Wildshape Ranger Variant and Druid Shapeshift ACF in PHB II

[Brom]

Original question edited out because it was answered.

I'm not sure if this is allowed: by RAW, can you use the Druid Shapeshift ACF to swap out Ranger Animal Companion and Ranger Wildshape gained through Ranger Wildshape Variant to do animal shapeshifting, as laid out in PHB II for Druids?

And if it's not allowable by RAW (I'm fairly certain it isn't) would you, as a DM, allow a player to do that?

IMO? It *fits* a cool and unique little concept. Martial shapeshifter in the woods defending nature in the form of a panther or a wolf. Classy.

[The-Mage-King]

SRD/ Unearthed Arcana.

[Eldariel]

It's on the SRD. So from Unearthed Arcana.

[The-Mage-King]

You've been Swordsage'd!

[Devmaar]

I'm not sure if this is allowed: by RAW, can you use the Druid Shapeshift ACF to swap out Ranger Animal Companion and Ranger Wildshape gained through Ranger Wildshape Variant to do animal shapeshifting, as laid out in PHB II for Druids?

And if it's not allowable by RAW (I'm fairly certain it isn't) would you, as a DM, allow a player to do that?

IMO? It *fits* a cool and unique little concept. Martial shapeshifter in the woods defending nature in the form of a panther or a wolf. Classy.

By RAW, I think not. Would I allow a player to swap one of the game's most powerful abilities for a more balanced, equally flavourful version? Certainly.

[Greenish]

I'm not sure if this is allowed: by RAW, can you use the Druid Shapeshift ACF to swap out Ranger Animal Companion and Ranger Wildshape gained through Ranger Wildshape Variant to do animal shapeshifting, as laid out in PHB II for Druids?

There are people who feel that you can take Alternative Class Features even if it's not for your class, but I very much doubt they're correct.

And if it's not allowable by RAW (I'm fairly certain it isn't) would you, as a DM, allow a player to do that?

It has the same flavour, but is much weaker. I don't see how it would be a problem.

[Brom]

People CALL it weaker, but in execution I find the infinite uses has served players very well.

Wild Shape, you have to commit to. And you need to rifle through books to find an appropriate shape.

Shapeshift, you can do whenever you deem it remotely fitting XD

Then again, I'm not remotely an expert on playing Druids. It's the one class that just confounds me.

Hmm. I wonder how you'd take feats if you combined variants that way...

[Eldariel]

People CALL it weaker, but in execution I find the infinite uses has served players very well.

It has benefits but it is weaker. The principal thing about Wildshape is:
1) With Natural Spell, you can cast while Wildshaped. This is just obviously huge; you get to be a warrior and a caster at the same time. Even with a Ranger, the spells are rather important for them to be efficient (of course, requires access to books with worthwhile Ranger-spells like Spell Compendium).
2) You don't need physicals at all to be an excellent warrior. You get your entire Dex and Str from just Wildshape.
3) The bonuses alter your base values, rather than being enhancement. This means they stack with any magical bonuses to Natural Armor, Strength and Dexterity breaking most of the usual softcaps of armor & al. built into the game.
4) Wildshape can actually grant you very key combat abilities like Pounce and Improved Grab. Shapeshift? Well, can't.
5) Wildshape-forms offer faster movement speeds (if desired), burrow/swim-speed (if desired) and more reach (you can get 15' reach in Huge forms like e.g. Tendriculous or Sanguaro Sentinel).


Basically, Wildshape just does everything better. The advantages of Shapeshift are that you can use it from level 1 (but it's fairly mediocre unless you have insanely good stats then) and that it only takes a swift action (Wildshape takes a Standard Action, though since it lasts long enough for you to remain in the animal form almost all day from level 7 onwards and 12 hours even on level 6, that's not such a major issue) and it has infinite uses (but again, the hour/level duration and quick accumulation of the uses for Wildshape makes up for that).

In short, Shapeshift is better levels 1-4 and can be better on level 5 if you have a generous stat array. After that, Wildshape more or less takes over. Except Shapeshift also gives up your animal companion which just happens to shine the levels 1-6; level 1 actually having higher HP than the party warriors and again on level 3.