Giving equipment to golems

[thorgrim29]

I'll be playing an artificer in an upcoming PBP game, and in true mad scientist fashion I'll be making golems. So my question is, do golems have weapon and armor proficiencies? Because I would totally give my flesh golem a full plate and a great-axe (later to be upgraded to lifedrinker) if they do.

Side question, does the level restriction reduction the artificer gets apply to golem creation?

[Halae]

Proficiencies: no, I don't believe so. in fact, I think somewhere it said that golems will still attack with their fists if ordered to use a weapon - not sure on that part though. However, the spell awaken golem can solve this problem and more for you

Level restriction reduction: yup. meaning, if you use your money to get yourself an Iron golem manual (which also decreases your level requirement) you can build your own iron golem at level 10

[AslanCross]

Unfortunately not on the proficiencies.

Crafting a construct counts as an Item Creation feat, so I'd say the Artificer's +2 bonus applies. Those are pretty steep checks to make, though, as the spells required are in the 7th-level range or thereabouts. You can start trying as early as Artificer class level 6, though, as you meet the "must be an 8th-level caster" by then. It is clear that you can put the golem "on hold" until you complete all the spell emulation checks (as with any item creation endeavor the artificer attempts).

[thorgrim29]

I don't think the -2 applies to feats tough, it specifically says "for the purpose of meeting item prerequisites". About the rest well.... I guess I'll just have to make a deal with the DM or work around it.

If the golem's hand is a weapon (say, a lifedrinking adamentine goliath greathammer instead of one hand), it can probably use it right? And at worst I'll give it a mythral shirt for armor, it just won't be as cool but what can you do?

[AslanCross]

I don't think the -2 applies to feats tough, it specifically says "for the purpose of meeting item prerequisites".

Which you need the Item Creation feats for. The Item Creation section in the Artificer's class description covers all the magical crafting it does. You need Craft Construct (an Item Creation feat) to create a construct. Thus, the -2 applies to it.

If the golem's hand is a weapon (say, a lifedrinking adamentine goliath greathammer instead of one hand), it can probably use it right? And at worst I'll give it a mythral shirt for armor, it just won't be as cool but what can you do?

It's much easier for the DM to houserule that. In my case, I once had an iron golem that had incredibly huge claws instead of fists, so its natural weapons did slashing damage instead of bludgeoning. You could ask your DM if you could deal the same damage with its fists, or maybe lose one of the fists so that you only have one large, natural weapon that can be enchanted.

[Jack_Simth]

I'll be playing an artificer in an upcoming PBP game, and in true mad scientist fashion I'll be making golems. So my question is, do golems have weapon and armor proficiencies? Because I would totally give my flesh golem a full plate and a great-axe (later to be upgraded to lifedrinker) if they do.

No and No, although you might ask your DM if you can deliberately use the Intelligent Item Creation Rules on your constructs - a minimally intelligence adds 2,000 gp to the market price (1,000 to be intelligent, 1,000 for the cheapest lesser power), but is very, very useful for Golems: They have a lot of hit dice, which means they get a few feats now that they're no longer Mindless! The cheapest Core golem (Flesh) has nine hit dice - netting it four feats (1st, 3rd, 6th, 9th). Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Armor Proficiency (Heavy), and Weapon Proficiency (Greatsword) can do wonderous things on a melee brute that was never intended to use actual weapons. Oh yes, and get it a Hat of Disguise, while you're at it.

Oh, and lest I forget, he also gets 24 or 36 skill points, although he has no class skills to spend them on.

[thorgrim29]

That's a good idea... I could give it maybe 6 int, it's special purpose would be to obey my orders, that could work.

[Kansaschaser]

If your DM does not allow you to create intelligent items, then you could just cast the 2nd level spell called Heroics. It's from the Spell Compendium. It lasts for 10 minutes/level and it gives the recipient a feat from the fighter bonus feat list.

You can get really creative with the feats you can give your golem. You can even give your golem Maneuvers from the Tome of Battle. Fun times!

You don't really need armor proficiency, since anyone can wear any armor. You just get more penalties from the armor if you are not proficient. Who cares if the golem gets a penalty to skill checks.

Just remember to order the golem to lower it's spell resistance and to accept the next spell cast in order for it to gain the benefits of the spell. While you are at it, look through the spell list and find other spells you can use to buff your golem at the beginning of the day.

[JBento]

Golems CAN'T lower their spell resistance because, well, they don't have any. They're immune to spells which allow SR, which means that, for ease of use/explaining, we treat them as having infinite SR - but that's not actually what they have.

And golems DO care about proficiency, since armour's penalty also applies to attack rolls. So yeah.

On the subject of golem intelligence: depending on your DM, that may or may not remove the "immune to mind-affecting clause," since it's no longer non-intelligent (I can't recall ever seeing that written down, but vermin work like that). And considering the sort of saves the things sport, a mind-affecting, no SR effect (hello archmage) could be reaaaaal bad.

[Kansaschaser]

Golems CAN'T lower their spell resistance because, well, they don't have any. They're immune to spells which allow SR, which means that, for ease of use/explaining, we treat them as having infinite SR - but that's not actually what they have.

In the FAQ for D&D 3.5, it was asked if you could cast spells for your pet golem. The official response is they have unbeatable spell resistance, but that you could order them to lower their spell resistance in order to receive beneficial spells.

[Dr.Epic]

One of the golems in MM I (I think clay or stone) has a sword in both the illustration and it says in the text sometimes they carry one. Beyond that I'm not sure. I can't imagine any golem (except flesh and maybe a few others) being able to wear armor.

[Kansaschaser]

One of the golems in MM I (I think clay or stone) has a sword in both the illustration and it says in the text sometimes they carry one. Beyond that I'm not sure. I can't imagine any golem (except flesh and maybe a few others) being able to wear armor.

If your DM says that your golem will not use armor or weapons, you can still outfit your golem with magic items.

Here are my favorite picks.
Necklace = Amulet of Mighty Fists +5
Bracer = Bracers of Armor +8
Ring = Ring of Protection +5
Ring = Ring of Regeneration
Torso = Vest of Resistance +5
Shoulders = Phoenix Cloak
Head = Horned Helm
Hands = Gloves of Dexterity +6
Face = Blindfold of True Darkness
Waist = Belt of Giant Strength +6
Feet = Boots of Striding and Springing

[Tengu_temp]

And golems DO care about proficiency, since armour's penalty also applies to attack rolls. So yeah.

Mithral chainshirt. What armor penalty? It'd have to be custom-made though.

[JBento]

The FAQ? You mean the "Skip smokes crack" feature that contradicts the rules as often as not? That doesn't actally trump the rules (unless, ofc, your DM says so).

"Face" is not a magic item location. Choose between the helm or the blindfold.

Ring of Regenration does nothing - a golem isn't a living creature, as required by the item. But RoR sucks anyhow, so it's not like that's a loss.

[Dr.Epic]

If your DM says that your golem will not use armor or weapons, you can still outfit your golem with magic items.

Here are my favorite picks.
Necklace = Amulet of Mighty Fists +5
Bracer = Bracers of Armor +8
Ring = Ring of Protection +5
Ring = Ring of Regeneration
Torso = Vest of Resistance +5
Shoulders = Phoenix Cloak
Head = Horned Helm
Hands = Gloves of Dexterity +6
Face = Blindfold of True Darkness
Waist = Belt of Giant Strength +6
Feet = Boots of Striding and Springing

Can regeneration work on those substances? I guess it would but from a real world perspective it's kind of hard imagining a chunk of stone or clay (even one magically imbued with artificial life) being able to regenerate like that.

[JBento]

Also, I'm starting to think that this is getting VERY expensive - though being an Artificer can certainly cut down costs (especially with the right feats and the Thought Bottle craft-happiness), this is going to hurt.

However, an item that enables flying is conspicuously missing from that list, and it's going to be an absolute must, seeing as you can't cast Fly on it (well, you can, it just won't work).

[Kansaschaser]

Also, I'm starting to think that this is getting VERY expensive - though being an Artificer can certainly cut down costs (especially with the right feats and the Thought Bottle craft-happiness), this is going to hurt.

However, an item that enables flying is conspicuously missing from that list, and it's going to be an absolute must, seeing as you can't cast Fly on it (well, you can, it just won't work).

Sorry, I just threw together that magic item list in haste. The Ring of Regeneration won't work on a golem.

Lowering spell resistance is a standard action. For all intents and purposes a golem has unbeatable spell resistance. So when a spell lists "Spell Resistance: Yes", you have to roll to overcome spell resistance. You can order the golem to lower it's spell resistance.

From the SRD:A creature can voluntarily lower its spell resistance. Doing so is a standard action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity. Once a creature lowers its resistance, it remains down until the creature’s next turn. At the beginning of the creature’s next turn, the creature’s spell resistance automatically returns unless the creature intentionally keeps it down (also a standard action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity).

And, I did include an item that allows for flight. The Phoenix Cloak gives the wearer flight with perfect maneuverability.

[JBento]

Sorry about the Cloak - only have acces to the srd atm. My bad.

You keep going to the FAQ for "golems have spell resistance." Though DMs may rule that way, the FAQ in this point (and in others) contradicts the rules, and it doesn't really count as RAW. By RAW, a golem doesn't have SR (it has Magic Immunity, which doesn't say it has infinite SR, merely that it's immune to spells that allow it), and it can't get rid of it.

[Kansaschaser]

You keep going to the FAQ for "golems have spell resistance." Though DMs may rule that way, the FAQ in this point (and in others) contradicts the rules, and it doesn't really count as RAW. By RAW, a golem doesn't have SR (it has Magic Immunity, which doesn't say it has infinite SR, merely that it's immune to spells that allow it), and it can't get rid of it.

Ok, I guess you could have a DM rule that the Golem cannot voluntarily lower it's spell resistance. There are still a few things you can do to get around that.

1) Bracelet of Spell Sharing. It's from the Dungeon Master's Guid 2. It allows two different individuals to benefit from "Personal" range spells. Most personal range spells do not have spell resistance. This is one way of "buffing" your golem.

2) Don't create a golem. Create an Effigy (Complete Arcane). They do not have "Magic Immunity" or spell resistance. You can buff them as much as you want. Oh, and they are a lot cheaper to create than standard golems. So if it dies, you are not out a ton of experience and gold.

3) Look for spells that do not allow spell resistance. There are not many out there, but there are some.

4) Create magic items the golem can wear that duplicates a buffing spell. Again, use your imagination.

"Face" is not a magic item location. Choose between the helm or the blindfold.

The Face slot and the Head slot are two different locations on the body. You can indeed wear a Headband of "Something" with a Goggles of "Something" at the same time.

Magic Item Slots
Face - Goggles, lenses, masks, spectacles, etc...
Throat
Body
Hands
Waist
Feet
Head - Circlets, crowns, hats, headbands, helmets, etc...
Shoulders
Torso
Arms
Ring
Ring

[Coidzor]

It is clear that you can put the golem "on hold" until you complete all the spell emulation checks (as with any item creation endeavor the artificer attempts).

Wait, could you clarify that?

[AslanCross]

Wait, could you clarify that?

Sorry, I apparently misread the entry in the ECS. It says that if you fail the check, you can keep trying again each day until the crafting time ends.

In the FAQ for D&D 3.5, it was asked if you could cast spells for your pet golem. The official response is they have unbeatable spell resistance, but that you could order them to lower their spell resistance in order to receive beneficial spells.

That's really odd, because I remember them also saying that golems cannot lower magic immunity.

[Curious]

A question; since golems are technically just animated objects, would it be possible to use enhancements on them? So you would, for example, have an iron golem using a +5 Two-hand sword and with a +5 modifier on its AC.

[AslanCross]

Except they're not, as they are creatures. Once they were created, they received the Construct creature type.