"Snips, Snails, & Dragon Tales" Discussion - Poll + Unmarked Spoilers

[Sunken Valley]

3.75 (Pathfinder) also has "athletics" rather than individual skill checks.

What Mongoose said, but you are close. "Acrobatics" was a new skill created to replace Balance, jump and tumble. Not climb though. That's still it's own skill.

[Unisus]

I really liked the book, so here my opinions to the selection above:

Julio Scoundrel: I'm still searching for the earlier episodes, especially for #73 and #120. Yes, i really would like to get through all his adventueres (which should make more than only one book, i guess *smile*)

4th-Edition-OotS: As funny as they could be, i don't think there is much room for more than a few stories, as all the good RPG/Fantasy-gags and quotes are already part of the "original" OotS and would somehow feel repetitive if reused for OotS4.

StickTales: Please more of them - a whole book of them (maybe with one or two strips with the 4th-Editioners at the borders) and of course a story told by V.

Anthology: Also a good idea, especially if there are not enough StickTales for a whole book or if Scoundrels adventures can not be recollected.

Fantasy in other art-style: i really don't know. The Order of the Stick cought my heart with it's humor mostly - maybe i would give a more realisticaly drawn comic a try, but don't count on that. It's more the spirit that has to catch me, not the art.

Anything: definitely not. I only buy things that i like or at least am sure to like, but i'd never buy something just because it exists.

So, as i did not find Scoundrel-comics anywhere in the net (maybe i did not search hard enough?) i guess they don't really exist, the problem with 4th-Ed-OotS is obvious and the StickTales may not sum up enough for a whole book - when can we have the next Anthology? ;)

[Palthera]

What Mongoose said, but you are close. "Acrobatics" was a new skill created to replace Balance, jump and tumble. Not climb though. That's still it's own skill.

Bleh, I'm playing a wizard. I knew it began with an "a". :D

[Avalon2]

Well, let's see:

Julio Scoundrel: Really liked the art and thought it was a good change of pace, and might like to see more strips in books forthcoming.

Realm of the Dragon: For one page, it was nice, and definitely funny, but too brief. If the OOTS characters had been there, it might've been more interesting.

The Dragon Tales: Although I'm not too familiar with the Dungeon companies, I did get the Wiz of the Coast and D/D references. However, I absolutely didn't understand the Room of Odd-Looking People (not my era, maybe?)

The Magazine Strips: Hilarious random stuff. Totally busted up during the Clyde the Conjurer and Psteve strips.

Invaders From the Fourth Dimension: Cute. I especially liked the part where they battle the other hobbies.

Stick Tales: Goldenleaf was lame, but then it was supposed to be. The others were cute. I didn't get the Hamlet reference, but Greenhilt was funny anyway.

All in all, GREAT BOOK!!!

[Unisus]

The Dragon Tales: Although I'm not too familiar with the Dungeon companies, I did get the Wiz of the Coast and D/D references. However, I absolutely didn't understand the Room of Odd-Looking People (not my era, maybe?)

The explanation on this room is found on the page before the comic #356 - it's just all the old comics that were running in "Dragon" earlier.

[WoodStock_PV]

I finally got the book. Two months waiting for almost three hours of reading, but it was well spent three hours.

My favorite part was the little strip called "in the realm of the dragon" and the dragon OOTS strips. I voted for more sticktales and another anthology of unrelated stuff. I would be awesome to read a book with just some jokes for the sake of simple humor.. like the realm of the dragon strip, the Intermission strip and the dragon magazine strips.

All in all a good book well worth the waiting, keep'em coming giant!

[Parlik]

Well would personally love to see a prequel with Dorukan's group, but I suspect you hear that a lot, hence the lack of it as an option

[WickedWizard17]

\Stick Tales: Goldenleaf was lame, but then it was supposed to be. The others were cute. I didn't get the Hamlet reference, but Greenhilt was funny anyway.

All in all, GREAT BOOK!!!

I've both seen and read Hamlet - and so oh MAN was Greenhilt hilarious!!!!!!

Well would personally love to see a prequel with Dorukan's group, but I suspect you hear that a lot, hence the lack of it as an option

YES oh my God I would LOVE to see that! But no way is it ever gonna happen, at least not til OotS ends (heaven forbid) and it could get done as a prequel or something. Otherwise there'd be way WAY too many spoilers.

[Zevox]

Well would personally love to see a prequel with Dorukan's group, but I suspect you hear that a lot, hence the lack of it as an option

There was originally a voting option for prequel books, but the Giant removed it within a day of posting the thread. Go back to the first page and you can see his comment on why, in post #12.

Zevox

[The Giant]

I'm going to give this poll about another week or so before closing it. I think almost everyone, even those overseas, have gotten their books if they pre-ordered, and most of those who ordered since August have gotten theirs as well.

[Gwynfrid]

I got mine just a few weeks ago, and I have read it only once so far (been busy).

My take (bear with me if those comments were made by others already, the thread is now too long for me to read through):

- Julio Scoundrél story: great fun, but not sure the character warrants its own series. I mean, why not, but other characters deserve that just as well as Julio does. For example Xykon, O'Chul, Redcloak, Shojo, Tarquin, the Oracle, and I'm sure I'm forgetting a few: These could all star in great mini-series.

- Julio Scoundrél art: I'm not keen on the variant stick art. It's great for big-ticket items like the airship. But for characters, it felt just like OOTS, only more busy. I would have preferred regular OOTS style art, but in color. As for the more realistic style, I wasn't very impressed. It feels more, you know, run of the mill. Stick art is part of why you're unique, Rich. I suspect you may find it difficult to walk away from it, even though of course you can draw in other styles.

- I would gladly have paid more for a full color book, although I understand the financial constraints, especially those of fans who have a hard time in this economy.

- Dragon Tales: Loved it. OK, some strips are a little weaker than others, but overall it's hilarious. Your homage to Dragon Magazine was superb. I understand you don't want to do much more of that kind of strips. Its hails back to the early OOTS era, and the one-page gag style is very difficult to maintain in the long run (I know very few authors who can do both the one-page format and the long story format). Still, I'm sure you sometimes still get random ideas that don't fit anywhere else : Please please give them to us in a format like this.

- 4th dimension: Great, great stuff. The only reason I didn't vote for it is I think there is only so many jokes that can be done making fun of the 3rd-4th edition rules differences. But if you can prove me wrong, or if you have a fun story in the alternate dimension, by all means, go for it.

- Stick Tales: Tricky. It was fun, but I'm sure I missed a lot of the strength of the Hamlet story because, hem, I have never read Hamlet. English is not my first language, and Shakespeare's English is considered to be extremely daunting for us foreigners. I guess I should still try to read it one day. So, I voted for more Stick Tales because the parody is great. But I suspect success for those might be limited, as its depends on people having good knowledge of both the OOTS main story and the tales being adapted. For example, if you go for stories that are American mainstream but not that well know outside the US (or the English-speaking world) then I'll probably buy it anyway, but I'll sure be frustrated.

Anyway... thanks Rich for a great book. Well worth the (very very long) wait.

[Unisus]

- Julio Scoundrél story: great fun, but not sure the character warrants its own series. I mean, why not, but other characters deserve that just as well as Julio does. For example Xykon, O'Chul, Redcloak, Shojo, Tarquin, the Oracle, and I'm sure I'm forgetting a few: These could all star in great mini-series.

While i see the potential for other characters to have own strips, i think some of those you mentioned are not that appropriate. Xykon and Redcloak had some own strips in SoD, and they are too involved in the main story. Tarquin, while surely not uninteresting, is less of an adventurer and more of a strategist. The Oracle could be funny, but not so much story-like - i'd rather see one-strip-stories where the Oracle predicts something and we can see the outcome (especially when there are things happening which are exactly what the Oracle told, but which are contrary to what one would think the Oracle had said).

Julio Scoundrel has all what is needed for a spin-off from OotS - he is only little involved in the main story and he is an adventurer.

[factotum]

Julio Scoundrel has all what is needed for a spin-off from OotS - he is only little involved in the main story and he is an adventurer.

Plus he has a sweet airship...

[Joerg]

It's been a few weeks since I've read the book now, but here are my comments:

- Preface: great. I've waited for Xykon to do one.

- Julio Scoundrél: the panel layout worked, it created more action and it felt more like a comic book. I liked the shadows in the new style, but not the double lines for arms and hands (it works better for the legs because I assume trousers). The story itself was meager, and, well, I just don't like Julio.

- Dragon magazine strips: some of those were extremely funny. They felt like the first OotS strips in DCF.

- Edition wars: I dreaded that I wouldn't get any jokes there because I don't know the 4e rules at all. But the rules were actually explained in-comic so it kind of worked, even though I still think I'd appreciate it more if I'd played D&D 4. And strip 21 was the highlight of the book.

- Stick tales: hilarious and always so fitting to the characters who recount them. I want more of those!

[Raistlin82]

I voted for 4E OotS. I'm a big fan of 4E (as a DM, it makes my life so much easier and my encounters much more fun) and I've always wondered why the comic didn't follow the natural evolution of D&D.
The end of the story was fun, I especially loved seeing them thrash that hooded guy wielding "magic cards"!

Julio Scoundrél was baffling. I just... I don't understand what the appeal is supposed to be in that. Mind me, I don't particularly dislike the character (I don't particularly care for him, either)... it's the storytelling, the so-not-Rich-Burlewy way the story is told that left me extremely cold.

The retelling of classic fairy tales and such is an old staple. We've seen it done thousands and thousands of times... even by Mickey Mouse. And just like all the other times this was done, it had the fundamental flaw of being the Nth retelling of stories that we know far too well. I found it the most boring part of the book.

The rest of the book was really good, both the "Snail dungeon" and the 4E crossover. However, I was disappointed to have it flat out stated that these happen in an alternate continuity. Would it have been so hard to let it be something that happened to the "real" OotS in a specific point in time, just in between adventures? Additionally, this means the 4E part is a fight between two different alternate versions of the OotS, none of which is the "original" one.

That being said... when is the -2 Order of the Scribble prequel book coming out, Giant?

[Zherog]

Rich -- if a book similar to "Snip" comes out in the future, any chance you would consider dropping 5' Steps in there? I enjoyed them, even if it was a short-lived series.

[MoonCat]

It rather amuses me that the thread gets some action once people realize they wont be able to later on.

Also, Roy's mom has three ankles in Greenhilt.

[The Giant]

Julio Scoundrél was baffling. I just... I don't understand what the appeal is supposed to be in that. Mind me, I don't particularly dislike the character (I don't particularly care for him, either)... it's the storytelling, the so-not-Rich-Burlewy way the story is told that left me extremely cold.

The appeal was more on my end. I included it specifically to try something new and different from my same-old, same-old: Faster paced, less wordy, more visually-oriented. Something closer to traditional superhero comic books, and Julio was a character who was both action-oriented and completely unrelated to the main plot. I wanted to stretch my creative boundaries a little and see what I could do. If people liked it, then awesome. If people didn't like it, well, they can indulge me for eight pages.

At an rate, it would be wrong to assume that the way I write OOTS is the end-all and be-all of me as an author. Julio Scoundrél is "Rich-Burlewy," it's just Rich Burlew writing a different genre (pulp action) and format (comic book). It's fine that you didn't like it, but please don't expect my entire future writing career to mimic OOTS. It won't, even if that means it isn't as successful as I would like.

[Raistlin82]

If people didn't like it, well, they can indulge me for eight pages.

Yeah, no biggie.

At an rate, it would be wrong to assume that the way I write OOTS is the end-all and be-all of me as an author. Julio Scoundrél is "Rich-Burlewy," it's just Rich Burlew writing a different genre (pulp action) and format (comic book). It's fine that you didn't like it, but please don't expect my entire future writing career to mimic OOTS. It won't, even if that means it isn't as successful as I would like.

I know, I know.
I just used that not entirely fitting definition 'cause I didn't know how else to explain/define my alienation and puzzlement with Julio's strips.

EDIT: and honestly... I shouldn't be saying this, but I'm probably gonna buy whatever you write, regardless.

PS: I'm quite honored that The Giant answered to me directly, but I'm disappointed that you didn't give me the one answer I was waiting for:

That being said... when is the -2 Order of the Scribble prequel book coming out, Giant?

[JoseB]

My copies arrived a little while ago (finally! Happy happy joy joy!). Excellent book, as usual. My comments:

* The Julio Scoundrél comic: I liked it. And I am left wondering what the heck happened in issues #73 and #120 ;) If you were to make more, I would definitely get them.

* The "realistic" art for Julio Scoundrél: I found it interesting, although I don't think it would work together with the story.

* The "4th Edition Wars": A funny one-off. I liked it, but I don't think it can be "stretched" much longer.

* The "Stick Tales": Pure genius. I enjoyed them *A LOT*. Especially Roy's version of "Hamlet". If you made more "Stick Tales", I would definitely buy them!

* The "Dragon" strips: I was very curious about them, and I was very happy that you put them together for this book. I enjoyed reading them *a lot*. Also, if the over-templated snail were to show up at some point in the strip... That would make me squee ^.^

All in all, it was worth waiting for the book :) I enjoyed it a lot!

[The Giant]

PS: I'm quite honored that The Giant answered to me directly, but I'm disappointed that you didn't give me the one answer I was waiting for:

Obviously, I'm not going to answer that. What books may or may not be written in the future, much less their scheduling, is not something I'm willing to reveal.

Suffice to say that fan demand for any given prequel, side-story, or other diversion is not sufficient inducement for me to actually write it, if I don't have a compelling idea in mind. I didn't write 4E jokes for years despite overwhelming demand because I didn't have any really good ideas for it until this time last year. Start of Darkness got written because I came up with an interesting character arc for Redcloak, not because there was very much about Xykon that needed to be told.

Which is why this poll is more about me learning what the fans enjoyed, rather than me necessarily asking what I should do more of. If the winner had been something I had no other ideas for (and the things I had ideas for were poorly received), then I was simply not going to do any of them a second time. Luckily, the two top vote getters (StickTales and another anthology) are also the two that I have the most concrete ideas for already. So the likelihood of seeing more of those someday are much higher.

[Mutant Sheep]

Horray! More Sticktales, wohoo! Sound so much like Ducktales... is that intentional?

[ref]

Awesome news, Giant. But would it be possible to make those new anthologies or stick tales via the stores world wide? I had to go through a number of loops before being able to order SSDT online.

[WickedWizard17]

I want to say this before the poll closes - for StickTales, I think it would HILARIOUS for Elan and Haley to re-enact some version of the Little Mermaid. If you went for the traditional Disney version, obviously Haley is Ariel and Elan is Eric - or, more likely, Elan is Ariel and Haley is Eric. xD

Or if you went for Hans Christian Andersen, where Eric ends up with some other girl and Ariel kills herself but is then turned into an air spirit, I think Therkla could be a compelling Ariel - and then she could go hang out with Celia on the Elemental Plane of Air. LOL.

[The Giant]

OK, I'm closing the poll now. Thanks to everyone who voted and/or gave feedback on the book.