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  1. - Top - End - #31
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    Default Re: Rogue (re-tool) {Please Critique}

    Quote Originally Posted by Kenneth View Post
    I refer you to the NIMBLE ability as It appears that you completely skipped over that, oha nd you also completely skipped over baffling defender.
    Nimble is an extra way to SA. You catch an enemy flat-footed if they haven't acted in combat.

    Baffling Defender is never going to see the light of day.
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  2. - Top - End - #32
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    Default Re: Rogue (re-tool) {Please Critique}

    You have got to be reading a different nimble than what I created.

    Nimble:{Ex}
    A Rogue gains a bonus to his Balance, Climb and Initiative equal to the number listed. In addition a Rogue also gains the number listed as a dodge bonus to his AC.

    see there, that last line?


    here let me underlin eit for you
    Nimble:{Ex}
    A Rogue gains a bonus to his Balance, Climb and Initiative equal to the number listed. In addition a Rogue also gains the number listed as a dodge bonus to his AC.


    wait.. does it sayd a Rouge gets an addition to his AC in the form of a dodge bonus?.. dman.. I think it does.

    again.. i do not think you are ven attemtpign to read anything I wrote here in this class, at least fully or you are just conitunally skimming over it and saying " RAWR BAD RAWR RAWR ARWR!! FASIL!"

    maybe If you took teh time and actually attempted to read my rogue in its entirety before you commeneted on how something that very plainly exists within the class, you would not say a) wake me when +! dodeg matters after lvl 5 or B) nimble is just an extra way to sneka attack

    instead you would be saying C) oh, you get +6 Dodge bonus to AC. over the course of the rogue's career. thats actually nice.

  3. - Top - End - #33
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    Default Re: Rogue (re-tool) {Please Critique}

    I'm going to just toss this in here to see what the OP thinks, if he hasn't seen it before. Personally, i think this is a very nice version of the rogue, with lots of options.

    here

    even if you don't care for it, maybe you'll want to crib a few ideas off of it :)
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  4. - Top - End - #34
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    Default Re: Rogue (re-tool) {Please Critique}

    The pathfinder rogue is nice, honestly teh only big difference I see is in PF a rogue gets d8 HD and more talents. whihc again like a TON of things in pathfidner is similar to what I have in my rogue :(...


    all in all a good rouge. though for me at least bumping up everybdyies HD 1 die size nerfs teh advatage fighters had over those clasess. now teh fighter has on avergae 1 more HP per level than a rouge instead of 2....

  5. - Top - End - #35
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    Default Re: Rogue (re-tool) {Please Critique}

    Quote Originally Posted by Kenneth View Post
    You have got to be reading a different nimble than what I created.

    Nimble:{Ex}
    A Rogue gains a bonus to his Balance, Climb and Initiative equal to the number listed. In addition a Rogue also gains the number listed as a dodge bonus to his AC.

    see there, that last line?


    here let me underlin eit for you
    Nimble:{Ex}
    A Rogue gains a bonus to his Balance, Climb and Initiative equal to the number listed. In addition a Rogue also gains the number listed as a dodge bonus to his AC.


    wait.. does it sayd a Rouge gets an addition to his AC in the form of a dodge bonus?.. dman.. I think it does.

    again.. i do not think you are ven attemtpign to read anything I wrote here in this class, at least fully or you are just conitunally skimming over it and saying " RAWR BAD RAWR RAWR ARWR!! FASIL!"

    maybe If you took teh time and actually attempted to read my rogue in its entirety before you commeneted on how something that very plainly exists within the class, you would not say a) wake me when +! dodeg matters after lvl 5 or B) nimble is just an extra way to sneka attack

    instead you would be saying C) oh, you get +6 Dodge bonus to AC. over the course of the rogue's career. thats actually nice.
    It's better, but I have a level 18 character with 16 AC who relies on 50% miss chance from magic items and the occasional Wall of Blades maneuver. 22 AC isn't helping more than 16 AC at level 18. The people in the party with high AC are the psionics and casters who can buff themselves up with protections.

    Yeah, you can buff your AC. But at some point, you gotta ask yourself why you're not just buying potions of Displacement at CL 20, a Major Cloak of Displacement, and +1 Heavy Fortification chain shirt for way cheaper than the +5 bracers of armor, +5 amulet of natural armor, +5 chain shirt, and +5 ring of protection for an extra +19 to AC over that, or 41 AC total and no miss chance vs creatures with either spells and spell-likes or a +34 average attack bonus and huge damage.
    Last edited by Hiro Protagonest; 2011-10-24 at 08:24 PM.
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  6. - Top - End - #36
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    Default Re: Rogue (re-tool) {Please Critique}

    Hows about adding in these abilities into my Rouge

    Avoid: {Ex}
    Upon using a move action a Rogue finds he has a 30% True miss chance against ranged attacks

    Decoy: {Ex}
    The Rouge can give and gain flanking bonuses to an ally even if the Rouge is not in the correct Flanking position. The Rouge and the ally must be adjacent to the target that is to be flanked.

    Dire Strike: {Ex}
    A Rogue selecting this talent deal an extra 2d4 damage on his first successful attack in a round. This extra damage is multiplied in the event of a critical hit.

    Deep Wounds: {Ex}
    A Rogue selecting this talent finds his critical strike leave bleeding wounds behind. A successful Critical Strike deals an extra 1d4 bleed damage as well as 1 point of Constitution damage.

    Blackjack Expertise: {Ex}
    A Rouge, when making attacks with a sap, cause the target to suffer a -2 cumulative penalty to attacks, armor class, and reflex saves. The penalty last 1 round.


    I just want to point on to jade dragon that it is 100% not my fault that AC fails to not grow as much much a attack bonuses do. that is something inherent in 3rd ed, and has absolutely nothing to do with my rouge. and if you read my rouge you woudl notice the rogue gains 15% miss chance , albeit against one foe ( could be several if the rogue makes multiply attacks against different opponents)

    plus your 50% miss chance is negated by true seeing whihc by 18th levle everybody and theri cousin should have true seeing eye gems to nullify that big 50% miss chance. then you are down to your 16 AC vs a rouges upwards of 30 AC naked with just his dodge and dex modifiers, and and his 15% miss chance
    Last edited by Kenneth; 2011-10-24 at 08:43 PM.

  7. - Top - End - #37
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    Default Re: Rogue (re-tool) {Please Critique}

    Change Avoid to a move action. That'll be good.
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  8. - Top - End - #38
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    Default Re: Rogue (re-tool) {Please Critique}

    ROGUE

    {table=head]Level|BAB|Fort|Ref|Will|Special

    1st|+0|+1|+2|+0| Dodge, sneak attack +1d6, Trap finding

    2nd|+1|+1|+3|+0| Vexing flanker, Perceptive+1, Blackjack Expertise

    3rd|+2|+2|+3|+1|sneak attack +2d6, Trap Sense +1, Dirty Trick

    4th|+2|+2|+4|+1| Fast Stride, Eviscerate, Nimble +1

    5th|+3|+2|+4|+1| Fade, Decoy, sneak attack +3d6

    6th|+4|+3|+5|+2|Trap Sense +2, Strike of Deception, Perceptive+2, Hemorrhage

    7th|+4|+3|+5|+2| Distracting Strike, sneak attack +4d6, Nimble +2, Dirty Trick

    8th|+5|+3|+6|+2| Uncanny Dodge, Special Talent, Avoid

    9th|+6|+4|+6|+3| sneak attack +5d6, Trap Sense +3, Touch of Death

    10th|+6|+4|+7|+3| Baffling Defender, Perceptive+3, Nimble +3

    11th|+7|+4|+7|+3|sneak attack +6d6, Special Talent, Evasion, Dirty Trick

    12th|+8|+5|+8|+4|Trap Sense +4, Opportunist

    13th|+8|+5|+8|+4|sneak attack +7d6, Nimble +4

    14th|+9|+6|+9|+4| Special Talent, Perceptive+4

    15th|+10|+6|+9|+5|sneak attack +8d6, Trap Sense +5, Dirty Trick

    16th|+10|+6|+10|+5| Fountain of Blood, Nimble +5

    17th|+11|+7|+10|+5|sneak attack +9d6, Special Talent

    18th|+12|+7|+11|+6|Trap Sense +6, Perceptive+5

    19th|+12|+7|+11|+6|sneak attack +10d6, Nimble +6, Dirty Trick

    20th|+13|+8|+12|+6|Special Talent, Kinesthetics

    [/table]

    Alignment
    Any except Lawful Good.
    Hit Die
    d6.
    Class Skills
    The rogue’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Appraise (Int), Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disable Device (Int), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Forgery (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (local) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Open Lock (Dex), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Search (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str), Tumble (Dex), and Use Rope (Dex).
    Skill Points at 1st Level
    (8 + Int modifier) ×4.
    Skill Points at Each Additional Level
    8 + Int modifier.
    Class Features
    All of the following are class features of the Rogue.
    Weapon and Armor Proficiency
    Rogues are proficient with all simple weapons, plus the broad sword, hand axe, hand crossbow, Long sword, sap, shortbow, and short sword. Rogues are proficient with leather armor, Moon-steel chain shirt, Studded Leather and padded armor, but not with shields.

    Dodge:{Ex} The Rogue gains Dodge as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the requirments.

    Sneak Attack:{Ex} If a Rogue can catch an opponent when he is unable to defend himself effectively from his attack, he can strike a vital spot for extra damage.

    The Rogue’s attack deals extra damage any time his target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when the rogue flanks his target. This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, and it increases by 1d6 every two Rogue levels thereafter. Should the rogue score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied.

    With a sap (blackjack) or an unarmed strike, a Rogue can make a sneak attack that deals nonlethal damage instead of lethal damage. He cannot use a weapon that deals lethal damage to deal nonlethal damage in a sneak attack, not even with the usual -4 penalty.

    A Rogue can sneak attack only living creatures with discernible anatomies—undead, constructs, oozes, plants, and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to attack. Any creature that is immune to critical hits is not vulnerable to sneak attacks. The Rogue must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. A Rogue cannot sneak attack while striking a creature with concealment or striking the limbs of a creature whose vitals are beyond reach.

    Trapfinding: {Ex}
    Rogues (and only Rogues) can use the Search skill to locate traps when the task has a Difficulty Class higher than 20.
    Finding a nonmagical trap has a DC of at least 20, or higher if it is well hidden. Finding a magic trap has a DC of 25 + the level of the spell used to create it.
    Rogues (and only Rogues) can use the Disable Device skill to disarm magic traps. A magic trap generally has a DC of 25 + the level of the spell used to create it. The spell Arcane Lock is considered a magical trap for the use of this ability.
    A Rogue who beats a trap’s DC by 10 or more with a Disable Device check can study a trap, figure out how it works, and bypass it (with his party) without disarming it.

    Vexing Flanker: {Ex}
    The Rogue gains a +2 insight bonus to all attack rolls while flanking a target

    Blackjack Expertise: {Ex}
    A Rogue, when making attacks with a sap, cause the target to suffer a -2 cumulative penalty to attacks, armor class, and reflex saves. The penalty last 1 round.

    Perceptive: {Ex}
    The Rogue gains a bonus to his Spot, Forgery, Listen, Search, and Sense Motive checks equal to the number listed in the above table.

    Trap Sense: {Ex}
    At 3rd level, a Rogue gains an intuitive sense that alerts him to danger from traps, giving him a +1 bonus on Reflex saves made to avoid traps and a +1 dodge bonus to AC against attacks made by traps. These bonuses rise to +2 when the Rogue reaches 6th level, to +3 when he reaches 9th level, to +4 when he reaches 12th level, to +5 at 15th, and to +6 at 18th level.

    Dirty Trick: {Ex}
    On attaining 3rd level, and at every four levels thereafter (7th,11th, 15th, and 19th), a Rogue gains a special ability of his choice from among the following options.

    Disorient{Ex}
    As an attack action A Rogue can forgo dealing damage upon a successful attack to instead make the target wander aimlessly for 2 rounds

    Gouge {Ex}
    As an attack action A Rogue can forgo dealing damage upon a successful attack to instead make the target blind for 3 rounds

    Cheap Shot {Ex}
    As an attack action A Rogue can forgo dealing damage upon a successful attack to instead stagger the target for 2 rounds. This Dirty Trick requires at least one other Dirty trick known before taking.

    Kidney Shot {Ex}
    As an attack action A Rogue can forgo dealing damage upon a successful attack to instead sicken the target for 5 rounds

    Dismantle {Ex}
    As an attack action A Rogue can forgo dealing damage upon a successful attack to instead entagle the target for 2 rounds

    Fast Stride:{Ex}
    As a swift action the Rogue can Increase his movement speed by +10 feet this effect lasts untill the end of the round.

    Eviscerate:{Ex}
    Upon a successful Sneak Attack, a Rogue can chose to instead of deal the full amount of Sneak attack damage at once, deal one third (rounded up) of that damage over the next 3 rounds on the Rogue's inititaive. For instance a 7th level Rogue can chose to deal 2d6 damage over 3 rounds, instead of dealing 4d6 damage in one attack.

    Nimble:{Ex}
    A Rogue gains a bonus to his Balance, Climb and Initiative equal to the number listed. In addition a Rogue also gains the number listed as a dodge bonus to his AC.

    Fade:{Ex}
    Upon using a full round action a Rogue can blend in with the shadows thereby gaining concealment. This abilty does not work in bright light such as that produce by the Daylight spell or in full daylight. Nor does this ability work if the Rogue is suffering from bleed damage or any other form of ongoing damage, such as Melf's Acid Arrow.

    Decoy: {Ex}
    The Rouge can give and gain flanking bonuses to an ally even if the Rouge is not in the correct flanking position. The Rouge and the ally must be adjacent to the target that is to be flanked

    Strike Of Deception: {Ex}
    A Rogue's first successful attack against a target gives him a 15% true miss chance against that target and only that target for 1 round.

    Hemorrhage: {Ex}
    A Rogue's Sneak Attack causes the target to bleed for a number of D4s equal to half the number of sneak attack dice over the next 2 rounds rounds on his initaitive, this is bleed damage. For instance an 11th level Rogue deals 3d4 bleed damage for 2 rounds. This ability also allows Allies to deal an extra point of damage for every 4th Level of the Rogue to the afflicted target.

    Distracting Strike:{Ex}
    A Rogue's Successful attacks render the target flat flooted for the Rogue's future attacks against that target (and only the Rouge)

    Uncanny Dodge: {Ex}
    Starting at 8th level, a Rogue can react to danger before his senses would normally allow him to do so. He retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, he still loses his Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized, and you are still conisidered flat-footed, you just do not suffer the penalties.

    Special Talent: {Ex}
    On attaining 8th level, and at every three levels thereafter (11th, 14th, 17th, and 20th), a Rogue gains a special ability of his choice from among the following options.

    Crippling Strike {Ex}
    A Rogue with this ability can sneak attack opponents with such precision that his blows weaken and hamper them. An opponent damaged by one of his sneak attacks also takes 2 points of Strength damage. Ability points lost to damage return on their own at the rate of 1 point per day for each damaged ability.

    Dire Strike: {Ex}
    A Rogue selecting this talent deals an extra 2d4 damage on his first successful attack in a round. This extra damage is multiplied in the event of a critical hit.

    Defensive Roll {Ex}
    The Rogue can roll with a potentially lethal blow to take less damage from it than he otherwise would. Once per day, when he would be reduced to 0 or fewer hit points by damage in combat (from a weapon or other blow, not a spell or special ability), the Rogue can attempt to roll with the damage. To use this ability, the Rogue must attempt a Reflex saving throw (DC = damage dealt). If the save succeeds, he takes only half damage from the blow; if it fails, he takes full damage. He must be aware of the attack and able to react to it in order to execute his defensive roll—if he is denied her Dexterity bonus to AC, he can’t use this ability.

    Skill Mastery {Ex}
    The Rogue becomes so certain in the use of certain skills that he can use them reliably even under adverse conditions.
    Upon gaining this ability, he selects a number of skills equal to 1 + his Intelligence modifier. When making a skill check with one of these skills, he may take 10 even if stress and distractions would normally prevent him from doing so. A Rogue may gain this special ability multiple times, selecting additional skills for it to apply to each time.

    Deep Wounds: {Ex}
    A Rogue selecting this talent finds his critical strike leave bleeding wounds behind. A successful Critical Strike deals an extra 1d4 bleed damage as well as 1 point of Constitution damage.

    Offensive Defense {Ex}
    When a Rogue with this talent hits a creature with a melee attack that deals sneak attack damage, the Rogue gains a +1 dodge bonus to AC for each sneak attack die rolled for one round

    Sniper's Eye {Ex}
    A Rogue with this talent can apply his sneak attack damage on ranged attacks targeting foes within 30 feet. Foes with concealment are still immune.

    Surprise Attack {Ex}
    The Rogue's attacks in the surprise round deal an extra 1 point of damage per Rogue level.

    Blinding Speed {Ex}
    A Rogue enacting this ability, which is a swift action, perfroms as though under the effects of a haste spell for a number of rounds equal to 1 plus an additional round for every 4th Rogue level attained. After enacting this ability a Rogue is fatigued a number of rounds equal to the number of rounds the Rogue was under the effects off blinding speed. A Rouge cannot use Blinding Speed while Exhausted or Fatigued, and must wait 1 round after Fatigue or exhaustion has worn off to enact this.

    Fast Tumble {Ex}
    When a Rogue with this talent uses Tumble to move at full speed through a threatened square without provoking an attack of opportunity, the DC of the Tumble check does not increase by 10.

    Slippery Mind {Ex}
    This ability represents the Rogue’s ability to wriggle free from magical effects that would otherwise control or compel him. If a rogue with slippery mind is affected by an enchantment spell or effect and fails his saving throw, he can attempt it again 1 round later at the same DC. He gets only this one extra chance to succeed on his saving throw.

    Feat
    A Rogue may gain a bonus feat in place of a special talent.

    Weapon Snatcher {Ex}
    A Rogue with this talent can make a Sleight of Hand check in place of a disarm check when attempting to disarm an opponent.

    Dead Eye {Ex}
    A Rogue selecting this talent takes a full round action and gains a competence bonus to attack rolls equal to the Rogue's level for 2 rounds. The Rogue must wait 10 rounds to enact this talent after use. This bonus does not apply to rolls made to confirm criticals.

    Duelist {Ex}
    A Rogue selecting this talent deals half again as much damage on a successful attack while alone (allies not in LoS and no closer than 120 feet away). This damage effects those who are immune to critical strike. This damage is additive with other multiples, so a Rogue who scores a critical hit with a short sword would deal X2.5 damage.

    Avoid: {Ex}
    Upon using a move action a Rogue finds he has a 30% True miss chance against ranged attacks

    Touch of Death: {Ex}
    A Rogue's Successful Sneak attack paralyzes the target for 1d3 rounds. The DC to over come is 10+1/2 Rogue level+int mod+dex mod. The save is Fort based

    Baffling Defender: {Ex}
    A Rogue can when using the total-defense option negate an attack upon a successful Balance check, the DC of this check is equal to the attack roll of the target.

    Evasion: {Ex}
    At 11th level and higher, a Rogue can avoid even magical and unusual attacks with great agility. If he makes a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, he instead takes no damage. Evasion can be used only if the Rogue is wearing light armor or no armor. A helpless, flat-footed, or immobilizied Rogue does not gain the benefit of evasion

    Opportunist: {Ex}
    A Rogue can make an attack of opportunity against an opponent who has just been struck for damage in melee by an ally. This attack does not count as the Rogue’s attack of opportunity for that round. Even a Rogue with the Combat Reflexes feat can’t use the opportunist ability more than once per round.

    Fountain of Blood: {Ex}
    If the Rouge deals a creature enough damage with sneak attack to make it drop (typically by dropping it to below 0 hit points or killing it). The Rouge forces all foes within a 30 foot radius to become shaken. The shaken Condition lasts 1d4 rounds plus a number of rounds equal to half the Rogue's level.

    Kinesthetics: {Ex}
    The Rogue performs all attacks as 1 delay increment better. ( a standard delay becomes a quick delay; a quick delay becomes very quick) This ability does not stack with the properties of the weapon enchantment quickness
    Last edited by Kenneth; 2011-10-29 at 10:36 PM. Reason: hopefully fixed the spelling errors

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