DBZ Roleplaying Game: How Would it Work...?

[Conners]

This question has nagged me for a while. Does a DBZ tabletop-style game exist? How the heck would it work, if there was one or someone made one...?

Perhaps someone here has considered the idea vaguely, or heard of a DBZ roleplaying game before? That'd be good, since my curiosity demands satisfaction.

[Ravens_cry]

Session after session of charging up your power against the BBEG, and . . . it misses.

[Conners]

XD I see you went for authenticity .

Maybe there need to be optional rules for "filler" play where every action must take at least three minutes? Also, no fight can be ended in fewer than four episodes sessions.

[Timeras]

heard of a DBZ roleplaying game before?

There is a game. You don't want to play it, trust me.

[Ravens_cry]

XD I see you went for authenticity .

To be fair, the BBEG AC was pretty high. It's

Spoiler

Show

OVER NINE THOU-SAND! ! !

Maybe there need to be optional rules for "filler" play where every action must take at least three minutes? Also, no fight can be ended in fewer than four episodes sessions.

Heh, maybe, but from what I know of the show, Exalted would be the best mainstream system to capture the feel of Dragonball Z, if not the universe in itself.

[Conners]

There is a game. You don't want to play it, trust me.

I think I've seen that on the web before, come to think of it. The description alone sounds pretty bad.... Any idea what kind of mechanics it fools around with?

To be fair, the BBEG AC was pretty high. It's

Spoiler

Show

OVER NINE THOU-SAND! ! !

Heh, maybe, but from what I know of the show, Exalted would be the best mainstream system to capture the feel of Dragonball Z, if not the universe in itself.

I don't actually know much about how exalted plays, come to think of it--only that things are powerful and magicy and stuff.



When it comes down to it, I guess an important question about a DBZ system is, would you leverage Battle Power/Power Level as part of the mechanics...? If so, then you have some pretty big numbers to deal with in calculations o.o"...

[Prime32]

High-PL Mutants & Masterminds maybe? The figures grow on an exponential scale as you add points to a power, and they have stats for things like charged attacks.

[Eldan]

I don't know DBZ well, I must admit, but how about high point Mutants and Masterminds? It can do all kinds of powers to ridiculous levels (they scale exponentially), the stuff commonly seen in DBZ shouldn't be too much of a problem.

^ Screw you, Prime!

[Conners]

Yeah, M&M with some restrictions (IE: limiting the abilities to DBZ-esque ones) could probably work. Has anyone tried it before, I wonder o.o"?

Even if you get a working system, though: What sort of campaign do you have?? At low levels, it could be similar to DnD, like that pirates' hideout Goku explored (in Dragon Ball). At high levels, are you dealing with wars, do games centre entirely around duels with the BBEG and his henchies, or do you have a dungeon filled with Greek-god-level minions?

[Ecalsneerg]

Mutants and Masterminds actually has a Mecha & Manga book for 2e, which has guidelines for high-PL DBZ-esque games.

Pity 90% of its contents are the core rules reprinted in a slightly prettier, more confusing format. Core MnM can probably work just fine.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

I'm not very familiar with DBZ, but Exalted sounds like it's just the ticket. Ridiculous power levels and duck-punching? Definitely.

[valadil]

Instead of charisma you'd have the "hair height" primary attribute.

[Timeras]

I think I've seen that on the web before, come to think of it. The description alone sounds pretty bad.... Any idea what kind of mechanics it fools around with?

The rules focus only on combat and as far as I remember most actions in combat depend on the same attribute and skill, so players will put everything in those.
To use energy attacks, you actually have to spend some time powering up.

[Goober4473]

I feel like a modification of Scion or Exalted (I haven't played Exalted, but I hear it's the same basic system as Scion) would probably work. I'm running a Scion game now. Everything is extremely powerful and rediculous, and pretty soon everyone is going to be able to fly (the whole group has access to the Sky purview, the second ability of which is flight).

Just toss in some energy blasts, energy detection/supression, etc., and you're good.

[ericgrau]

You start the game at level 10. Every time you nearly die in a fight, gain 4 levels. Several NPCs give you 4 levels if you spend downtime training with them. Or even training on your own in expectation of a major foe. Every time someone really ticks you off, temporarily gain 4 levels. Once you hit a certain level, gain 10 levels; temporary levels may be applied towards this requirement. Anything more than 4 levels above you is an overwhelming fight.

Focused Energy Attack (Feat)
You may spend a full round action charging up an energy attack that, as a standard action on the following round, hits and deals damage as if you were 4 levels higher. You may flavor it however you like, but it's basically the same regardless, at least a few episodes after it's first introduced. If you are disrupted while preparing the attack it is canceled. Note: if you are at least 4 levels higher than an opponent time flows much slower for you and this may become moot.

Volley (Flaw)
As a full round action you deal 3,000 attacks dealing 1d3 damage each. Almost everyone in the world has DR, yet no matter how many times you do this you can't believe what happens once the smoke clears.

Regeneration (Flaw)
As a full round action you may regrow a lost limb. There are no dismemberment rules in this game and you are the only one who ever loses limbs.

Polite Fighter (Flaw)
Whenever a foe charges up you must wait politely for several minutes, until he finishes so that you may fight him at full strength. You may not wear earplugs to drown out his shouting.

I only know these because I like the show . I hear Dragonball Z Kai fixes the problems with excessive TV filler. If I ever go back to the show I may check it out.

[Prime32]

Regeneration (Flaw)
As a full round action you may regrow a lost limb. There are no dismemberment rules in this game and you are the only one who ever loses limbs without dying.

Clearly it should be combined with a Defensive Roll ability which destroys one of your limbs on a success.

...though then everyone would be Namek wizards who polymorph into hecatoncheires...

[Conners]

Hey, that's actually a pretty good premise for a system you gave there, ericgrau (your name is hard to type)!

BP is hard to track, and calculating such large numbers would be stressful at a table, and if you're playing earthlings who don't have scouters it'll be lost on them anyway...

Thus, you have levels to show difference in power. Depending on how you crunch the numbers, 4 levels could be an overwhelming advantage, or 20 levels could be--that doesn't really matter, except as to how you space it out.
Either way, your level (or level advantage over your opponent) would be added to just about everything positive for you.

After that, you get some stats to make things more strategic and custom--Martial Arts, Strength, KI, whatever. These add directly to related checks.

Add in mechanics, crunch the numbers, and you have a system. ...I might write that system, just for the fun of it.

[GeekGirl]

BESM, Its literally made for it. The game is designed with anime and manga in mind. Though I've never played, only read the books. I can't attest to the system, it does seem like fun and i want to try it

[ericgrau]

Hey, that's actually a pretty good premise for a system you gave there, ericgrau (your name is hard to type)!

BP is hard to track, and calculating such large numbers would be stressful at a table, and if you're playing earthlings who don't have scouters it'll be lost on them anyway...

Thus, you have levels to show difference in power. Depending on how you crunch the numbers, 4 levels could be an overwhelming advantage, or 20 levels could be--that doesn't really matter, except as to how you space it out.
Either way, your level (or level advantage over your opponent) would be added to just about everything positive for you.

After that, you get some stats to make things more strategic and custom--Martial Arts, Strength, KI, whatever. These add directly to related checks.

Add in mechanics, crunch the numbers, and you have a system. ...I might write that system, just for the fun of it.

Ha what I said was a lark but your spin on it might work. If you want to give some foes scouters you could computer power level by some level based formula like double every X levels. Hmm... if you want level 1 commoners with much less power, people may have to start higher than level 10.

[Goober4473]

BESM, Its literally made for it. The game is designed with anime and manga in mind. Though I've never played, only read the books. I can't attest to the system, it does seem like fun and i want to try it

In my experience (which is 2e BESM), BESM doesn't scale very well. It would probably model Dragonball, maybe very early Dragonball Z alright, but the system breaks down as you get more powerful.

[wizuriel]

Anima beyond fantasy has a KI section which is pretty much all DBZ style fighting. You buy/build techniques and then spend some rounds powering up the abilities before unleashing them upon people.

[Conners]

Anima sounds interesting for it. Anyone know of an attempted DBZ campaign with that system?



If I were to continue this idea for a DBZ system... it'd probably be opposed rolls largely, offence vs. defence etc.. You could probably use a d20 dice, in which case 20 levels over a character would be ridiculously powerful beyond belief (IE: you get a +20 to your roll only losing on a nat 1). Or you could have as much as a d100, for greater variance and more room for diversely levelled fights (a character 50 levels over you might still take a few rounds before decimating you).

Yeah, that sounds pretty good.

With the d20 version, you'd have it that every four(?) points you roll over your opponent, your attack/defence becomes a level better. IE: Base Damage: 40. 4 points over opponent: 45. 8 points: 50. Etc..


How would melee be handled, though? Would it just be like DnD, with repeated attack rolls? Be nice to throw in some kind of variance (IE: an attack which knocks your opponent away, etc.).

[MightyPirate]

Mutants and Masterminds also comes with some pretty decent rules for knockback and it's very easy to use ridiculously massive objects as improvised weapons. The source book Ultimate Power is also pretty useful with rules on power contests (pushing the energy ball back and forth) and disabling your opponent's projectiles by punching them.

[Conners]

Wow, that's even better than I thought, MightyPirate o.o! Question though: how easy would you say it is to play DBZ though M&M? Like, would you need to twist the rules, which makes it awkward/confusing/whatever to play?

[Nintaku]

I've been spending almost my entire gaming career (about thirteen years now) trying to perfect a DBZ RPG using various systems, both commercial and homemade. I can offer my wisdom.

R. Talsorian's DBZ RPG

Spoiler

Show

The R. Talsorian RPG is a terrible product, overall. I've done dozens of homebrew rules to try and fix it, and none of it has worked.

The system is Instant Fuzion. You have four stats and eight skills. Add Stat+Skill+3d6. Sounds good at low levels, right? Right. You also have Power Level, which is a pool of points you can spend to do cool stuff. Each point is effectively 1d6 worth of awesome, and you spend them in increments of 10. Starting to see a problem? Me too. Also, when a fight ends, you divide your PL by your opponent's, multiply by 10, and get that many experience points. Each point increases a skill by 1.

On average you should be getting 10 XP per battle. That's +10 to spread across your skills immediately. When your random factor is 3-18, that's bad very fast. Also I was the first in my group to come up with the brilliant idea of only ever raising my skills, never my Power Level, so I was constantly increasing the amount of XP I was getting by fighting "stronger" opponents, who were much less skilled.

The numbers don't scale and are basically awful. I recently tried to implement a simple solution: replace the 3d6 mechanic entirely by the D6 System's idea. Stat+Skill = d6 rolled. It scales things much better in the long run. But that's only one of the game's many problems. I've fixed Power Level by making it a function of Stats (which now increase as you gain XP automatically) and changed around the skills so they're less bad on their own.

I still can't figure out how to fix the spending of Power Level on energy attacks. As it stands, the best solution is to gather all your energy and fire the biggest ball of death you can, pumping it full of "not missing" power. Deal 300 d6 damage to someone with 200 health and tell me that isn't a win. On the other hand, if you have a proper DBZ battle, you whittle down your own energy until you can't pull off your cool super moves at the end. Bah. What I have needs testing before I can move on to the other problems, anyway.

Mutants & Masterminds

Spoiler

Show

Ran this on RPoL, and my villain was one-shot killed in the first round of the first combat. While he was trying to talk the capitol city into surrendering to his boss. I really should have thought that one out better. My fault there. Don't stat up a character until they're ready to be horribly killed by PCs with weapons you didn't think were that deadly during chargen. Also, it's a really small list of powers that make a lot of sense for M&M. And I haven't seen the Mecha & Manga book's take on it, but I'm told it's "perfect". I am wary.

Wushu

Spoiler

Show

It was my first experience with Wushu, and I was running the darn thing. Maybe now that I've gotten a better handle on how Traits are used to showcase a character's strengths and weaknesses rather than to limit what they're physically capable of, this should have another round of testing. It might actually work if it's intended to emulate the genre instead of simply as another combat system.

D20 Dragonball Z

Spoiler

Show

Someone made a pdf of this using D&D 3.0 as a base. It hurts my eyes and my dignity. DBZ characters using base D&D classes, with Z-Fighter as a new base clss, and Oozaru, Super Saiyan, and Student of King Kai as prestige classes. Even the new races aren't very good. I had an attempt at writing D20 Dragonball going, but it was erased while I was out. I remember tidbits, and they might be usable, but I don't have the patience to work in D20 anymore, with lists of feats and such. Still, it could work if done very carefully and with love for the setting.

[Ecalsneerg]

Mutants & Masterminds

Spoiler

Show

Ran this on RPoL, and my villain was one-shot killed in the first round of the first combat. While he was trying to talk the capitol city into surrendering to his boss. I really should have thought that one out better. My fault there. Don't stat up a character until they're ready to be horribly killed by PCs with weapons you didn't think were that deadly during chargen. Also, it's a really small list of powers that make a lot of sense for M&M. And I haven't seen the Mecha & Manga book's take on it, but I'm told it's "perfect". I am wary.

Why not just Fiat? It's a built-in game mechanic so you can fudge while giving the players something.

[Nintaku]

Maybe I was also in the wrong group of players. No one in that group liked using Fiat to determine what was "fair". They wanted to use the numbers themselves for that, and I hadn't had a chance to properly test out numbers and ranges and things. My first plan was to just make the villain slightly more powerful than the PCs, and give him a bunch of minions (two saibamen per PC ought to do it, right?).

Like I said, the first round of combat had the villain killed instantly. That was the first action. The Damage roll was, I think, +34 over his Toughness Save if I recall correctly. The SECOND action of combat was from the next PC in the initiative order. He killed all of the saibamen (eight of them total) as his first action, and he'd worked it so he had another four actions after that.

Maybe if I'd had some more M&M under my belt at the time, I could have seen those numbers coming. This was PL 10, 150 point characters, so I didn't expect that kind of mass minion slaughter, or pretty much instant death for a character who should have had the advantage (PL 14).

[Conners]

Yeah, that's the problem I suspected of M&M, it's built in a way where you can destroy the world with a low-level character by clever use of traits :-/.

Personally, I think you'd be better off working from scratch to make a system. Maybe my mind is just hardwired for this kind of thing, but I've never found it too frustrating. Toying around with some systematics myself, if you ever feel like exchanging ideas (you certainly have more experience than I do).

[Ecalsneerg]

Yeah, that's the problem I suspected of M&M, it's built in a way where you can destroy the world with a low-level character by clever use of traits :-/.

Clever, no. Literate enough to read the sidebars explaining to the DM why allowing certain things is a bad idea, yes. MnM not only expects the DM to say no to players during char gen, it tells them what is likely to come up as an exploit.

[Conners]

Oh, I see. Didn't remember anything to that light... maybe I wasn't reading the DM's book.