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  1. - Top - End - #541
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Magicyop View Post
    I just want to thank you very much for the critique, your suggestions are excellent and I'm working on editing now.

    The free action things used to be just "the first time someone sees you" but Gorgon suggested I liken it more to a gaze attack so that the Dream Larva doesn't frighten their comrades. The idea is that the various fear auras are not things that can be used separately, or at different strengths, but that you activate your fear aura and it has an effect according to your level. AKA, at level 20, you can activate it once for each person, with the save-or-die effect, you may no longer use the panick, cower, frighten, or shaken fear auras. I will make that more clear.
    Alternately, you could make them swift or immediate actions, which would preclude the use of many such abilities in one round.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magicyop View Post
    How does a bonus every two levels sound? AKA, +1 Str at 1st, +1 Cha at 3rd, +1 Str at 5th, etcetera.
    It depends what you want to do with the melee capacity of the creature. As it was, the Str balanced out the low BAB of the creature and made it a 'doesn't hit so much, but hits hard', but things were problematic with the 9 natural attacks for 4dwhatever each.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magicyop View Post
    Also, it has no native plane, I don't believe, what should I put? Basically it's just the unholy spawn of a god of dreams. Could be anywhere.
    Morpheus. Plane of dreams.

    Also, please keep a changelog of any changes you make to classes after the original post. A running list of alterations you've made (and if you're up to it, when you made said alterations). It's good for people who are commenting or looking at other people's comments: Person A says "That's too strong", Creator lowers strength, then Person B says "Person A is wrong, it's not strong at all."

    It's also helpful for people who start to play with a monster in their game, but run into problems when the monster gets altered in the meantime. With a changelog, they can more or less work out what their creature was like prior to the changes, and keep playing with it like that, if they so wish.
    Last edited by Hyudra; 2010-10-18 at 01:41 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #542
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Added a changelog and said it was native to Morpheus. Thank you very much!
    Full Homebrew List

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    Auran Pirate, a sailor who engraves their ship with powerful runes and creates a vessel to be remembered.

    Many thanks to Qwernt for my amazing mind flayer avatar!

  3. - Top - End - #543
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Chambers View Post
    Dwarf Ancestor
    • Curious, why'd you include both high BAB and +strength at every level? That's more raw power than most classes in this thread get.
    • In the comments, you say "The dwarf ancestor's natural armor gets reduced significantly to balance [the full plate]", but it has standard con bonus = natural armor and +6 con over 6 levels to boot. Clarify?
    • No offense, but it comes across as rather dull. It can't do anything, given most/all of its abilities are so passive. Armor bonuses and feats aren't exciting, and this (coupled with the emphasis on stats) kind of runs against the core ideas of this project (see OP). This ties into the point that...
    • Tanking sucks. To be a viable tank, you need to be able to outlast the enemy and you need to be able to make yourself a priority target. The trouble with the Dwarf Ancestor is that the enemy is largely going to either ignore you, or hit you with stuff that you have no defenses against (will saves, reflex saves, touch attacks). No opponents worth their salt are going to use 'save vs. fort' attacks against the giant, burly stone dwarf in full plate, nor are they going to swing their weapons at it. Especially if it is a ghostly giant stone dwarf. So what will inevitably happen is that the Dwarf Ancestor will be the last one standing, having delivered a few melee hits while the enemy targets its companions, and then get either worn down by the remaining enemies (or encounters of the day) and/or left to drag his companions' corpses home.


    The class needs more active abilities, perhaps toned down stats, and a way to make its tanking matter (preferably against more than just melee attacks). Look at the Knight (who makes terrain around it difficult, and thus bogs down enemies), or taunting options (goad the enemy into attacking you), ways to get into the thick of things & keep enemies in reach, etc.
    Last edited by Hyudra; 2010-10-18 at 02:16 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #544
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hyudra View Post
    *snip*
    or taunting options (goad the enemy into attacking you), ways to get into the thick of things & keep enemies in reach, etc.
    Here's an idea.

    Ancestral curses: have the guardian actively nerf enemies who attack his allies instead of him. So, in order to kill his friends, they have to kill the tank.
    Homebrew: Ghost Rider, a 3.5e Base Class inspired by Marvel's Comics.


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  5. - Top - End - #545
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Chambers View Post
    Dwarf Ancestor
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    Alignment: Any
    Hit Die: d10
    Class Skills: The dwarf ancestor's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Climb (Str), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge: History (Int), Knowledge: The Planes (Int), Listen (Wis), & Spot (Wis).

    Skill Points at 1st level: (4 + Int mod) x4.
    Skill Points at each additional level: 4+ Int modifier.

    {table=head]Level|BAB|Fort|Ref|Will|Special Ability
    1|+1|+2|+0|+0|Ancestor Body, +1 Str, +1 Con
    2|+2|+3|+0|+0|Power Attack, +1 Str, +1 Con
    3|+3|+3|+1|+1|Ancestoral Spirit, Hardening, +1 Str, +1 Con
    4|+4|+4|+1|+1|Cleave, +1 Str, +1 Con
    5|+5|+4|+1|+1|Blink Out, Growth, +1 Str, +1 Con
    6|+6/+1|+5|+2|+2|Supreme Cleave, Improved Hardening, +1 Str, +1 Con
    [/table]

    Ancestor Body: The dwarf ancestor loses all other racial traits and becomes an outsider with the native subtype. The dwarf ancestor has the following characteristics:
    • Darkvision 60ft
    • Proficient with all simple and martial weapons. Not proficient with any type of armor or shields.
    • Does not need to eat, sleep, or breath, but can still benefit from the effects of consumable spells and magic items such as heroes' feats and potions. Spellcasters must still rest for 8 hours before regaining spells for the day.
    • Natural Armor bonus equal to Constitution modifier
    • Damage Reduction (Adamantine) equal to Half Hit Die (minimum DR 1/Adamantine).
    • Living Plate
    • Light Fortification


    Living Plate: The Dwarf Ancestor's body is actually a form of living stone that provides a +4 armor bonus and resembles full plate. This living plate is not natural armor and does not stack with other effects that give an armor bonus (other than natural armor). The living plate occupies the same space on the body as a suit of armor or a robe, and thus a dwarf ancestor cannot wear armor or magic robes. Dwarf ancestors can be enchanted just as armor can, though the ancestor dwarf must be present for the entire time it takes to enchant him.

    Living plate also provides an dwarf ancestor with a 5% arcane spell failure chance, though any class ability that allows an ancestor dwarf to ignore the arcane spell failure chance for light armor lets him ignore this penalty as well.

    Light Fortification (Ex): When a critical hit or sneak attack is scored on a dwarf ancestor, there is a 25% chance that the critical hit or sneak attack is negated and damage is instead rolled normally.

    Power Attack (Ex): At 2nd level the dwarf ancestor gains Power Attack as a bonus feat.

    Ancestral Spirit (Su): Any ally (including the dwarf ancestor) within 30ft of the dwarf ancestor gains a +1 morale bonus on attack rolls and damage rolls.

    Hardening (Ex): The armor bonus provided by the dwarf ancestors living plate increases to +6.

    Cleave (Ex): At 4th level the dwarf ancestor gains Cleave as a bonus feat.

    Blink Out (Su): Once per encounter as a free action the dwarf ancestor can become incorpreal until the beginning of it's next turn. Activating this ability is a free action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity.

    Growth (Ex): At 5th level the dwarf ancestor increases in size to Large (tall).

    Supreme Cleave (Ex): At 6th level and higher a dwarf ancestor may take a 5ft step before making a cleave attempt.

    Improved Hardening (Ex): The armor bonus provided by the dwarf ancestors living plate increases to +8.


    Comments/Changelog
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    I took a page from the Warforged and gave the dwarf ancestor a version of composite plating that can be enchanted. The armor bonus increases as the dwarf ancestor gains levels until at level 6 the living plate grants a +8 armor bonus.

    The dwarf ancestor's natural armor gets reduced significantly to balance this, thereby avoiding the trap of having a really high natural armor bonus but not being able to wear armor.

    Blink Out is modified to once per encounter and Ancestral Spirit is changed to all allies (not just dwarves).

    Supreme Cleave helps out with an otherwise lack-luster combat option.

    Overall the dwarf ancestor is a simple tank, with a high armor class and good damage reduction. It doesn't come with advanced combat tactics built in but is instead a good chassis for melee characters.
    Yeah, assuming an 18 str starting, that's plus eight to hit at by third level, thanks to Ancestral Spirit, which is pretty impressive. I'd give it str every odd level, con every even.

    Also, I don't think that Ancestral Spirit should give the Ancestor the +1 to hit and damage. It should be more of a party boost.

    And yeah, maybe look at the Knight for abilities that let it absorb other folks' attacks?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Divide by Zero View Post
    Hulking Hurler can get something like (10^83)d6 damage, which is many orders of magnitude greater than the number of particles in the universe.
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  6. - Top - End - #546
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hyudra View Post
    • Curious, why'd you include both high BAB and +strength at every level? That's more raw power than most classes in this thread get.
    • In the comments, you say "The dwarf ancestor's natural armor gets reduced significantly to balance [the full plate]", but it has standard con bonus = natural armor and +6 con over 6 levels to boot. Clarify?
    • No offense, but it comes across as rather dull. It can't do anything, given most/all of its abilities are so passive. Armor bonuses and feats aren't exciting, and this (coupled with the emphasis on stats) kind of runs against the core ideas of this project (see OP). This ties into the point that...
    • Tanking sucks. To be a viable tank, you need to be able to outlast the enemy and you need to be able to make yourself a priority target. The trouble with the Dwarf Ancestor is that the enemy is largely going to either ignore you, or hit you with stuff that you have no defenses against (will saves, reflex saves, touch attacks). No opponents worth their salt are going to use 'save vs. fort' attacks against the giant, burly stone dwarf in full plate, nor are they going to swing their weapons at it. Especially if it is a ghostly giant stone dwarf. So what will inevitably happen is that the Dwarf Ancestor will be the last one standing, having delivered a few melee hits while the enemy targets its companions, and then get either worn down by the remaining enemies (or encounters of the day) and/or left to drag his companions' corpses home.


    The class needs more active abilities, perhaps toned down stats, and a way to make its tanking matter (preferably against more than just melee attacks). Look at the Knight (who makes terrain around it difficult, and thus bogs down enemies), or taunting options (goad the enemy into attacking you), ways to get into the thick of things & keep enemies in reach, etc.
    Thanks for the critique.

    The Dwarf Ancestor gets a +18 Natural Armor bonus, as well as 22 Str and 28 Con. Most of it's abilities are passive (armor class boosts, ability boosts, damage reduction) because that's what the monster has.

    I agree that it's kinda bland, but I disagree that it sucks (you didn't actually say this, but that's my impression). Scaling DR / Adamantine is pretty good. A +8 armor bonus (that can be enchanted) with no movement or skill penalty is pretty good. I didn't put more combat abilities in there because the monster didn't have them.

    Honestly, your arguments against tanking are the usual arguments against melee classes, not this class in particular. I'm not disputing them...it's just, meh. That's one of the problem with melee classes in D&D - they often don't do what it should.

    I'll go back and consider other combat options that would be interesting and viable.
    "We have sent many to Hell, to smooth our way," said I, "and we are standing yet and holding blades. What more?"

  7. - Top - End - #547
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Just want to post a request a Purple Worm class
    I'm surprised that this wasn't already in the database.
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  8. - Top - End - #548
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    It's been rejected. It's a vanilla melee swallow whole class. I suppose if there's enough of a call for it someone could make it, but so far it's been rejected.
    Avatar by zimmerwald1915

    Quote Originally Posted by Divide by Zero View Post
    Hulking Hurler can get something like (10^83)d6 damage, which is many orders of magnitude greater than the number of particles in the universe.
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  9. - Top - End - #549
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by mootoall View Post
    It's been rejected. It's a vanilla melee swallow whole class. I suppose if there's enough of a call for it someone could make it, but so far it's been rejected.
    Not outright rejected so much as left at the wayside. There isn't alot to work with so it's a challenge to complete it. I'm sure someone will get to it eventually, but at the moment there are just too many interesting monsters yet to be completed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ms.Malbolge View Post
    Listen to the Crafy one. He speaks the truth, except when he doesn't which may still be the truth hidden behind a veil of crafty craftiness.

    Or something.

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Crafty Cultist View Post
    Not outright rejected so much as left at the wayside. There isn't alot to work with so it's a challenge to complete it. I'm sure someone will get to it eventually, but at the moment there are just too many interesting monsters yet to be completed.
    Ahh. Thanks for clarifying.
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  11. - Top - End - #551
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Malebranche:
    Check out the Cornugon or Erinyes for the "Devil" ability, DR SR & resistances. They all follow the same pattern, no reason to break it here.
    Scrap the Power Attack bonus feat. That's not our business here.
    Either make it 3/4 BAB, or reduce the strength bonuses.
    Just a nitpick: there should be a "chance" after 25% in cruel intent.
    Improved Body for War is unfinished.
    Otherwise, what Hyudra said. Could stand to be a bit less vanilla, though.

    Cogidubnus: Pun for critical damage!
    The hp increases are just weird. Just copy it from the force golem.
    On the recast abilities, Lead Framing should scale: give it a DC of (10+1/2 HD+Cha mod) and have the poison damage increase steps based on HD... probably starting at 1, then increasing by one step every 3 HD after 3, up to 1d8.
    Singing hands is powerful enough without the wounding property.
    Otherwise, looks okay.

    Black Dragon: State that grim withering is a mind-affecting fear effect. Also, it just needs to be redone- make it no save, flat penalty to anyone attacking the dragon.
    Abilities should always come before ability score increases in the table.
    I always thought of the Black Dragon as more con based than anything... I really don't think it should have the same strength increases as a red dragon, anyways.
    Twisted Mind is just weak. I'd make it charisma modifier wisdom damage, no save, and for anyone trying to use a thought detecting spell OR a charm or compulsion. Then allow a save for anyone affected by the full-round action. You also need to state the DC.
    Acidic Nightmare is weak. Just let it use Create/Destroy water uses, first and foremost. Then, I'd have it 1d6 damage/2 HD. Maybe let it pierce acid resistance/immunity at a later HD.
    One With Black Waters is also weak; I'd give it a flat out hide in plain sight, usable only in shadowy illumination or underwater.
    Drenched in acid is also also weak. Check out the monster of legend's raging blood & advancement.
    Again, Acid Rain is weak. I think you overestimate 4d6 damage. That's an average of 14 damage. PATHETIC. Make it worth using!
    Anyways, a good capstone ability would be piercing resistances/immunity to acid with spells, or abilities, or breath weapon, or whatever. Also, maybe give it some poison tagged onto the breath weapon at later levels? Or maybe even just a little con damage. Just some suggestions.

    Gravetouched Ghoul: My only problem with this one is that's it's far too complex. You have saves being rolled left and right, damage every hour, a bunch of small bonuses & penalties scattered about, accumulations... it's sortof messy and complicated.
    Oh, and the bite damage is a bit iffy. +2x strength mod? I'd give it +1.5x at most.
    Finally: Any particular reason you decided to give it full BAB? Ghouls aren't exactly martial experts. And then there's the 4+int mod skill points, and what's up with the saves? Undead do have fortitude saves.
    Also, I haven't read the fluff, but I don't believe there's anything in particular about them being damaged by the sun.
    I LOVE stash. That's hilarious. One thing though:
    "To make a hole large enough to escape through, the creature must deliver at least 20 points of damage to the container for every size category they have."
    For every size category who has? How do you calculate that? Also, methinks a leather sack would be much easier to cut through than a barrel. Just me. Still... it is nicely simple.
    Fee Fi Fo Fum is great. However, how far out does the blindsight extend? What if said injured foe is attacking from a very, very long ways away? What if they are fleeing? Etc.
    Elaborate on Haughty. I had no idea what it meant for a minute or so... just say that he may replace his intimidate modifier with his will save modifier for the purposes of mind-affecting spells & effects.
    Does oversize weapon stack with powerful build? So an 8th level large cloud giant could wield gargantuan weapons?
    Grind His Bones is good.
    Cloud palace is cool.
    Otherwise, another excellent giant.

    Anaxim: I agree with Hyudra. A quick solution to the SLAs is to let them scale: rather than giving both repair light damage, repair moderate damage, and so on and so forth, just make the SLA improve, gaining the next step instead of the former, as opposed to additionally. Then, have repair & inflict come from the same pool. Same for lightning bolt/chain lightning.
    I have no idea where these armor/weapon enhancement spells came from- they're obviously non-OGL, though.

    Dream Larva: First of all, state that Glimpse of Terror subsumes Darkest Fears, and so on and so forth. The idea is that they scale, not that it gets all of them at once.
    Anyways... yeah, I was thinking the natural attacks were a bit much, but decided to save that for later. Scale them back?
    Anyways, the gaze is appropriate- I disagree with Hyudra on that one. Especially when by the time it gets to frightening, most enemies are already immune... though you NEED to state, for ALL of them, that it's a mind-affecting fear effect. That cuts down on its power, a lot.
    Honestly, I'm fine with the gaze attack- my marraenoloth gets a similar ability before level 10, and I happen to like my marraenoloth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chambers View Post
    Thanks for the critique.

    The Dwarf Ancestor gets a +18 Natural Armor bonus, as well as 22 Str and 28 Con. Most of it's abilities are passive (armor class boosts, ability boosts, damage reduction) because that's what the monster has.

    I agree that it's kinda bland, but I disagree that it sucks (you didn't actually say this, but that's my impression). Scaling DR / Adamantine is pretty good. A +8 armor bonus (that can be enchanted) with no movement or skill penalty is pretty good. I didn't put more combat abilities in there because the monster didn't have them.

    Honestly, your arguments against tanking are the usual arguments against melee classes, not this class in particular. I'm not disputing them...it's just, meh. That's one of the problem with melee classes in D&D - they often don't do what it should.
    Honestly, I agree with everything Hyudra says. Yes, melee often doesn't do what it should, but that doesn't mean you should keep doing that! Tome of Battle has already proven that melee can be awesome, and a monster by the one critiquing you not 2 pages back proves you can take a monster with little other than passive, vanilla abilities and turn it into something interesting and fun. Check out the fire giant and frost giant, and compare them to the SRD. You should also use them as a balancing point. As is, the Dwarf Ancestor gets far too many flat, passive bonuses and nothing interesting. Our goal here at Improved Monster Classes is to do just the opposite.
    I'm not saying that you're a bad homebrewer or anything- I myself would be hard pressed to get anywhere with the dwarf ancestor. You've taken on an immensely challenging class.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crafty Cultist View Post
    Not outright rejected so much as left at the wayside. There isn't alot to work with so it's a challenge to complete it. I'm sure someone will get to it eventually, but at the moment there are just too many interesting monsters yet to be completed.
    This.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    well, I'M going to attempt it, although I've only designed one class.



    EDIT: Nah, I'm too bad to do this sorta thing.
    Last edited by Betropper; 2010-10-18 at 05:58 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Shaedling

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    {table=head]Level|BAB|Fort|Ref|Will|Special

    1st|
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |Fey body,+1 dex,+1 cha
    2nd|
    +1
    |
    +0
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    | Sleeping curse, Wall of darkness,Create Shadow Gossamer,+1 dex,+1 cha[/table]
    HD =D8

    Proficiencies : It gains Proficiencies with light armor, light sheild, simple and martial weapons.

    Skills4+intel modfier (X4 at first level) Class Skills Bluff,Diplomacy,Escape Artist,Hide,Listen,Move silently,Spot,

    Fey body:A shadeling loses all other racial bonus and gains fey traits(basically darkvision and low light vision). It is a medium sized fey with a base speed of 30ft.The shaedling has wings, but isn't initially able to fly

    At 4th HD, it gains the ability to fly with a speed of 40ft+5/Hd with average maneuverability.

    Create Shadow Gossamer A shaedling is able to create a non liquide weapon or tool of 15 pounds or lighter as a swift action.This substance is black in color. Shields that are from Shadow Gossamer have a 1 less on their armor check penalty. This ability last 5 rounds per hd. they can use this ability 2 time per Hd per day. At 3rd HD the item fuctions like masterwork,At 6th HD it gains a +1 bonus one items made by shadow gossamer. At 9th HD and every 3Hd latter it gains a addition +1 bonus, it finshes at lv 18 with a +5 bonus to shadow gossamer items.Shadow gossamer implements dissipate to nothingness if they leave the hands of a shaedling for longer than 1 round

    Sleeping curse Once a per day per Hd a Shaedling is able to enchant a weapon with the sleep for 1 round, it is a swift action. If this hit the enemy must make a save(10+1/2Hd+Cha modifer) or fall asleep of 1d6 round. They cannot be woken up by anything but a remove curse spell.

    Wall of darkness Once a per day per Hd a Shaedling can create a wall of darkness up yo 30 ft long.This blocks the ligne of sight of those who do not have darkvision.

    tell me what you think and im not really sure about skills and profs(MM4)
    Last edited by monkman; 2010-10-21 at 04:37 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Gravetouched Ghoul: My only problem with this one is that's it's far too complex. You have saves being rolled left and right, damage every hour, a bunch of small bonuses & penalties scattered about, accumulations... it's sortof messy and complicated.
    Ok. I've had that complaint about other classes, and it's apt here. I'm going to see what I can do to reduce the number of saves being rolled during the day, and simplify the Gorge bonuses.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Oh, and the bite damage is a bit iffy. +2x strength mod? I'd give it +1.5x at most.
    That's fine. TBH, it was a placeholder while I put other ideas to the page, and I never went back to revise it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Finally: Any particular reason you decided to give it full BAB? Ghouls aren't exactly martial experts. And then there's the 4+int mod skill points, and what's up with the saves? Undead do have fortitude saves.
    Ghouls aren't martial experts. Gravetouched ghouls can be, though, since the primary difference between the two is that the Gravetouched Ghoul retains memories and skills from its past life.

    That said, I had a dilemma in making the ghoul viable. I didn't want to define it as a 'brute' class, since they're more characterized by ferocity and skulking than by "smash!", and I wanted a gravetouched ghoul to have a fighting chance against an equivalent level elf (or skeleton, or golem) when the gravetouched ghoul's paralysis/disease isn't going to help. 1d4 damage weapons are very underwhelming.

    So chalk it up to residual hand to hand skills and the raw intensity/ferocity of a wild animal attack, combined so one creature has the best of both worlds.

    I'm open to alternate suggestions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Also, I haven't read the fluff, but I don't believe there's anything in particular about them being damaged by the sun.
    Nothing explicit. They prefer to avoid it, though.

    A lot of what I did with the ghoul worked from the assumption that ghouls aren't taking nutrition/sustenance from what they eat; they're feeding off of the energies to bolster the internal reserves of negative energy that keeps them going. They're absorbing the negative energies via. food in the form of the residual death energies (from corpses) or the pain/torment (still living, helpless prey). On the opposite side of the coin, they're deterred by any source of positive energy. Cure spells are one, but the sun is also a more generalized source of such.

    It's true, though, that the sunlight rule kind of adds to bookkeeping in an annoying way. I'll think on it and then rewrite the issue.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    I LOVE stash. That's hilarious. One thing though:
    "To make a hole large enough to escape through, the creature must deliver at least 20 points of damage to the container for every size category they have."
    For every size category who has? How do you calculate that? Also, methinks a leather sack would be much easier to cut through than a barrel. Just me. Still... it is nicely simple.
    Simplicity is what I was going for. Granted, I can't remember what I was thinking at the time, since I wrote that bit two months ago, but it may have been a placeholder I forgot to revise, as with bite.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Fee Fi Fo Fum is great. However, how far out does the blindsight extend? What if said injured foe is attacking from a very, very long ways away? What if they are fleeing? Etc.
    I'll note it's 30'.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Elaborate on Haughty. I had no idea what it meant for a minute or so... just say that he may replace his intimidate modifier with his will save modifier for the purposes of mind-affecting spells & effects.
    Doable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Does oversize weapon stack with powerful build? So an 8th level large cloud giant could wield gargantuan weapons?
    Yeah, it stacks. A little weird, but the 'wield oversize weapon' thing is a defining Cloud Giant trait, and that makes for a weird dynamic. I can't think of a way around it that doesn't make things even more confusing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Grind His Bones is good.
    Cloud palace is cool.
    Otherwise, another excellent giant.
    Good to hear.
    Quote Originally Posted by Chambers View Post
    I agree that it's kinda bland, but I disagree that it sucks (you didn't actually say this, but that's my impression). Scaling DR / Adamantine is pretty good. A +8 armor bonus (that can be enchanted) with no movement or skill penalty is pretty good. I didn't put more combat abilities in there because the monster didn't have them.

    Honestly, your arguments against tanking are the usual arguments against melee classes, not this class in particular. I'm not disputing them...it's just, meh. That's one of the problem with melee classes in D&D - they often don't do what it should.
    Well, some melee is quite viable. ToB is ok, and a well built barbarian can dish out an incredible amount of melee hurt in a short span of time. To make your statement more accurate, you could say 'Hyudra's arguments against tanking are the usual arguments against bad melee classes.'

    Your class isn't bad, per se. It just wouldn't be particularly exciting to play, and it wouldn't thrive in a wide variety of encounters, scenarios & campaigns. Players would be more liable to have moments of frustration with the class being unable to meaningfully contribute in some encounters/scenarios than they'd be getting excited and saying "Oh yeah, [class feature] is awesome!" (ideally with the DM smiling indulgently and not banging his head against the wall.)

    Adding to what Gorgon said, part of the process of creating a monster class is adding flavorful abilities to round out the class, so there's less monster (high HP/HD, massive stats, simple to play, abilities that can theoretically be used all day without issue) and more of a class (interesting to play, versatile, abilities can't be abused, not omnidimensional or too two dimensional, etc). In the case of your Dwarf Ancestor, we'd de-emphasize passive abilities, stats, and emphasize the things that make it actively fun to play. In doing so, we strive to stay true to the monster flavor, rather than the mechanics as presented.
    Last edited by Hyudra; 2010-10-18 at 07:17 PM.

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Hmm...
    If Purple Worm isn't possible, what about a WereTyrannosaurus?
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Okay, so, Shadeling ... Dear god. Firstly, what was that about no flight at first level? I believe that was in here somewhere ... Secondly, if they get reach on all their weapons, they're violently good at battlefield control. A reach greataxe is not something I'd want my players to have. How long do Shadow Gossamer items last? How many times per day? I don't want someone getting the perfect weapon every encounter.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Divide by Zero View Post
    Hulking Hurler can get something like (10^83)d6 damage, which is many orders of magnitude greater than the number of particles in the universe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Betropper View Post
    Hmm...
    If Purple Worm isn't possible, what about a WereTyrannosaurus?
    I believe there's a Wereanything class that you can just plug stuff into. I think it's actually titled Werewhathaveyou and is under the Wererhino link in the lycanthrope spoiler.

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by mootoall View Post
    Okay, so, Shadeling ... Dear god. Firstly, what was that about no flight at first level? I believe that was in here somewhere ... Secondly, if they get reach on all their weapons, they're violently good at battlefield control. A reach greataxe is not something I'd want my players to have. How long do Shadow Gossamer items last? How many times per day? I don't want someone getting the perfect weapon every encounter.
    should it come at 4hd but with jump and glide?

    Should i take out the reach?It dosent say the number of times or turns, Suggestion then?
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Unholy scion(template)

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    HD= D8
    Special: Cannot be taken as a 1st level class. The creature must be evil, and cannot be an undead, construct, elemental or ooze.
    {table=head]Level|BAB|Fort|Ref|Will|Special

    1st|
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +2
    |Unholy Scion Body, Lesser Unholy Magic

    2nd|
    +1
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +3
    | Unholy Strike, Intermediate Unholy Magic

    3rd|
    +2
    |
    +1
    |
    +1
    |
    +3
    |Unholy Creature, Greater Unholy Magic[/table]
    Skills:4+int mod
    Class skills Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Knowledge (arcana) Knowledge (the planes), Sense Motive, Spellcraft, and Spot

    Unholy Scion Body: The Unholy Scion becomes an outsider and gains the outsider traits (including 60' darkvision); unlike other monster classes, they do not lose their previous racial traits. It gains 2 claw attacks that deal 1d6+str mod damage; if the creature already has claw attacks, their damage increases by one step.

    Unholy Magic: The Unholy Scion gains several spell like abilities, as shown on the table below. The save DCs for these SLAs are (10+1/2 HD+Cha mod).
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    ** this is only allowed if the base creature is an animal or magical beast.
    For Gate the unholy scion is only allowed to use the Planar Travel.

    If they multiclasses for an divine class they can count its Unholy scion levels as levels of that class for purposes of CL and for the purposes of learning new spells and granting new spell slots. So for example, an Unholy scion 3 who took 1 level of Favored soul could choose to have CL 4, get 3 2nd level spell slots, 1 1st level spell slot, 1 2nd level spell known and 1 0th level spell known. It wouldn't get the spell known and spell slots of a Favored soul 1-3 however.



    Unholy strike:The unholy scion is able to infuse dark energy into his weapon. He gains an additional amount of profane damage based on his HD to all melee attacks & melee touch attacks.


    Unholy creature An Unholy scion gains SR equal to 10+HD, as well as DR/Good or Magic equal to 1/2 HD. This becomes DR/Good and Magic at 10 HD. In addition, an Unholy Scion gains fast healing equal to half its HD, resistance to poison and mind affecting spells equal to its HD and resistance to fire, cold, electricity and acid equal to 1/2 its HD.

    I put it in a spolier and you must of not see it so here it is again.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Started purple worm. Calling dibs.

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Have changed Dream Larva as you requested. Reduced damage of each natural attack, specified that it a mind-affecting fear effect and that you may only use the highest level available to you. Anything else, or can I mark down the milestone of finishing my first monster class?
    Last edited by Magicyop; 2010-10-18 at 08:02 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hyudra View Post
    Started purple worm. Calling dibs.
    According to what others have been saying, best of luck. I want to try it out when it's done.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Shaedling... Well, you might as well say it was hit by a shatter spell, because it's broken, broken, broken. You do realize that with create shadow gossamer it can make 15 lbs of diamonds? Or, say, and adamantium weapon? Beyond that, the "reach of 10 feet" is even worse.
    Also, check out the wyvern for flight at first level without being, y'know, flight at first level.
    Anyways, sorry 'bout the Unholy scion, it's on the list now.

    Now, I realize that we have a sizable backlog of creatures that haven't been totally finished. I'm not sure if the creator is just taking a break, or hasn't gotten to it, or doesn't realize it's not finished, but, well, it's not finished.

    Those whose monsters are on the list below have a week to either respond or finish their creation, or I will finish it myself.
    Ettin
    Nimblewright

    Soulspark
    Phoelarch
    Mineral Warrior
    Awakened Cat
    Last edited by Gorgondantess; 2010-10-18 at 10:25 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Now, I realize that we have a sizable backlog of creatures that haven't been totally finished. I'm not sure if the creator is just taking a break, or hasn't gotten to it, or doesn't realize it's not finished, but, well, it's not finished.

    Those whose monsters are on the list below have a week to either respond or finish their creation, or I will finish it myself.
    Ettin
    Nimblewright
    Soulspark
    Phoelarch
    Mineral Warrior
    Awakened Cat
    Taking a break because of a computer...problem. It blew up. With fire and everything. That was interesting. Anyway, I plan on finishing within a week.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Temotei View Post
    Taking a break because of a computer...problem. It blew up. With fire and everything. That was interesting. Anyway, I plan on finishing within a week.
    Wow... do you know how this could have possibly be caused? I didn't know there was anything inside a computer that could blow up, unless somebody who's been reading fight club has a vendetta against you.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Avatar by zimmerwald1915

    Quote Originally Posted by Divide by Zero View Post
    Hulking Hurler can get something like (10^83)d6 damage, which is many orders of magnitude greater than the number of particles in the universe.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
    Wow... do you know how this could have possibly be caused? I didn't know there was anything inside a computer that could blow up, unless somebody who's been reading fight club has a vendetta against you.
    I think it was my fan, actually. It was really, really dusty in the computer when I opened it up. I'm guessing everything that was working to keep my computer cool and running failed from being clogged with dust.

    That's just a guess, though. It wasn't so much an explosion as a fireball, though. Luckily, it just went, "BOOM!" and ended, instead of starting a fire or anything.

    Good news: Nobody was hurt.
    Bad news: I lost a great deal of work and time.
    Ugly news: All I have left to use is an old Gateway laptop.
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Temotei View Post
    Ugly news: All I have left to use is an old Gateway laptop.
    You're letting that stop you? I wrote up most of the Horrid Creature using my iPod Touch.

    Getting back on topic, I've got the Purple Worm maybe 90% done, but won't be posting it until I get the Cloud Giant & Gravetouched Ghoul revised & added to the list. This was a fun creature to write up, but I know I'm going to have to rewrite a few abilities.

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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hyudra View Post
    You're letting that stop you? I wrote up most of the Horrid Creature using my iPod Touch.
    I'm really not a big fan of laptops, first of all, but the big kicker is the bad news. Maybe I should have switched the bad and the ugly. Ah, well.

    Edits shall be made!
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    Default Re: [3.5]Improved Monster Classes- Still Alive, and taking requests!

    Purple Worm's initial draft is done. Back to Gravetouched Ghoul/Cloud Giant, in the meantime.

    Edit:
    Gravetouched Ghoul: Removed the save vs. hunger during daylight hours (sunrise only, now) and changed Gorging to a flat +2 to two different stats, for simplicity. Again, for simplicity, ghoul fever is only transmitted by bite (so each attack only has 1 save required), and I reduced the strength bonus on bite.

    Cloud Giant: Clarified blindsight via. Fee Fi Fo Fum, changed wording on Haughty, clarified that Oversized Weapon stacks with Powerful Build.
    Let me know if there's more to be done. When those two are cleared, I'll post Purple Worm.
    Last edited by Hyudra; 2010-10-19 at 12:06 AM.

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