Melee Bard assistance

[CycloneJoker]

Okay, I have a sneaking suspicion that I'll be needing a new character shortly, so I wanted to try making a melee bard. The only issue is that I have no idea how to go about doing this. All I know is that I'll be wanting Snowflake Wardance, as I'd be a falling rock magnet with Dragonfire. My group uses Pathfinder rules for races, but 3.5 rules for everything else. So, how should I go about doing this? I'll be starting somewhere between 4 and 6, and I'll also be needing to cover some skillmonkey areas. What I had been thinking was something like this:

Strongheart Halfling Bard
32 point buy
STR:6 DEX:16 CON:14: INT:14 WIS:8 CHA:20

1 Bardic Knack ACF, Jack of All Trades, Force of Personality
3 Snowflake Wardance
6 Weapon Finesse

Skills: Bluff, Tumble, Perform, Slight of Hand, Hide, Move Silently, Escape Artist, and Balance

And after that, I have no idea, and I'm iffy about skills. My intended focus was to stab people and buff. I need a way to overcome my terrible STR. Any assistance would be appreciated.

[Eiko]

Try the bardblade.

Step one, take a bard level.
Step two, go warblade and take song of the white raven
Step three, ??????????????
Step four, PROFIT

If you're allowed ToB that is

[CycloneJoker]

Try the bardblade.

Step one, take a bard level.
Step two, go warblade and take song of the white raven
Step three, ??????????????
Step four, PROFIT

If you're allowed ToB that is

I'm wanting to focus on Wardance, not Inspire Courage, and it doesn't give me more Inspire Courage.

Also, my DM isn't going ToB.

[mabriss lethe]

Go ahead and go human instead of strongheart halfling. Being medium size means bigger damage dice for weapons.

Well, aside from that, I would say don't focus on wardance, stack with
wardance.

It's not hard to give inspire courage a boost, and only adds more mojo to your swing, so look into any of the bard handbooks and go to town.

The Improvisation spell (spell compendium,bard only, lvl 1.) is utter gold and just keeps getting better as you go.

Knowledge devotion is your friend: You have every knowledge skill as a class skill and a good allotment of skill points. Use it to get extra +s to hit and damage on everything. available from 3rd level on.

Crystal Echoblades are also nice. (add a wand chamber and a wand of Critical strike and you can pseudo rogue)

Two weapon fighting goes well with a combat bard, since you've got multiple sources feeding you extra bonuses to hit and damage.

[CycloneJoker]

Go ahead and go human instead of strongheart halfling. Being medium size means bigger damage dice for weapons.

Well, aside from that, I would say don't focus on wardance, stack with
wardance.

It's not hard to give inspire courage a boost, and only adds more mojo to your swing, so look into any of the bard handbooks and go to town.

The Improvisation spell (spell compendium,bard only, lvl 1.) is utter gold and just keeps getting better as you go.

Knowledge devotion is your friend: You have every knowledge skill as a class skill and a good allotment of skill points. Use it to get extra +s to hit and damage on everything. available from 3rd level on.

Crystal Echoblades are also nice. (add a wand chamber and a wand of Critical strike and you can pseudo rogue)

Two weapon fighting goes well with a combat bard, since you've got multiple sources feeding you extra bonuses to hit and damage.

The bonus to both Cha and Dex seemed too good to pass up, though.

How can I add to it? I'm not seeing much.

Improvisation looks sweet.

Knowledge Devotion would work pretty well with Knack.

What's a Crystal Echoblade?

Hmm, I'll look into TWF.

[mabriss lethe]

Crystal Echoblade is in Magic Item Compendium. $4k and change. A +1 Longsword, It adds half your bard level as sonic damage to your attack when you're using bardic music.

As for the stacking, I suppose I should have been more precise. Wardance grants a nice bonus, but the character really comes into its own when you start stacking multiple sources of bonus damage, like Inspire courage, Improvisation, Knowledge devotion, etc. Combat bards work best when they start piling on huge amounts of decent bonuses from multiple sources.

[dextercorvia]

Slippers of Battledancing are expensive, but a nice touch.

Edit: Even if you aren't going Dragonfire, don't neglect your IC. Just Inspirational Boost and a Badge of Valor will make it worth the action.

[Joshinthemosh]

It requires five ranks in Perform Dance but Slippers of Battledancing DMGII pg. 272. And also below. Enjoy Cha to hit and damage one light and one handed weapons. Two Weapon Fight to your heart's content.

Edit: Swordsaged by an edit. Blast it

Spoiler

Show

SLIPPERS OF BATTLEDANCING
These slippers imbue the wearer with a shocking grace
and a deadly fl uidity in battle.
Description: These soft, open-toed slippers are made
of supple leather and look very comfortable.
Activation: This item is continuously active while
worn, provided that the wearer’s armor is no heavier than
light. No action on the wearer’s part is required to gain
the effect.
Effect: While these slippers are on the wearer’s feet,
he moves with unnatural grace and alacrity, gaining
an enhancement bonus of +10 feet to his land speed.
The slippers also grant him a +5 competence bonus on
Tumble checks.
A wearer who has at least 5 ranks in Perform (dance)
accesses the true benefi t of the slippers of battledancing. As
long as he uses his base land speed to move (a fly, swim,
burrowing, or climb speed), he gains a +2 insight bonus
on initiative checks. If he moves at least 10 feet as part of
a move action, he can use his Charisma modifi er instead
of his Strength or Dexterity modifi er for attack rolls and
damage rolls with one-handed or light weapons (both
melee and ranged).
Aura/Caster Level: Moderate transmutation; CL 7th.
Construction: Craft Wondrous Item, 5 ranks in PerPerform
(dance), longstrider, cat’s grace, eagle’s splendor, 16,875
gp, 1,350 XP, 33 days.
Weight: 1 lb.
Price: 33,750 gp.

[CycloneJoker]

Ah, I get it. Since I'm going Knack/JoaT, and having to skillmonkey a bit, what would be the best Knowledge to get high? Also, how can you jump Inspire to really high?

I was actually planning to use them, along with an explosive weapon, and a repositioned Boots of Sidestepping, just for added mobility, but it's probably a bad idea.

[Kalaska'Agathas]

Crystal Echoblade is from the Magic Item Compendium, and gives you half your Bard level to damage. Another thing you might consider is going for a Spring Attacker (I know it's feat intensive, maybe your DM would be willing to roll Bounding Assault and Rapid Blitz into Spring Attack?) and wear a pair of Slippers of Battledancing, from the Dungeon Master's Guide II, which replaces Strength or Dex for attack and Strength for damage when you've moved 10 feet already that round. This would obviate the need for weapon finesse, also.

Also, Swordsaged.

Edit: to boost Inspire Courage, you're going to want the feats Words of Creation and Song of the Heart, a Badge of Valor, and various other things. Check out the Inspire Courage Handbook for more.

[mabriss lethe]

If you're going to use Knowledge devotion you'll need at least a point in..
Knowledge religion for undead
kn arcane for Magical beasts, dragons and constructs
kn local for humanoids
kn dungeoneering for aberrations and oozes
kn nature for animals, fey, giants, monstrous humanoids, plants, vermin
kn the planes for outsiders and elementals.

[gorfnab]

How about Bard 8/ Paladin of Freedom 2/ Sublime Chord 2/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Sacred Exorcist 3?

[Daftendirekt]

If you're going to do those Slippers of Battledancing, maybe work Scout into the build for some skirmish dice? Side note, is there any other class or PrC that gives skirmish? Apart from halfling monk sub. level...

[dextercorvia]

If you're going to do those Slippers of Battledancing, maybe work Scout into the build for some skirmish dice? Side note, is there any other class or PrC that gives skirmish? Apart from halfling monk sub. level...

Highland Stalker

[CycloneJoker]

I could go for 3 levels of Scout for the additional movement, +1 AC, and a Skirmish die. Any others? I'd rather not grab Track, as it's useless, really. Pally of Freedom sounds good, just for the extra sweet Cha usage. I'd like to advance Spellcasting, if at all possible.

[Daftendirekt]

'd like to advance Spellcasting, if at all possible.

If all else fails, maybe team up with your DM to homebrew a feat similar to the other Swift feats (ambusher, avenger, hunter) to have bard and scout levels stack for some of each others' class features?

[CycloneJoker]

So here's the build I'm looking at:
Strongheart Halfling (with Pathfinder Halfling as base)
Knack AFC
1: TWF, Jack of all Trades
3: Snowflake Wardance
6: Knowledge Devotion
9: Either Melodic Casting or Song of the Heart

With the stats above, and one Knowledge skill, the rest are undecided.

Equipment: Echoblade (4310), Stunning Surge light weapon (2000) or another decent weapon, Badge of Valor (1400), and a Masterwork Lute (100). 7810, I have 2190 GP left at level 5.

Any ideas? Does that look decent?

[dextercorvia]

Nitpick, I only put you at 1190 left at 5. I'd probably pick up an Eternal Wand of Shield, or a Wand of CLW (Lesser Vigor if you can make the UMD check)

[CycloneJoker]

Nitpick, I only put you at 1190 left at 5. I'd probably pick up an Eternal Wand of Shield, or a Wand of CLW (Lesser Vigor if you can make the UMD check)

Typo, sorry.

This is probably a REALLY stupid question, but what is an Eternal Wand

[dextercorvia]

One part Wand, one part Command Word Misc. Magic Item from the MIC. They cost slightly more than a standard wand of the same spell. Instead of getting 50 charges, they can be use 2/day. Only up to 3rd level spells, but you don't need the spell on your list. Any Arcane caster can use any Eternal Wand.

[CycloneJoker]

One part Wand, one part Command Word Misc. Magic Item from the MIC. They cost slightly more than a standard wand of the same spell. Instead of getting 50 charges, they can be use 2/day. Only up to 3rd level spells, but you don't need the spell on your list. Any Arcane caster can use any Eternal Wand.

Useful. So, as far as I can figure, I have +2 Inspire, and can have up to four. 1 for being a bard, and one for giving up the useless Competence for the sweet Song of the Heart, and an additional +1 from Badge of Valor, and +1 from that one spell.

[dextercorvia]

Useful. So, as far as I can figure, I have +2 Inspire, and can have up to four. 1 for being a bard, and one for giving up the useless Competence for the sweet Song of the Heart, and an additional +1 from Badge of Valor, and +1 from that one spell.

Song of the Heart requires Inspire Competence*. You can trade out your level 6 ability for it though. Later you will be able to afford the Vest of Legends which treats you as a Bard 5 levels higher for determining Bardic music abilities. That is especially useful if you plan to Prestige out of Bard into something that doesn't advance music.

*I know some of the early IC optimization lists trading it as an option, but I believe the consensus is that it isn't that kind of bonus feat.

[CycloneJoker]

Song of the Heart requires Inspire Competence*. You can trade out your level 6 ability for it though. Later you will be able to afford the Vest of Legends which treats you as a Bard 5 levels higher for determining Bardic music abilities. That is especially useful if you plan to Prestige out of Bard into something that doesn't advance music.

*I know some of the early IC optimization lists trading it as an option, but I believe the consensus is that it isn't that kind of bonus feat.

Oh, lame. Oh well, I can just give up Suggestion for it.

[Kalaska'Agathas]

Useful. So, as far as I can figure, I have +2 Inspire, and can have up to four. 1 for being a bard, and one for giving up the useless Competence for the sweet Song of the Heart, and an additional +1 from Badge of Valor, and +1 from that one spell.

Don't you need Inspire Competence to qualify for Song of the Heart?

Edit: Swordsaged.

Further Edit: You want Suggestion. It is awesome.

[CycloneJoker]

Don't you need Inspire Competence to qualify for Song of the Heart?

Edit: Swordsaged.

Further Edit: You want Suggestion. It is awesome.

But with a high Charisma, I can cast is quite a bit, and aren't more uses of "You guys don't suck" or "pretty stabby snowflake" more important?

[Zaq]

I'm wanting to focus on Wardance, not Inspire Courage, and it doesn't give me more Inspire Courage.

Also, my DM isn't going ToB.

Wardance, while great, isn't something you can "focus" on. You either have it or you don't. More CHA makes it better, but there's only so much you can do about that.

If you can spare the feats, Arcane Strike and/or Netherese Battle Curse (CWar and LEoF respectively) are great for melee bards.

[dextercorvia]

But with a high Charisma, I can cast is quite a bit, and aren't more uses of "You guys don't suck" or "pretty stabby snowflake" more important?

For your character, I would say definitely. It isn't more uses, however, it is more efficacious uses.

As a Sp ability, it has all of the drawbacks of the spell except the save DC scales with bard level. But that is only useful if you aren't PrC'ing into something else.

[CycloneJoker]

Wardance, while great, isn't something you can "focus" on. You either have it or you don't. More CHA makes it better, but there's only so much you can do about that.

If you can spare the feats, Arcane Strike and/or Netherese Battle Curse (CWar and LEoF respectively) are great for melee bards.

LEoF? Arcane Strike seems kinda "meh," as by the time I can afford it, I'll probably have better things to do with spells. Still, I ,might be able to find use for it. Thanks.

For your character, I would say definitely. It isn't more uses, however, it is more efficacious uses.

As a Sp ability, it has all of the drawbacks of the spell except the save DC scales with bard level. But that is only useful if you aren't PrC'ing into something else.

Nice, so I can get Knowledge Devotion and Song of the Heart at the same level. I'm probably going to PRC out at 14 at the absolute latest. What's a good PrC for melee bards?

[dextercorvia]

Abjurant Champion advances casting. Warchanter advances music. Both are Full BAB. Warchanter is really only worth it for two things:Combine Songs and Inspire Legion. Inspire Recklessness would be cool except that the bonus is a morale bonus so it doesn't stack with IC. I would go Abjurant Champion.

[Daftendirekt]

Heh, I had to think what LEoF was too. Lost Empires of Faerun. I really like that book, actually, particularly the Olin Gisir (nothing to do with your situation, just a neat class)