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    Dwarf in the Playground
     
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    Default Concealment and high hide skill = free invisibility?

    Hey guys, i was just wondering about the whole concealment thing and hideing.

    F.x. a shadowcraft mage who uses cloak of shadows class ability to get concealment, could he move "invisible" across a open plain area if his hide check was good enough?

    E.g. could hide effectivly be an free invisible spell in all regards as long as you beat the other guys spot and listen checks?

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    Titan in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Concealment and high hide skill = free invisibility?

    Yes, if you hide successfully, the enemies can't see you, and if you're invisible, the enemies can't see you.

    Slap on HiPS and live happily ever after.
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    Dwarf in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Concealment and high hide skill = free invisibility?

    Quote Originally Posted by Greenish View Post
    Yes, if you hide successfully, the enemies can't see you, and if you're invisible, the enemies can't see you.

    Slap on HiPS and live happily ever after.
    Ok, so if I walked behind a big rock and activated cloak of shadows then i could walk invisible around in plain sight and all, even if i'm not hiding behind anything?

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    Titan in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Concealment and high hide skill = free invisibility?

    Quote Originally Posted by bot View Post
    Ok, so if I walked behind a big rock and activated cloak of shadows then i could walk invisible around in plain sight and all, even if i'm not hiding behind anything?
    Yes. Hiding only has two conditions (cover/concealment and not being observed), so as long as you can fulfil both, you can attempt to hide.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Claudius Maximus View Post
    Also fixed the money issue by sacrificing a goat.
    Quote Originally Posted by subject42 View Post
    This board needs a "you're technically right but I still want to crawl into the fetal position and cry" emoticon.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yukitsu View Post
    I define [optimization] as "the process by which one attains a build meeting all mechanical and characterization goals set out by the creator prior to its creation."
    Praise for avatar may be directed to Derjuin.

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    Dwarf in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Concealment and high hide skill = free invisibility?

    Quote Originally Posted by Greenish View Post
    Yes. Hiding only has two conditions (cover/concealment and not being observed), so as long as you can fulfil both, you can attempt to hide.
    Yes ok - thanks for the quick reply!

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Hyfigh's Avatar

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    Default Re: Concealment and high hide skill = free invisibility?

    Quote Originally Posted by Greenish View Post
    Yes. Hiding only has two conditions (cover/concealment and not being observed), so as long as you can fulfil both, you can attempt to hide.
    ... And HiPS eliminates the need of not being observed. If your hide skill is high enough to make the checks you can even attack and remain hidden.
    Quote Originally Posted by Xefas View Post
    Though, this is obviously a world in which Speak with Dead trivializes most murder investigations. It's not "Well, after spending an exhaustive amount of time searching the crime scene for evidence, I seem to have found some bat guano and- yadda yadda" it's "Steve did it. Go scry Steve"

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    BlueKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Concealment and high hide skill = free invisibility?

    Added benefit: using Hide means the enemies can't use See Invisibility or True Seeing to see you; they still have to make a spot check equal to your Hide result.
    Iron Chef Award!

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    Titan in the Playground
     
    Greenish's Avatar

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    Default Re: Concealment and high hide skill = free invisibility?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hyfigh View Post
    ... And HiPS eliminates the need of not being observed.
    Better versions also take care of the need for concealment.
    Quotes:
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    Quote Originally Posted by Claudius Maximus View Post
    Also fixed the money issue by sacrificing a goat.
    Quote Originally Posted by subject42 View Post
    This board needs a "you're technically right but I still want to crawl into the fetal position and cry" emoticon.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yukitsu View Post
    I define [optimization] as "the process by which one attains a build meeting all mechanical and characterization goals set out by the creator prior to its creation."
    Praise for avatar may be directed to Derjuin.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Titan in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    May 2006
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    Sunnydale

    Default Re: Concealment and high hide skill = free invisibility?

    Quote Originally Posted by bot View Post
    Ok, so if I walked behind a big rock and activated cloak of shadows then i could walk invisible around in plain sight and all, even if i'm not hiding behind anything?
    Close. You'd still need to make Hide checks, with a penalty for the distance you move. Cloak of Shadow provides concealment, which satisfies one of the two requirements to be able to make Hide checks. The other requirement is not being observed. As soon as you came out from behind the rock and opponents had line of sight to Spot you you'd be using the Move between Cover Hide option (see Complete Adventurer, pages 101-102). Basically it's a -1 penalty for each 1' of open space you move through.

    You only stay visually undetected as long as your Hide check beats opposed Spot checks, so there's no guarantee.

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