Ardent/Cloistered Cleric/XXX?

[mootoall]

I've been on a bit of a psionics binge lately, and I've had an idea for an Ardent/Cloistered Cleric character. However, I was wondering, is there any class that allows progression of both class features? Can someone show me a sample build for that type of character?

[Psyren]

I've been on a bit of a psionics binge lately, and I've had an idea for an Ardent/Cloistered Cleric character. However, I was wondering, is there any class that allows progression of both class features? Can someone show me a sample build for that type of character?

You mean Psychic Theurge?

[mootoall]

Hmm, I assume that doesn't allow me to gain more mantles? Are there any other Wis based manifesters, besides the PsyWar?

[Psyren]

Well, there's Divine Mi... actually, forget I said anything.

War Mind is also Wis-based, but is best entered as a melee rather than a caster as it has its own progression. Fist of Zuoken/Zerth Cenobite are in a similar vein, for monks.

You actually don't need more mantles; your first 2 levels of Ardent give you 3, which add up to 30 potential powers, and you can only know 21 anyway. If you're worried that the mantles you want have holes in them, simply plug them up with Mantle substitution.

Your best bet is Ardent/Ur-Priest/Psychic Theurge for dual 9s; this build oozes with both power and flavor. You won't really be a Cloistered Cleric anymore though.

[T.G. Oskar]

I've been on a bit of a psionics binge lately, and I've had an idea for an Ardent/Cloistered Cleric character. However, I was wondering, is there any class that allows progression of both class features? Can someone show me a sample build for that type of character?

As someone else mentioned, Psychic Theurge. It's sorta like Mystic Theurge on that: You can enter after you get 2nd level spells and 2nd level powers. Hence, you need at least Ardent 3/Cloistered Cleric 3 to enter "legally" (as in, without any troubles).

Now, if you subscribe to the idea that the Ardent's power progression depends on your manifester level, you can enter with Cloistered Cleric 4/Ardent 1, with Practiced Manifester (Ardent) which can be gained even if you aren't a psionic creature, so as long as you have 4 ranks in Psicraft (if you can get Psicraft as a class skill, better); in any case, you need to reach at least level 5 to enter. From there, you need to use the leapfrogging technique: Cloistered Cleric 4/Ardent 1 (with PM: Ardent to gain access to 2nd and 3rd level powers)/Psychic Theurge 10.

Another way is doing it legally but taking advantage of the system later on. Mostly: CC 3/Ardent 3/Psychic Theurge 10/Cloistered Cleric +3/Ardent +1 (with Practiced Manifester as your 18th level power). That way, you'd get 8th level divine spells and 9th level psionic powers (since you'd have ML 18, which allows you to get 9th level powers).

Now, if you don't subscribe to the idea of Ardent manifester level granting powers, then it's pretty simple: CC 3/Ardent 3/Psychic Theurge 10, then decide whether powers or spells are better and use the last 4 levels on a PrC that works that out. If you decide for spells over powers, Combat Medic (Heroes of Battle) works well for those last 4 levels, because you get the first two healing kickers, plus Evasion.

Whatever you do, replacing the CC's Knowledge domain for Knowledge Devotion is a smart move (since you'll get all Knowledge skills as class skills as an Ardent anyways), and you'll still be able to wear heavy armor as an Ardent. CC should go first, though, since you'll have better advantages by getting the CC's skill points over the Ardent's ones.

[mootoall]

That sounds ... extremely good. I like it a lot. So the build would be Ardent2/Ur-Priest 3/Psychic Theurge 10/Whatever I like 5? Or do the pre-reqs mean I can enter earlier/have to enter later?

Ninja'd, and explained fantastically!

[Psyren]

Try to get 10 levels of Ardent in there if you can. Ardent 10/Ur-Priest 2/Psychic Theurge 8 gets you dual 9s and 4 mantles.

I say four mantles, because you are trading in the 5th one - for Dominant Ideal (same Mind's Eye link as before), the ACF so powerful it puts Ardents on even footing with Psions.

With Dominant Ideal and Mantle Substitution, you will give any psion a run for his money.

[mootoall]

... You, sir, are one clever, sneaky fellow. And I like that.

[Draz74]

A lot of these tips are straight out of the Ardent Handbook on BrilliantGameologists.