Support the GITP forums on Patreon
Help support GITP's forums (and ongoing server maintenance) via Patreon
Results 1 to 14 of 14
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Yora's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Germany

    Default E6 Leadership variant

    In an E6 game, hordes of 1st level followers suddenly become an interesting addition to the game. They don't help at all in defeating any major opponents, but you can actually use them to defend your own stronghold against hostile armies, use them to police as recently liberated town, and many more such things. In a normal D&D game 1st level followers would be slaughtered by about anything the PCs come across, but when your opponent also makes use of 1st and 2nd level npcs, they actually can make a difference.

    At 6th level, characters meet the requirements for Leadership, but since you're stuck at 6th level and there are far fewer ways to boost your Charisma, your Leadership score will stay very low, making it hard to gain even the smallest number of 1st level followers. At the same time, cohorts top out at 4th level when recruited, which you already get at a Leadership score of 6. So if you have Leadership, there are very few cases where you can reqruit a cohort of a level different than 4th.

    So here is what I did: I took the regular leadership table from the SRD but modified as if the character who has the Leadership feat has a +3 bonus to his Leadership score when it comes to followers, but a -3 penalty in regards to cohorts. I also decided to cap followers at 4th level, but maybe 3rd would even be better.
    Which gets you a table that looks like this:

    {table=head]Leadership Score | Cohort | 1st | 2nd | 3rd | 4th
    4 or lower | - | - | - | - | -
    5 | 1st | - | - | - | -
    6 | 2nd | - | - | - | -
    7 | 3rd | 5 | - | - | -
    8 | 3rd | 6 | - | - | -
    9 | 4th | 8 | - | - | -
    10 | 4th | 10 | 1 | - | -
    11 | 4th | 15 | 1 | - | -
    12 | 4th | 20 | 2 | 1 | -
    13 | 4th | 25 | 2 | 1 | -
    14 | 4th | 30 | 3 | 1 | 1
    15 | 4th | 35 | 3 | 1 | 1
    16 | 4th | 40 | 4 | 2 | 1
    17 | 4th | 50 | 5 | 3 | 2
    18 | 4th | 60 | 6 | 3 | 2
    19 | 4th | 75 | 7 | 4 | 2
    20 | 4th | 90 | 9 | 5 | 3
    21 | 4th | 110 | 11 | 6 | 3
    22 or higher | 4th | 135 | 13 | 7 | 4[/table]

    What do you think of this?
    Last edited by Yora; 2011-07-02 at 04:12 AM.
    We are not standing on the shoulders of giants, but on very tall tower of other dwarves.

    Beneath the Leaves of Kaendor - Writing Sword & Sorcery
    Spriggan's Den Heroic Fantasy Roleplaying

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ettin in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    Leadership score is level plus charisma mod, correct? How is a character meant to reach the scores that would allow for 4th level followers in the first place?
    "It's the fate of all things under the sky,
    to grow old and wither and die."

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    unosarta's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Minneapolis
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    Leadership score is level plus charisma mod, correct? How is a character meant to reach the scores that would allow for 4th level followers in the first place?
    You wouldn't. Which is also why the cohort level gets up to fourth level really fast, and stays there for a long time.
    Current Project: Campaign Setting

    My deviantArt.

    Extra fabulous avatar by Serpentine.

    My Homebrew

    Spoiler
    Show
    Spoiler
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Lix Lorn View Post
    NOTHING is simple. NO EXCEPTIONS. No, not even that.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Yora's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Germany

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    Leadership score is Character level plus charisma, which you can easily get to 9, if you're a Cha-caster.

    Then there are also several misc modifiers to your Leadership score:
    If you are famous and have great reknown, you gain a +2 bonus.
    If you have established a reputation to be fair and generous to your followers, you get another +1.
    There's also a +1 for "Special Power", but no explaination what that means. I assume being Guild Leader or head priest of a temple, or something like that.
    Since it's possible that a character can have all three of these factors, it can lead to a Leadership score of 13.

    Your Leadership score regarding followers also rises by +2 if you maintain a stronghold where your followers can stay, resulting in a total of 15.

    I think it's unlikely to ever get a Leadership score much higher than this, but I just converted the entire table as it is. And that's well enough to gain a single 4th level follower. Since it double's the number of possible spellcasting followers with access to 2nd level spells, it would make quite a difference. Though I don't really think two more 2nd level spells per day have the potential to break the game much.

    Cohort level is capped at 4th, since you can never recruit a cohort of a lever higher than your own level -2. Though cohorts do gain levels and will eventually reach 6th level as well.
    Last edited by Yora; 2011-02-15 at 10:27 AM.
    We are not standing on the shoulders of giants, but on very tall tower of other dwarves.

    Beneath the Leaves of Kaendor - Writing Sword & Sorcery
    Spriggan's Den Heroic Fantasy Roleplaying

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Ettin in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    In the light of the circumstance modifiers, I'd actually suggest delaying 4th level cohort to score of 10 or 11, so that even a Cha-based caster has to work a bit to get it. Otherwise, it looks quite fine.
    "It's the fate of all things under the sky,
    to grow old and wither and die."

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Eurus's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Illinois
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    In the light of the circumstance modifiers, I'd actually suggest delaying 4th level cohort to score of 10 or 11, so that even a Cha-based caster has to work a bit to get it. Otherwise, it looks quite fine.
    I think it's fine as-is, so that non-casters (who can't afford to focus exclusively on charisma) can still get it if they try.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    I like what you've done here.
    I'd be worried about the SS (Sorcerer Squad), but leadership being strongly tied to DM jurisdiction, I guess it's allright.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Mulletmanalive's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    WOTC ≱ my opinion

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    Worth noting that once you hit 6th level, feats become easily available, so the Leader feats from Heroes of Battle can boost that Leadership score by another +4, double your Followers and give you another Cohort...

    Which is made of spiffiness as far as i'm concerned...
    Mine is not so much a Peter Pan Complex as a Peter Pan Doom Fortress and Underground LairTM!
    Fae-o-matic Want a fae from folklore stated? Give me the lore and I'll do it for you!
    Le Cirque Funeste Evil Fairy Circus! Ray Bradbury, refined down to snortable powder!

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Yora's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Germany

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    I just noticed that cohorts can only rise to a level one level below the character he is associated with. Since the PCs never go beyond 6th level if you read it literary, cohorts would level to 5th level and stay there forever while the PCs continue to advance. He can't get any bonus feats either, because he already has to be 6th level to do so.

    This brings two solutions to my mind:
    1. Cohorts reach 5th level and stay there forever. (At least unless they become a regular PC or NPC.) The gap to the PCs will steadily increase, but since most stats of the PCs stay fixed and the same goes for enemies and to a lesser extend monsters the PCs will fight, the cohort will always be able to contribute and survice. Only contribute less.
    2. The cohort reaches 6th level when he has enough XP and always laggs behind the PCs by the same amount of XP and therefore bonus feats. But I guess that would result in only three or four feats less and get the cohort to a power level that doesn't appear to be any different to the PCs.

    Personally, I think the first option is perfectly okay. But then, I really care much more for the followers and wouldn't use the cohort as a regular party member, but rather keep him in charge of the camp or stronghold, or send him off with some of the troops as my trusted lieutenant. Thoughts?
    We are not standing on the shoulders of giants, but on very tall tower of other dwarves.

    Beneath the Leaves of Kaendor - Writing Sword & Sorcery
    Spriggan's Den Heroic Fantasy Roleplaying

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    The midwest.

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    Quote Originally Posted by Mulletmanalive View Post
    Worth noting that once you hit 6th level, feats become easily available, so the Leader feats from Heroes of Battle can boost that Leadership score by another +4, double your Followers and give you another Cohort...

    Which is made of spiffiness as far as i'm concerned...
    Heh. Kinda like how followers work in previous editions. In 2e, when you reach a certain level (usually 9th) you start attracting followers. You basically become a lord (as in the kind who owns property and is involved in the government) whether you want to or not.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Yora's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Germany

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    That was actually my reason to consider adding Leadership to an E6 game. It would not have to mean that you become a local lord and get free staff for your keep. Instead you could also create a mercenary company, become head of the local militia, put in charge of a small temple, be elected as spokesperson for the local rangers, or whatever you want to come up with.
    But since you don't need a feat to gain these things in-game, I consider followers as subordinates or allies that will stay with you no matter what. Even when the keep burns down or you can't pay wages any longer, these are the people that will stay with you anyway and support you in building a new organization. Or if you leave a larger organization as a mid-level commander, they will also quit or desert with you, since they feel more loyal to you than to the main organization.
    We are not standing on the shoulders of giants, but on very tall tower of other dwarves.

    Beneath the Leaves of Kaendor - Writing Sword & Sorcery
    Spriggan's Den Heroic Fantasy Roleplaying

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DwarfClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jul 2007

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    Maybe you could make so you can take leadership multaple times. Every time after the first you get +1 or 2 to your leadership score.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Yora's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Germany

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    I was thinking of creating an "Improved Leadership" feat that gives a +3 bonus, but apparently such a feat already exists in Heroes of Battle, and with the altered table I made, I don't think it's really neccessary. Build up a bit of a reputation and it's not that hard to get a score of 10.
    Instead of investing more feats, I'm more for aquiring the benefits of Leadership through in-game means. So maybe comming up with a couple more factors that can raise your score.
    We are not standing on the shoulders of giants, but on very tall tower of other dwarves.

    Beneath the Leaves of Kaendor - Writing Sword & Sorcery
    Spriggan's Den Heroic Fantasy Roleplaying

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Cieyrin's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: E6 Leadership variant

    If you're willing to delve in Dragon material, Dragon #346 has an article called Supporting Cast that has additional leadership feats. They're not Leader feats like Heroes of Battle but all but one provide a bonus to your Leadership score. The one, Close Cohort, overlaps with Improved Cohort, anyways, you may want to disregard it, unless you want a two feat tax on the PC's side to allow cohorts to get to 6th and advance like any other PC, which may be neat in the right E6 campaign.
    Goblin Cannon Crew avatar by Vrythas.
    Spoiler
    Show

    Gnome Gun Mage avatar by NEO|Phyte
    Quote Originally Posted by Mulletmanalive View Post
    Damn you Cieyrin! Cieyrin!!!!!read as Khaaaaan!

    My badges! :D
    My Homebrew
    The Gunslinger's Handbook
    Archetype Combo List!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •