[3.5e] Cleric vs Druid

[Kaeso]

Hey all,

Both the Cleric and the Druid are comparable classes: They're both divine casters who's melee prowess can turn even the strongest fighter into a poetry-writing emo. There are also some major differences: a cleric's focus lies on healing, while a druids specialty is summoning bears while becoming a bear and riding a bear. This makes me wonder which one of the two:
-Is stronger in a 1 on 1 fight
-Is stronger in a 1 on 1 fight against monsters
-Is more useful in a party

EDIT: This is, of course, done without stinky, stinky cheese.

[Eloel]

There are also some major differences: a cleric's focus lies on healing DMM, while a druids specialty is summoning bears while becoming a bear and riding a bear.

Fixed. Clerics that heal in-battle are nowhere near relevant, compared to pretty much anything else they can do.

[Orzel]

Depends. Low to moderate optimization, Druid. High, cleric.

Druids are powerful once you get the feat. Their features are powerful at base value, the extra books don't add that much.

Clerics rely mostly on their spell list and turns. Therefore they are completely limited by their spell slots and scrolls. Once you get the additional books for the items and spells...

[Yorrin]

Depends. Low to moderate optimization, Druid. High, cleric.

+1

Druids are just kinda powerful out-of-the-box, but unless you're going Planar Shepherd there's nothing that splat-books really add to them since most of their best spells/wildshape forms are in PHB/MM1. Just grab Natural Spell and you're set.

Clerics, on the other hand, not only get some very nice spells from splat books, but they also get nice new domains and more importantly feats that let you optimize the hell out of them (or into them, depending on your alignment).

[randomhero00]

Clerics are far more useful to the party because they get things earlier the party needs.

Death ward. Restoration. Raise Dead. etc.

Druid will really just be stepping on the melee's toes. They really have no *true* spot in the game.

edit: but haha, i love em and play em though.

[Eldariel]

Clerics are far more useful to the party because they get things earlier the party needs.

Death ward. Restoration. Raise Dead. etc.

Druid will really just be stepping on the melee's toes. They really have no *true* spot in the game.

Eh. They're still fine divine and offensive casters. Druid is the ultimate fifth wheel; he has great offensive casting, great curative casting, great fighting prowess and great skills. The only problem is that instead of being slightly worse than a focused class of each type and just doing lots of things, they end up better than focused classes in many things (of course they're worse casters than Wizards and have somewhat worse (or different; SNAIV - VI Unicorn(s) definitely beat out the first four levels of Cures Cleric gets) curative abilities, but as warriors they shine).

Really, whenever I'm playing a small game and the party is like "Rogue + Warmage" and we're expected to deal with normal challenges, I'm just playing a Druid since that's by far the easiest way I can be:
Beatshield
Controller
Divine Caster
Wilderness Skill Monkey

all at once. Cleric or Wizard trying the same before the teens needs much more material while Druid really does it all straight out of Core from level 1.

[FMArthur]

Healing is an easy fallback for Clerics, not their primary asset. They get so many offensive and supportive options with just their main spell list that they could probably stand up to the druid reasonably well with those alone. A huge variety of domains and a positively enormous amount of support Clerics get from splatbook feats basically means that, beyond just casting a combination of the most powerful buffs, support spells, and some really huge battlefield control effects, they can also be built to be awesome at just about anything. Including just becoming a Druid completely. In core it's probably the Druid, since they get lots of nice things the Cleric doesn't. Outside of core, the Druid's abilities are a mere subset of the Cleric's.

[Dr.Epic]

-Is stronger in a 1 on 1 fight

Cleric only if they get to wear heavy armor.

-Is stronger in a 1 on 1 fight against monsters

Against undead, cleric might have the edge, but any other druid.

-Is more useful in a party

If they're the healer, than cleric unless the druid can keep up which isn't that difficult. But druids get more class features and with an animal companion are effectively two PCs.

[molten_dragon]

It depends on what level you're playing at and what level of optimization you're talking about, but for the most part, the druid is the answer to all three questions.

In a one on one fight, the druid will most likely win due to abuse of the action economy.

Ditto for a fight vs. monsters.

Party utility is about even. A cleric provides better party support than the druid, but the druid can fill a lot more roles than the cleric can.

[Endarire]

A optimized Cleric is expected to focus on casting as well as at least one of these:

-Melee
-Archery
-Necromancy
-Skills

I learned this the hard way when I tried making a Cleric who tried to be a Wizard and forsook everything else. It failed. Hard.

[Eldariel]

I learned this the hard way when I tried making a Cleric who tried to be a Wizard and forsook everything else. It failed. Hard.

I'm betting you didn't try hard enough Caster Cleric is definitely perfectly viable though in Core, quite limited.

[WinWin]

Necromancer (negative energy) cleric has some major advantages in core that the druid can't match.

Once the character gets a few incorporeals (or the ability to make them), they can have some major presence in many combats. Create Undead is almost like leadership at higher levels, though it does require a great deal of investment and planning. Turning an enemy mook into a Vampire under your control and getting them to spawn a small army is a great return on minimal investment.