Ranged Ninja build.

[Master Thrower]

Hello playground, In my new party I have decided to play a ninja, my build looks something like Ninja 10 Exemplar 1 Ninja x. Im looking to use UMD, to its best use.
Feats- Point blank shot, Percise shot(sorry bad speller), Rapid shot, Zen archery, and skill focus (x). what should x be? and what skills should I be able to take ten in? (2 since I have a 12 int)

[Daftendirekt]

Well, I see ninjas throwing more than using bows, so your own namesake should be included in that build somewhere. All 5 levels, so you can get Weak Spot and make touch attacks FOREVER. If you're a halfling ninja, you might want to take a look at Whisperknife (races of the wild). It is pretty awesome.

[Zaq]

If you're using Exemplar to take ten on UMD, you should know that it's debatable whether Exemplar's "can always take ten" ability overrides UMD's specific "can't take ten, not even then" clause. I say that it doesn't work; ask your GM.

How are you getting UMD on a ninja, anyway?

[Master Thrower]

If you're using Exemplar to take ten on UMD, you should know that it's debatable whether Exemplar's "can always take ten" ability overrides UMD's specific "can't take ten, not even then" clause. I say that it doesn't work; ask your GM.

How are you getting UMD on a ninja, anyway?

DMG house ruled that UMD is on the ninja skill list. Also he was ok with the UMD take ten rule using exemplar. And would switching to throwing be worth it for the 5 levels of master thrower? it seems worse then 5 levels of ninja which ups sudden strike and more importantly ghost step (ethreal). Plus I've already played a Master thrower rouge, so was trying to spice it up

[Daftendirekt]

That is true, MT is lacking in sneak attack/sudden strike. were you going after a bow/crossbow then? I just thought, personally, that thrown seemed more ninja-ish. But, yeah, more SA/SS is always good.

Well, seeing as SS qualifies you for the same PrCs that SA does, you should take a look at the myriad PrCs out there. Assassin, Nightsong Enforcer, Shadow Thief of Amn, etc...

EDIT: More stuff.

Zen Fortitude feat is out there (WIS to Fort), Dragon Magazine 351... Don't know if there's a "Zen Reflexes" feat of any kind out there. Get WIS to all your saves!

[Master Thrower]

That is true, MT is lacking in sneak attack/sudden strike. were you going after a bow/crossbow then? I just thought, personally, that thrown seemed more ninja-ish. But, yeah, more SA/SS is always good.

Well, seeing as SS qualifies you for the same PrCs that SA does, you should take a look at the myriad PrCs out there. Assassin, Nightsong Enforcer, Shadow Thief of Amn, etc...

Im just using a wounding short bow. And im thinking of just taking one level of exemplar then straight ninja. But any feats im missing? or skills I should take ten in that are UMD

[Daftendirekt]

Being able to take 10 in any of your movement skills would be pretty awesome, particularly Hide and Move Silently. Climb, so you can hide up trees and shoot to your heart's content.

8 ranks in Climb could get you the Corner Perch skill trick, Complete Scoundrel 85, which is pretty ninja. Name should be self-explanatory on what it lets you do.

Climb 5, Jump 5 gets you "Leaping Climber" skill trick which lets you add jump distance to the beginning of a climb. With the ninja's Great Leap ability, you could get some pretty good mobility out of that one.

[Master Thrower]

hmm so got skills down, now should I get a +1 wounding bow? or should I just get a + 1 x bow and save the 10,000

[Daftendirekt]

To be honest, Wounding doesn't sound that amazing. 1 con damage per hit isn't too spectacular unless you'd be getting loads of hits off per round, which ranged isn't really known for doing (unless you're a master thrower >_>).

I suggest getting a weapon of Deadly Precision. There's the Complete Adventurer version which costs a +2 bonus and gives 2d6 extra sneak attack (I'm sure the DM would allow the change to sudden strike. They ARE interchangeable after all).

There's also the +1 bonus cost version in the MIC, which only gives 1d6 extra sneak attack.

Seeking wouldn't be a terrible idea either. Negates miss chances from concealment, blur, etc.

[Master Thrower]

To be honest, Wounding doesn't sound that amazing. 1 con damage per hit isn't too spectacular unless you'd be getting loads of hits off per round, which ranged isn't really known for doing (unless you're a master thrower >_>).

I suggest getting a weapon of Deadly Precision. There's the Complete Adventurer version which costs a +2 bonus and gives 2d6 extra sneak attack (I'm sure the DM would allow the change to sudden strike. They ARE interchangeable after all).

There's also the +1 bonus cost version in the MIC, which only gives 1d6 extra sneak attack.

Seeking wouldn't be a terrible idea either. Negates miss chances from concealment, blur, etc.

seeking was one of the choices I was considering. And wounding I dont think is worth it as anything imune to SS/SA is also immune to wounding for the most part

[Psyborg]

+1 vote for halfling.

Halfling Rogue 1 racial substitution level grants Ranged Sneak Attack +2d6 and no melee SA, rather than the normal rogue's +1d6 all, making it an excellent 1-level dip for ranged sneak-attackers.

Plus, if you do decide to go throwing over bows, halfling skiprocks are made of awesome, and the Whisperknife PrC is one of the few really good ranged PrCs in 3.5. If there were an archery PrC that were as good, I'd...well...not have to play so much homebrew *chuckle* Not that there's anything wrong with homebrew.

Anyhow, yeah. Halfling is the way to go here. Small size, +2 Dex, and some great options that aren't open to other races.

Edit: Just for completeness, Strongheart Halfling > regular Halfling, and ranged builds are so feat-starved that it's debatably not even cheesy.

[Daftendirekt]

NOTE: Before I say anything else, keep this in mind. You don't need to take the ninja class to be a ninja-type character...

I think the halfling rogue sub. level might be specifically THROWN sneak attack, not RANGED sneak attack. Lemme check.

Yep. Although the ability IS called Ranged Sneak Attack, the text for it reads thus: "...Whenever a halfling rogue delivers a ranged sneak attack with a thrown weapon or sling she deals an extra 1d6 points of damage."

So, sling too. But slings suck. So, yeah, MT, if you really want a good ranged ninja, you're probably going to have to go thrown. The problem with master thrower and whisperknife is together, they are VERY feat intensive. I'd suggest doing the rogue variant that replaces sneak attack dice with fighter bonus feats (Unearthed Arcana 59). This way you still get plenty of skill points and all the other fun stuff, and get the feats needed to enter. So, here's my suggestion:

Strongheart halfling

• halfling rogue substitution level 1 (so you have 2d6 SA thrown right away)
• 6 more levels of rogue so you get up to +5 BAB and get master thrower OR 3 more levels of rogue and 2 levels of fighter (for quick bonus feats)
• Master thrower 5
• Whisperknife 7/9 depending on whether you did rogue 7 or rogue 4/fighter 2.

Req. Feats
Master Thrower - Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Weapon Focus (any thrown)
Whisperknife - Point-Blank (will already have), Quick Draw (bonus from MT), TWF, Weapon Finesse (these last two you should have anyway...)

[Master Thrower]

NOTE: Before I say anything else, keep this in mind. You don't need to take the ninja class to be a ninja-type character...

Im aware Ninjas aren't as optimal a choice as rogues, but after playing some many I thought why not try it, and after reading the ninja handbook, I decided to go with archery. With Boots of speed I get an extra attack on top of rapid shot so thats 4 attacks at +14/14/14/9.

Base attack+8
Wis (24) +7
Haste +1
Rapid shot -2.

And if i'm invisible which I often will be it goes to 16/16/16/11, and they are flat footed