What Constitutes An Attack? [3.P]

[AtopTheMountain]

So, spells like Invisibility and Time Stop talk about not being able to use "attacks". But what exactly is an attack? Obviously, hitting someone with a melee or ranged weapon is. But what about spells? Are the only "attack" spells the ones that deal damage? What about things like Slow and Stinking Cloud, that cause negative effects? What about offensive-ish spelles that don't do damage, like Dimensional Anchor? Where do you draw the line?

[Jack_Simth]

So, spells like Invisibility and Time Stop talk about not being able to use "attacks". But what exactly is an attack? Obviously, hitting someone with a melee or ranged weapon is. But what about spells? Are the only "attack" spells the ones that deal damage? What about things like Slow and Stinking Cloud, that cause negative effects? What about offensive-ish spelles that don't do damage, like Dimensional Anchor? Where do you draw the line?

Not clearly defined in RAW. If I happen to be DMing?

Would an affected party want it to happen to them if they knew about it? If no, it's probably an attack. If yes, it's probably not.

Oh yes, and do note that the Invisibility and Time Stop clauses are vastly different:

With Time Stop, you can do whatever you want, it just can't affect anyone directly while time is stopped (including allies) - however, once time resumes, any spells that still have durations running continue - so if you Cloudkill / Dimension Lock / Forcecage someone (a rather silly combo, but eh), then they're stuck in there unless they can beat one of the three, and it's quite legal to do so.

With Invisibility, you can do whatever you want, but if it constitutes an 'attack', then you stop being invisible.

[JBento]

Anything in which you have to make an attack roll, or an opponent has to make a save is an attack. If you TARGET an enemy with something, well, that's an attack too.

Slow and Stinking Cloud are attacks (though I think the Cloud is only an attack if you cast it affecting a space an enemy occupies - if you cast it somewhere else and it frifts there, I don't think it is). Dimensional Anchor is an attack, too. Summon spells aren't, for instance.

[arrowhen]

So, spells like Invisibility and Time Stop talk about not being able to use "attacks". But what exactly is an attack? Obviously, hitting someone with a melee or ranged weapon is. But what about spells? Are the only "attack" spells the ones that deal damage? What about things like Slow and Stinking Cloud, that cause negative effects? What about offensive-ish spelles that don't do damage, like Dimensional Anchor? Where do you draw the line?

For Invisibility, the distinction is made clear in the spell's description...

For purposes of this spell, an attack includes any spell targeting a foe or whose area or effect includes a foe. (Exactly who is a foe depends on the invisible character’s perceptions.) Actions directed at unattended objects do not break the spell. Causing harm indirectly is not an attack. Thus, an invisible being can open doors, talk, eat, climb stairs, summon monsters and have them attack, cut the ropes holding a rope bridge while enemies are on the bridge, remotely trigger traps, open a portcullis to release attack dogs, and so forth. If the subject attacks directly, however, it immediately becomes visible along with all its gear. Spells such as bless that specifically affect allies but not foes are not attacks for this purpose, even when they include foes in their area.

[arrowhen]

Slow and Stinking Cloud are attacks (though I think the Cloud is only an attack if you cast it affecting a space an enemy occupies - if you cast it somewhere else and it frifts there, I don't think it is).

Stinking Cloud doesn't drift. Moderate or strong wind causes it to disperse, but the cloud doesn't actually move. I think you're thinking Cloudkill.

[John Campbell]

For purposes of this spell, an attack includes any spell targeting a foe or whose area or effect includes a foe. (Exactly who is a foe depends on the invisible character’s perceptions.)

That's an interesting clause...

So does that mean that if an invisible character could be induced to attack - e.g., through use of mind-control spells - people he perceives as his friends, it wouldn't break invisibility?

[arrowhen]

So does that mean that if an invisible character could be induced to attack - e.g., through use of mind-control spells - people he perceives as his friends, it wouldn't break invisibility?

I think that would probably lead to a prolonged semantic debate about "foe" vs. "enemy".

[FelixG]

That's an interesting clause...

So does that mean that if an invisible character could be induced to attack - e.g., through use of mind-control spells - people he perceives as his friends, it wouldn't break invisibility?

I am not attacking any does thank you! i am just casting disintegrate on some friends i happen to be annoyed with right now, so mr DM my Invisibility is not broken!

[Ernir]

"I define the recurring villain as An Old Friend."