Re-flavoring rock-paper-scissors for use in RPGs or strategy games

[Kensen]

Everyone knows the rock-paper-scissors game. The basic idea that one type of "throw" (e.g. Rock) defeats one of the other two (e.g. Scissors) but loses against the third (e.g. Paper) has been used in RPGs and strategy games before. Some common examples include:

• Pikemen defeat Cavalry. Cavalry defeats Archers. Archers defeat Pikemen.
• Water douses Fire, Fire burns Wood and Wood floats on Water. (an example of Elemental RPS)

Do you know any other examples? Can you think of new ways to re-flavor rock-paper-scissors for use in a homebrew game?

Below are some more examples:

1) The level of testosterone determines the size and mating behavior of lizardmen:

Big: These lizardmen are big and aggressive, but not very smart.
Medium: Cannot compete with big lizardmen, but are smart and big enough to notice and defeat little lizardmen.
Little: They look like females and can sneak past big lizardmen to mate with females, but cannot fool medium ones.

2) There are three types of warriors:

Mighty/strength: Can crush Wise warriors but is easily fooled by Cunning warriors.
Wise/perception: Can see through Cunning warriors' trickery, but is no match for Strong warriors.
Cunning/stealth: Can outsmart Strong warriors, but cannot fool Wise warriors.

[Yitzi]

In D&D, monk/wizard/fighter is at least supposed to be one (and if it were, it would implode the tier system very nicely. That's one of the main advantages of using RPS; it means that a power balance is pretty much guaranteed.)

[Kensen]

Yep, I agree, if done well it guarantees power balance.

In D&D 3.5 and previous editions, there really hasn't been such balance between those three classes, but have you heard this from a designer or where is it said that monk/wizard/fighter are supposed to be one? Monk, with good saves and mobility, is presumably the "wizard killer" in the triangle?

[AugustNights]

Why not pump up the number of "weapons?"

Why not 25 option or
101 options?

[Kensen]

Because less is more? Complexity for the sake of complexity is usually bad design. With 25 or 101 "weapons", there are more options but the number of outcomes (win, lose, tie) remains the same, only the probability of each outcome changes (ties become less common).

If additional weapons are used to generate varying degrees or winning and losing (e.g. crushing defeat - all your units are destroyed, rout - you must flee but you can keep you units, etc.) it might be useful to have more than the standard three options.

[Yitzi]

Yep, I agree, if done well it guarantees power balance.

It doesn't guarantee it when you throw in other elements, but it makes it extremely hard to break the balance (whereas without it, it's extremely difficult to even get roughly good balance).

In D&D 3.5 and previous editions, there really hasn't been such balance between those three classes, but have you heard this from a designer or where is it said that monk/wizard/fighter are supposed to be one?

The closest I've seen is that Salvatore, in the cleric quintet, has a character make mention of how monks are particularly good against wizards.

It's mainly just based on looking at the monk's strengths and weaknesses, and seeing that it's weak against fighters and strong (even if without a fix it's not strong enough to overcome the tier difference) against wizards.

Monk, with good saves and mobility, is presumably the "wizard killer" in the triangle?

You forgot to mention the numerous decently strong attacks with low attack rolls (good against low-AC targets like wizards are meant to be), the high touch AC, and SR at high levels. But essentially, yes.

[Cieyrin]

Fire Emblem is all about the RPS action, from the Weapon Triangle (Sword beats Axe, Axe beats Lance, Lance beats Sword), the Magic Triangle (typically, Light beats Dark, Dark beats Anima, Anima beats Light) and the sub triangle for Anima (Fire beats Wind, Wind beats Thunder, Thunder beats Fire) and so many more that vary depending on which game you're talking about.

Naruto had a similar thing with the elements (Fire is fanned by Wind, Wind blows away Thunder, Thunder electrocutes Water, Water erodes Earth, Earth smothers Fire).

[Lert, A.]

Do you know any other examples? Can you think of new ways to re-flavor rock-paper-scissors for use in a homebrew game?

U-boat defeats Cruiser, Destroyer defeats U-Boat, Cruiser defeats Destroyer.

Should work great in a WWII or possibly SciFi homebrew.

[Eldest]

Advance wars has that... sort of.
Sub beats Battleship, battleship blows up cruiser, cruiser sinks subs.
Also the land wars have not as clear cut of a division, but generally masses of infantry beat artillery, artillery beats tanks, and tanks beat infantry. Thats why I love Mech units so much: they have a chance against anything.