A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default A request for assistance...

    ... on stuff... ><.><

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    Ok so basically I am trying to begin preparations to dm a game in a custom setting. Long story short, its semi-post apocalyptic, survivalish, sci-fi stuff. The old world has been destroyed by a war whose cause has long since been forgotten and humanity is teetering on the brink of survival. There are only five cities on the entire North American continent that can be called "bastions of human civilization". Of those five 2 are at a tech level comparable to our own. One is on what we would think to be "pushing the boundaries" of our current tech. Of the remaining 2 one is a high tech city filled with technological wonders the likes of which most people can barely imagine (in the game world anyways) and the other is a city of learning the "darker" aspects humanity magic and psionics.

    One of the consequences of the war that nearly obliterated the world is the existence of mutated wild life and mutated humans. Suddenly the world is much more hostile because you have large beasts whose pack of 12 members could devour a small village need repelling and humans who where unlucky enough to be mutated into pseudo-mindless monsters whose only remaining drive and ambition is to inflict harm on others. Magic and other supernatural powers are widely untrusted and considered "evil" by many of the "pure" humans remaining. And in an attempt to help humans survive people turned to science to try and create a "Super soldier" to even humanities odds of survival. Sadly the first attempt was a miserable failure and yet a remarkable success at the same time. Vampires. A annoyance in one area, a market of cheap labor in another and monsters in most others.

    After the tragedy which created the vampires humans nearly gave up on the research but the high tech city kept it going and eventually got it right.

    now here is where i need the help... those super soldiers.

    I personally imagine them being kinda like the SOLDIERS from FFVII (cloud, zack, sephiroth, angeal, genisis) better than humans, but not completely outclassing them either. but trying to translate that into dnd 3.5/pathfinder is kinda messy. Secondly i don't know if i want to handle them as a template or as a class.

    I am not asking some one to do all the work for me on this one. What i am looking for is input. how do all of you folks think it would best be handled? what would your ideas be how to handle it? im looking for other brains to pick on this one. Sadly my job interferes with much of my "creative" time otherwise i would have probably done more than what i have listed here already.

    as for me i kinda imagined these super soldiers being fueled by adrenaline in a similar way vampires use blood to fuel their powers... you know from the vampire class thingy from this site which i don't have a convenient link to at the moment because my computer went explodey.

    Think you guys can help?


    New info is new
    So i have done some thinking and i think that the easiest and least obtrusive way to implement this super soldier on a player level is to use it as a "bloodline". a special bloodline that can be taken at any point in a persons life assuming they manage to survive the "augmentation" process. Just a few issues:

    1)Most of the bloodlines from Unearthed arcana seemed a bit weak in my mind so how would this "bloodline" be defined as a bloodline? Minor? Moderate? Major? I am asking from a concept perspective right now because i still need to draw up the table (which i will be working on today because i am done with my job for the season).

    2)Just how powerful should this as a bloodline be? (keep in mind i don't intend for this to be just a dm tool it will also be available to players)

    3) Go ahead and laugh but i need a name and i am hitting a brick wall atm. (the only things i can think of reference FFVII and we don't really need that right now)

    Lastly I would like to pick the community brain about some of the abilities I plan on putting into this "bloodline" and would like some more creative input on them. I think after looking over several homebrews on this site the community as a whole has far more brain power and imagination as a whole than any one individual. I am looking for input as to what these abilities should do and when they should be obtained as a bloodline (keep in mind stat adjustments will also be thrown into the mix)

    Dense Muscle Mass: I am seeing this as a pseudo Powerful Build. But i don't want it to just be Powerful build with a different name... Ideas?

    Screw Physics: Something to make them be able to do acrobatic and athletic tricks that appear to be impossible any other way.

    Endless Stamina: I want them to be full of energy and kinda bouncing off the walls because they are now much more difficult to tire out.

    Hollow: I just feel as though there should be some sort of draw back to this so that people are even more wary of trying to become one of these other than the risk of death (which is strong but not always strong enough). maybe have this gained multiple times and each time it is gained having the character this is applied to gain a flaw (either random or by consultation)

    One Man Army: after reaching high levels i want some one to feel almost as if they are unstoppable and make what is sure to be recklessness they develop as they become more powerful more than just foolishness.

    Legendary: after somehow living through impossible odds there needs to be a massive cap stone (imo) for this Bloodline

    anything else that you would like to contribute to the whole this "little" idea of mine.

    Secondly these guys are meant primarily to ward off vampires
    Last edited by FallenGuardian; 2011-10-25 at 04:28 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
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    Grod_The_Giant's Avatar

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    Default Re: A request for assistance...

    Hmm... you might be best off with a race, really. Something with reasonable bonuses to physical stats, and a level adjustment. Say, along these lines:

    • +2 Strength, +4 Dexterity, +2 Constitution.
    • Medium size.
    • Base land speed 40 feet.
    • Special Qualities: Low-Light vision, Strong Back (Multiply carrying capacity by 1.5)
    • Endurance as a racial bonus feat.
    • +2 racial bonus to Search, Spot, and Listen checks, due to enhanced senses.
    • A +1 racial bonus to all saving throws.
    • Automatic Languages: Common. Bonus Languages: Any
    • Favored Class: some d20 Modern soldier type class?
    • Level adjustment +1
    Last edited by Grod_The_Giant; 2011-10-23 at 11:01 PM.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: A request for assistance...

    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    Hmm... you might be best off with a race, really. Something with reasonable bonuses to physical stats, and a level adjustment. Say, along these lines:

    • +2 Strength, +4 Dexterity, +2 Constitution.
    • Medium size.
    • Base land speed 40 feet.
    • Special Qualities: Low-Light vision, Strong Back (Multiply carrying capacity by 1.5)
    • Endurance as a racial bonus feat.
    • +2 racial bonus to Search, Spot, and Listen checks, due to enhanced senses.
    • A +1 racial bonus to all saving throws.
    • Automatic Languages: Common. Bonus Languages: Any
    • Favored Class: some d20 Modern soldier type class?
    • Level adjustment +1
    ZOMG I'M CRYING INSIDE BECAUSE THAT IS SUCH AN ELEGANT SOLUTION TO MY PROBLEM!!!

    however, (i also didn't expect you to know this) how unbalanced do you think it would be if i bumped up the str by 2 gave them something resembling powerful build and a pseudo leap of the heavens style ability? also throwing in some other flavor thing for my "setting" for example:

    • +4 Strength, +4 Dexterity, +2 Constitution.
    • Medium size.
    • Base land speed 40 feet.
    • Special Qualities: Low-Light vision
    • Dense Muscle Mass: This sub-race of humans have had their muscle's altered in such a way they are able to use weapons one size category larger than normal and have a carrying capacity of 1.5 times that of a normal human
    • Endless Stamina: This human sub-race was engineered for long grueling work and intense combat. They gain half again as much hp from their CON mod and can march for Con mod hours after the initial eight before needing rest
    • Screw Physics: This human sub-race is capable of feats of athleticism and acrobatics which defy what can be expected of normal humans. This sub-race is not limited to jumps according to their height and may always treat their jumps as though they had a running start. Lastly they may always take a 10 on an athletic or acrobatic skill even if stress or distractions would otherwise prevent them from doing so and gain a racial +2 bonus to such checks.
    • Endurance as a racial bonus feat.
    • +2 racial bonus to Search, Spot, and Listen checks, due to enhanced senses.
    • A +1 racial bonus to all saving throws.
    • Automatic Languages: Common. Bonus Languages: Any
    • Favored Class: some d20 Modern soldier type class?
    • Level adjustment +2?

  4. - Top - End - #4
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    Grod_The_Giant's Avatar

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    Default Re: A request for assistance...

    Eh, they're probably OK at ~LA +2, like you had. But it sounds like they're more of an NPC race, yeah? In that case, the important number is how this affects CR... which... I would say a level 1 super-soldier... solider... is a CR 2 monster?

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: A request for assistance...

    Just a quick comment, if they were engineered to be soldiers then they would likely have also been engineered to be compliant so as not to rampage against their creators. I'd throw in a -2 or -4 to Wisdom, or even just a penalty directly to their will save.
    Last edited by Chaos_Laicosin; 2011-10-24 at 11:15 AM.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: A request for assistance...

    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    Eh, they're probably OK at ~LA +2, like you had. But it sounds like they're more of an NPC race, yeah? In that case, the important number is how this affects CR... which... I would say a level 1 super-soldier... solider... is a CR 2 monster?
    actually no these are not meant to be npc only. eventually the pc's will have a chance to become these soldiers, so i guess the question then becomes is this too much then?... however, a grain of salt needs to be taken because after the first few encounters so everyone can get snuggly and warm inside of their characters and everything i break out the evil dm toolbox and have evil grins all day long. If i where just running these doods for npc's i would just rule 0 them in but i want to have something for my players hence my request here.

    secondly,
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaos_Laicosin View Post
    Just a quick comment, if they were engineered to be soldiers then they would likely have also been engineered to be compliant so as not to rampage against their creators. I'd throw in a -2 or -4 to Wisdom, or even just a penalty directly to their will save.
    yes you are absolutely right. I think a -2 wisdom and a -5 penalty to all will saves involving their "handlers" would be appropriate but would this change the adjustment at all?

  7. - Top - End - #7
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    Grod_The_Giant's Avatar

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    Default Re: A request for assistance...

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaos_Laicosin View Post
    Just a quick comment, if they were engineered to be soldiers then they would likely have also been engineered to be compliant so as not to rampage against their creators. I'd throw in a -2 or -4 to Wisdom, or even just a penalty directly to their will save.
    That really depends on the culture controlling them. For an evil, magic-using kingdom? Absolutely. For a modern army, though, you want smart soldiers. And if they're made with technology instead of magic, the penalty to will saves becomes meaningless. In that case, I'd say they're implanted with some kind of explosive capsule inside the skull at "birth." Disobey, and BAM! Brain soup! (This has the added bonus of being more interesting for the players to struggle against)

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: A request for assistance...

    So i have done some thinking and i think that the easiest and least obtrusive way to implement this super soldier on a player level is to use it as a "bloodline". a special bloodline that can be taken at any point in a persons life assuming they manage to survive the "augmentation" process. Just a few issues:

    1)Most of the bloodlines from Unearthed arcana seemed a bit weak in my mind so how would this "bloodline" be defined as a bloodline? Minor? Moderate? Major? I am asking from a concept perspective right now because i still need to draw up the table (which i will be working on today because i am done with my job for the season).

    2)Just how powerful should this as a bloodline be? (keep in mind i don't intend for this to be just a dm tool it will also be available to players)

    3) Go ahead and laugh but i need a name and i am hitting a brick wall atm. (the only things i can think of reference FFVII and we don't really need that right now)

    Lastly I would like to pick the community brain about some of the abilities I plan on putting into this "bloodline" and would like some more creative input on them. I think after looking over several homebrews on this site the community as a whole has far more brain power and imagination as a whole than any one individual. I am looking for input as to what these abilities should do and when they should be obtained as a bloodline (keep in mind stat adjustments will also be thrown into the mix)

    Dense Muscle Mass: I am seeing this as a pseudo Powerful Build. But i don't want it to just be Powerful build with a different name... Ideas?

    Screw Physics: Something to make them be able to do acrobatic and athletic tricks that appear to be impossible any other way.

    Endless Stamina: I want them to be full of energy and kinda bouncing off the walls because they are now much more difficult to tire out.

    Hollow: I just feel as though there should be some sort of draw back to this so that people are even more wary of trying to become one of these other than the risk of death (which is strong but not always strong enough). maybe have this gained multiple times and each time it is gained having the character this is applied to gain a flaw (either random or by consultation)

    One Man Army: after reaching high levels i want some one to feel almost as if they are unstoppable and make what is sure to be recklessness they develop as they become more powerful more than just foolishness.

    Legendary: after somehow living through impossible odds there needs to be a massive cap stone (imo) for this Bloodline

    anything else that you would like to contribute to the whole this "little" idea of mine.

    Secondly these guys are meant primarily to ward off vampires

  9. - Top - End - #9
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    Default Re: A request for assistance...

    Normally, the built-in level adjustment of the Bloodlines is the only drawback associated with them. If you include Hollow as planned, you could feasibly ramp up the power a bit more, but how far depends on the drawback...

    Personally, I'm not too good with balancing bloodlines and such, but I'd recommend taking a look at Welknair's breakdown on how to make them, found here. He does a really good job explaining every aspect, including where WoTC went wrong with the ones in Unearthed Arcana.
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  10. - Top - End - #10
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: A request for assistance...

    Just a quick bump to let people know i have requested assistance from other "pros" but also to let others know that if there isn't an update here (how much anyone would care i don't know because it isn't like it is any good idea or anything...) for a day or so its because i am using the formula in the above post to try and make it myself

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