Support the GITP forums on Patreon
Help support GITP's forums (and ongoing server maintenance) via Patreon
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 65
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    In my current campaign I have a Druid, Cleric, Warlock and a Rouge. The Cleric plans to become a Stormlord and the Druid wants to be a shape shifter turning into bears.

    I wanted to know are there any Spells that I should not allow my players to have? and what spells do you forbid in your games?

    Books we use are ...
    - Core (phb, dmg, mm)
    - Completes
    - Race's Of
    - Magic Of Incarnum
    - Dragon Magic
    - MIC
    - Unearthed Arcanna
    - Spell Compendium

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Keld Denar's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fax Celestis View Post
    AILHAY THULUCAY! AILHAY THULUCAY! AILHAY THULUCAY!
    _________________________________
    A beholder’s favorite foods include small live mammals, exotic mushrooms and other fungi, gnomes, beef, pork, colorful leafy vegetables, leaves, flower petals, insects, and birds.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    dsmiles's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    In the T.A.R.D.I.S.
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Personally, none. But I trust my group not to break the game.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Doctor
    People assume that time is a strict progression of cause-to-effect, but actually from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint - it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly... time-y wimey... stuff.
    Awesomesauce Doctor WhOotS-atar by Ceika!

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Drakevarg's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Vvardenfell

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    I can't say what you should ban (except maybe disjunction), but I ban a lot of spells, though largely for flavor reasons. I could list 'em all, but they'd take up half the page.
    Books Owned:
    Spoiler
    Show
    Player's Handbook
    Dungeon Master's Guide
    Monster Manual
    Monster Manual III
    Complete Adventurer
    Complete Arcane
    Complete Divine
    Complete Warrior
    Draconomicon
    Fiend Folio
    Frostburn
    Heroes of Battle
    Heroes of Horror
    Libris Mortis
    Lords of Madness
    Planar Handbook
    Sandstorm
    Savage Species
    Stormwrack
    Unearthed Arcana
    Races of the Dragon
    Races of Stone

  5. - Top - End - #5

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    I ban a few (like Streamers, Venomfire, and Celerity), and tweak some others.
    Last edited by Godless_Paladin; 2010-10-27 at 08:54 PM.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2007

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    I ban Streamers, and ban Venomfire as part of a general ban on the entire book Serpent Kingdoms.

    Other than that, my games tend to be more or less anything-goes. Other than Doc Roc, none of my friends that live near me are going to come up with anything I don't know about, so it's fine by me if they want to break things. Generally speaking, the rule is that I'll optimize just a tiny bit less than my players do.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Definitely streamers, and disjunction (never ever open that can of worms), and you should really understand celerity well (and its tactical implication and limitations) or ban it. Never heard of venomfire.

    EDIT: oh, and see the thread on Ray of Stupidity- it's not game breaking in general, but you'd want to ban in some campaigns (if animals or other very low INT critters play a big part).
    Last edited by Skorj; 2010-10-27 at 09:12 PM.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2007

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    I don't ban Disjunction because it serves legitimate tactical purposes, such as taking away all of the other guy's shiny stuff. If people really don't want to deal with it, they should just carry rings of counterspelling or one of the many other ways to not get hit by spells you really don't want to deal with.

    Hell, if it's that big of a problem, just go with the pointy wizard hat.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    gbprime's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Suburban Dystopia
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    I'm better at powergaming than my players, so no, there's nothing I'm worried about. But I vowed only to use my powers for good.

    We don't use psionics or incarnum though, so that does remove some possibilities right there.
    .
    Ding, You've Got Trophies!
    Spoiler
    Show

    Don't part with your illusions. When they are gone you may still exist but you have ceased to live. - Samuel Clemens

    Oh, and DFTBA.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Titan in the Playground
     
    PairO'Dice Lost's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Malsheem, Nessus
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    I'm the resident optimizer in my group. I've told my players that they can use anything they want, but anything cheesy then becomes available to NPCs, and there are more of them than there are PCs. I haven't had them break anything so far.
    Better to DM in Baator than play in Celestia
    You can just call me Dice; that's how I roll.


    Spoiler: Sig of Holding
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by abadguy View Post
    Darn you PoDL for making me care about a bunch of NPC Commoners!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chambers View Post
    I'm pretty sure turning Waterdeep into a sheet of glass wasn't the best win condition for that fight. We lived though!
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxiDuRaritry View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by PairO'DiceLost View Post
    <Snip>
    Where are my Like, Love, and Want to Have Your Manchildren (Totally Homo) buttons for this post?
    Won a cookie for this, won everything for this

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Colossus in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Finland
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Not if I can houserule things into sanity and not if it removes something too important from the world; screw PAO being broken, Wizards are supposed to be able to permanently transform X into Y. In such cases I much prefer solution of trying to find a non-broken version of the spell rather than removing it entirely. Something like Streamers tho? Nobody even knows how it works; yeah, good riddance.
    Campaign Journal: Uncovering the Lost World - A Player's Diary in Low-Magic D&D (Latest Update: 8.3.2014)
    Being Bane: A Guide to Barbarians Cracking Small Men - Ever Been Angry?! Then this is for you!
    SRD Averages - An aggregation of all the key stats of all the monster entries on SRD arranged by CR.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Beneath date registered
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Heck, last campaign I banned arcane magic entirely just because I was very strapped for time and didn't feel like adjudicating.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Titan in the Playground
     
    tyckspoon's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Quote Originally Posted by Skorj View Post
    Never heard of venomfire.
    Venomfire adds d6/cl acid damage to any poison-bearing natural attacks you have. It's notorious for several things- the damage is uncapped, so caster level boosts work very well with it (and being primarily a Druid spell, well, Divine caster levels are markedly easier to raise than arcane.) It's hour/level, so it's pretty much a permanent buff (and again, it makes it very easy to apply short-term caster-level increases to it.) And it does utterly ridiculous things when applied to the Fleshraker and its three poisonous pouncing attacks (it has five on a pounce, but only 3 are poisonous.) Fleshraker is already a singularly effective Wildshape and Animal Companion choice for the level, and Venomfire just throws it completely over the top.

  14. - Top - End - #14

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Ofc, check BG for the Dirty Handbook fixes.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2007

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certain Spells?

    Most of the really serious balance problems in 3.5 come from tier differences. The existence of "broken" spells, provided that a) there's agreement how they work and b) there isn't a huge gap in how available they are to different characters, doesn't really break anything. In a world where classes and monsters that don't keep up to Tier 3 or better simply get weeded out by natural selection, and the wizards have figured out that things like PAO are more effective when you start with a set of class features that actually makes use of [Ex] abilities and special attacks, balance isn't that big of a deal.

    The bottom line is that there are very few spells, in and of themselves, that make (we'll say) a well-built warblade completely irrelevant UNLESS you're dealing with chains, loops, or other such tricks. Those tricks can generally be neutralized by mutually assured destruction and the assumption that swords ensure the evolution of shields. The problem is when you have such a huge set of options that a warblade can't expect to counter all of your combinations (as with a wizard), or when the non-caster just doesn't have meaningful or useful options (as with a fighter or monk).

    So if you're really concerned about spellcasters breaking your game, ban prepared full-casters, because they can literally switch to a new bag of tricks overnight. Ban non-casters who don't have access to some other form of scaling power, because they just don't do anything after the first few levels. But most spells aren't going to break your game in and of themselves, unless your world is unrealistically fragile.

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Here and there.
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    quite the opposite, I even make more spells. again, I just a Karma/Balance system. if things are getting heated with flying meteors then their going to be eating flying comets.

    My Homebrew

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DruidGuy

    Join Date
    Oct 2010

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    In my gaming group there is pretty much a common consensus regarding what goes and what doesn't.

    So far we have a very short list of spells/other stuff that gets banned in every game: PaO for obvious reasons, Celerity, Wraithstrike (because it makes armor irrelevant, and anyone that can't cast Scintillating Ccales is more or less dead before the encoutner even starts). Gate might also make it on this list if we get to 17th level+ more often (only happened once so far).

    In addition, each particular DM has banned one thing or another that he didn't like. For example, in the current campaign, my DM has banned Assay SR, Resurgence and Revivify/Last Breath. He explained that he really liked SR to play a role in some encoutner and also wanted death or failed saves, when they happened to bear at least some significance.

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Daemon

    Join Date
    Apr 2010

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Quote Originally Posted by PairO'Dice Lost View Post
    I'm the resident optimizer in my group. I've told my players that they can use anything they want, but anything cheesy then becomes available to NPCs, and there are more of them than there are PCs. I haven't had them break anything so far.
    He does scary, scary things with casters. Ever tried fighting a room of illusions without True Seeing? Yeah, somebody died.
    Homebrew: Ghost Rider, a 3.5e Base Class inspired by Marvel's Comics.


    So guys, the new Iron Man trailer, huh?

    Spoiler
    Show


  19. - Top - End - #19
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    We never get high enough in level to have to worry about truly horrible stuff like gate or timestop. So all I have to do is to modify fly and teleport to be impractical to use, and all is well.

    There is the druid who's fond of the famous rhino (or triceratops) avalanche. But when all is said and done? It takes long enough to get all the spells cast - it's never actually happened.

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    We don't ban spells, typically. There is a Gentleman's Agreement of "If the players have it, so do the NPCs" that I see a lot of people tend to adopt as well.

    We like some of the broken spells, but not to be cheesy in combat with them, really.

    For example: We had a half sun elf/drow in one of our previous campaigns, and considering the stigma of her heritage, she took advantage of our friendship we made with some Sylthalar (sp? The swarm-things from Lords of Madness). She was Phrenic, and high enough level for Teleport, so every few days she'd go back and request another PaO into something. Usually something pretty, like a full sun elf. It was so amusing, that we just started saying she was a cosmetic surgery addict.

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Colossus in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Dinosaur Museum aw yisss.
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    I've never really banned anything much, but my players are asked not to use Wind Walk just cuz a lot of my adventures are based on travel. If anyone really, really wanted it, I'd make do, but they don't, so we're good.

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Oct 2009

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zertryx View Post
    In my current campaign I have a Druid, Cleric, Warlock and a Rouge. The Cleric plans to become a Stormlord and the Druid wants to be a shape shifter turning into bears.

    I wanted to know are there any Spells that I should not allow my players to have? and what spells do you forbid in your games?

    Books we use are ...
    - Core (phb, dmg, mm)
    - Completes
    - Race's Of
    - Magic Of Incarnum
    - Dragon Magic
    - MIC
    - Unearthed Arcanna
    - Spell Compendium

    -Polymorph and all of its like (baleful polymorph, alter self etc)
    -rope trick
    -Streamers
    -Celerity

    -contact other plane and its like nerft to no future available
    -detect evil nerft to 1/3 of the population is evil

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DruidGuy

    Join Date
    Oct 2010

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Quote Originally Posted by Genn Greymane View Post
    We don't ban spells, typically. There is a Gentleman's Agreement of "If the players have it, so do the NPCs" that I see a lot of people tend to adopt as well.
    That's how our group works too. If we use certain good tactics, we can fully expect to see them used against us when it's appropriate for the enemies to do so.
    Last edited by LordBlades; 2010-10-28 at 07:49 AM.

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    GnomeWizardGuy

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    London
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    I'd throw Control Winds in there as well, just for the enourmous affect it can have without your players even meaning to.

    plus,
    1.) Called/Summoned minions can't be forced to use SLAs that would burn xp if they were spells, Created ones just don't have them
    2.) The future is uncertain when your actions affect it, you can look at big stuff but the more the PCs are involved the harder it is to get details from divinations
    3.) Simulacrums don't have Su or SLAs
    4.) Teleport/plane shift line has a ten minute casting time
    5.) Polymorph school line replaces the core versions
    6.) permanancy spells can be surpressed but not dispelled except by Disjunctions
    7.) You may use Disjunction but each PC usage means the player owes the group a pizza
    8.) Fabricate is ruled on a case by case common sense basis, you can't make a thousand swords all joined together with a thin string of metal just CAUSE alright?
    9.) Feeblemind wears off after 1/day per CL
    Give them bread and circusses and the plebs wont rise against you. Give adventurers dungeons and trapped chests and they won't waste time looking to ransack your home and kill your wife.

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    MonkGuy

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Springfield, MO
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    I was expecting a category of spells called Certian Spells, much like Druid Spells or Sorc/Wiz Spells.

    The best way to approach a banlist is to wait until something becomes a problem. If nobody has used Shivering Touch in a broken way yet then don't worry about it. When somebody starts abusing Celerity, say "Cute, and I'll refund your money/let you learn a different spell/whatever, but that spell no longer exists in this game."
    Master Rahl guide us. Master Rahl teach us. Master Rahl protect us. In your light we thrive. In your mercy we are sheltered. In your wisdom we are humbled. We live to serve. Our lives are yours.

    Awesome Richard avatar by kpenguin!

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Oct 2010

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    It very much depends on the setting. In my Anthropomorphic Gestalt game i openly admit every thing is broken to my characters and don't ban any thing (except long range teleports and plane shifts because of story reasons)

    More reasonable games i ban things on a case by case basis.

  27. - Top - End - #27
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Oct 2010

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    What's PaO?

    I just read these threads to see what I can abuse. :P

    Although there's a relatively easy way of controlling players who are overly evil, mess with reality, etc. Just include the sanity system from Heroes of Horror. Assign a value for every evil/reality bending act and then start penalizing. I've never played a DnD game, or DM'd. but that should work really well. Wizards who cause time to stop on their command, who change the weather, they'd either let the power go to their head or start withdrawing from the world, becoming Chaotic. Seeing nothing as stable, as permanent.

    People who use Venomfire would eventually go insane or completely evil. Only so much pain and suffering you can inflict before it gets to you. I'm a Lovecraft fan so I may be biased towards the sanity system, but in theory, it should work really well. And you wouldn't have to bother OP'ing the NPC's to stay on par with the PC's. Just find a LG god who smites them when they get too evil, or a CN being who whisks them away to Pandemonium when they get too C. Or just let them go mad.

    The rest of the OP builds (anything not caster) seem to be so situational that merely not providing that situation would result in them being useless. A jumper is useless in a cavern with a low ceiling, a reach weapon is useless when the NPC's attack from range, a charger build is useless when there's no room to charge. And so on. No point removing elements when you control the world. Besides, everyone knows Planar Druid beats any spell found in the books so far in terms of OP cheese.


    TL;DR/DC;DR

    Imposing a sanity system for magic/evil acts would very quickly result in a self correcting problem. Too many remove insanity spells would eventually fracture a persons brain beyond repair.

    Situational builds are useless outside their comfort zone.

    I still don't know what PaO is.

  28. - Top - End - #28
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    MonkGuy

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zertryx View Post
    In my current campaign I have a Druid, Cleric, Warlock and a Rouge.
    ROGUEROGUEROGUEROGUEROGUEROGUEROGUEROGUEROGUEROGUE ROGUEROGUEROGUEROGUEROGUE Unless you mean that one of your other characters has a serious makeup problem, for the love of god, why must people fail at spelling one of the core classes so very often?
    Pokemon friend code : 3067-5701-8746

    Trade list can be found on my Giant League wiki page, all pokemon are kept in stock with 5 IVs, most with egg moves, some bred for Hidden Powers. Currently at 55 in stock and counting.

    Padherders for my phone and my tablet!

  29. - Top - End - #29

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    Quote Originally Posted by Newt View Post
    What's PaO?
    Polymorph Any Object. The most broken uses are to cast it twice and gain a new form permanently. Other broken uses include using it to become a high INT creature for purposes of boosting intelligence, since some believe that PaO removes the HD cap already in place on Polymorph. The line of reasoning is that you may use it to cause something to become a rock, which has no HD at all. It's pretty shaky and cheesy.

  30. - Top - End - #30
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    GnomePirate

    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Appalachian Mountains

    Default Re: [3.5] Do you Ban Certian Spells?

    The groups I play with have a gentleman's agreement: the player's get to use the cheese first, but if they use cheese, it becomes fair game for the bad guys.
    Aratos Tell
    HP:53/53 AC:19,FlatFooted:16,Touch:13
    Active Effects: Speak w/Animals
    Spells Prepared: Cure Minor Wounds*4, Flare, Calm Animals, Charm Animal, Cure Light Wounds, Animal Messenger, Flaming Sphere, Lesser Restoration, Hold Animal, Cure Mod. Wounds*2, Speak w/Plants

    Megiddo
    HP:26/26 PP: 40/40 AC:14,FlatFooted:13,Touch:13
    Active Effects:
    Spells Prepared: Light*2, Burning Hands*2, Protection f/Evil, Magic Missile, Shocking Grasp, See Invis., Acid Arrow, Scorching Ray*2

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •