. Fax suggested Desert Wind Dodge; using Midnight Dodge instead would get another point of Essentia, for instance, and you'd have 2 points just from the 2 level dip. Remember also that a 2 level dip into Totemist gets you 3 Soulmelds. By way of example, those other two Soulmelds could be a Brass Mane for +4 Intimidate, and a Krenshar Mask for +4 on Jump and Move Silently. Those aren't the only options, of course. Add in the 'free' +3 FORT and +3 REF from the dip, and it's a pretty decent deal.

You still are limited to putting only two essentia in I believe.

[Snake-Aes]

You still are limited to putting only two essentia in I believe.

And most of the other gains can be given by other classes / class features, which is why I'm putting a totemist dip in check like that.