The Wizard of Fail [3,5][Base Class][In Progress][PEACH]

[Dr.Orpheus]

This is a class I intended to be a NPC class, but in kind of sucks to much and so I have dubbed it tire 7.

The Uncertified Mage

HD: d4
Skill Points: 2+int mod/lv x4 at 1st level
Class Skills: None
Starting Age: As Rouge.
Starting Money: You start -1d4x10 in debut from paying for property damage and other mishaps.

{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort|Ref|Will|Special|0th|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5t h|6th|7th|8th|9th
1st|+0|+0|+0|+0|Untrained Spellcasting, Obsessive|0|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
2nd|+1|+0|+0|+0|Mischievous Familiar|1||-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
3rd|+1|+1|+1|+1||1|0|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
4th|+2|+1|+1|+1|Unlucky 1/day|1|1||-|-|-|-|-|-|-
5th|+2|+1|+1|+1||1|1|0|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
6th|+3|+2|+2|+2||1|1|1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
7th|+3|+2|+2|+2||1|1|1|0|-|-|-|-|-|-
8th|+4|+2|+2|+2|Unlucky 2/day|1|1|1|1|-|-|-|-|-|-
9th|+4|+3|+3|+3||1|1|1|1|0|-|-|-|-|-
10th|+5|+3|+3|+3||1|1|1|1|1|-|-|-|-|-
11th|+5|+3|+3|+3||1|1|1|1|1|0|-|-|-|-
12th|+6/+1|+4|+4|+4|Unlucky 3/day|1|1|1|1|1|1|-|-|-|-
13th|+6/+1|+4|+4|+4||1|1|1|1|1|1|0|-|-|-
14th|+7/+2|+4|+4|+4||1|1|1|1|1|1|1|-|-|-
15th|+7/+2|+5|+5|+5||1|1|1|1|1|1|1|0|-|-
16th|+8/+3|+5|+5|+5|Unlucky 4/day|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|-|-
17th|+8/+3|+5|+5|+5||1|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|0|-
18th|+9/+4|+6|+6|+6||1|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|-
19th|+9/+4|+6|+6|+6|Laughing Stock of the Gods|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|0
20th|+10/+5|+6|+6|+6|Unlucky 5/day|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|1|1[/table]

Profficiencies: None.

Spells: As Wizard except you start knowing prestidigitation and don't learn any spells automatically upon leveling up. A talisman, wand, pointy hat, or staff is required as a arcane focus for all spells, and if it is lost, stolen, destroyed, etc. it costs 100 GP to replace.

Untrained Spellcasting: Whenever a particular spell is cast for the first time it has a 90% failure chance, 80% if you crit on your spellcraft check to learn the spell, and 100% if you crit fail. Your DM may not allow crits and crit fails on skill checks. Every level this you have had, and have been able to cast the spellthis spell the failure chance decreases by 5% until it reaches a minimum of 10%. This failure chance is rolled separately from arcane spell failure from armor, and it has a different effect when the failure occurs. If you roll under your failure chance you accidentally cast another spell chosen by the DM or a die roll. This spell does not need to be one you know or a spell level you can cast so long as it is in the Wizard/Sorcerer spell list or is a epic level spell that a wizard can learn, and if you fail by 20 or less you create a similar effect such as a fireball instead of wall of fire. If a miscast spell is of a higher spell level then you can cast deals you 1 point of ability drain to a mental ability score for every level this spell is above the level of the highest level you can cast, use a d3 to decide the ability score. if the miscast spell is epic level and you can't cast it you lose all of the mental ability score rolled. If casting using a magic item these same rules apply except the failure chance is 90 - the amount you succeed the UMD check%

Obsessive: Until you reach 15th level you may not multiclass or join a prestige class because you want to learn magic so badly and you think you are on the right path to do so.

Mischievous Familiar: You gain a familiar at 2nd level like an adept, but this familiar has an attitude of unfriendly toward its master witch can not be swayed in any way except decreasing its attitude to hostile. Unless the familiar is coxed with food they will steal money, food, spell components, the wizards arcane focus, and other small items. The familiar gets a +1 bonus per class level to Slight of Hand checks for this purpose. When the familiar learns to speak with its master it can make an untrained Perform (sing) check to distract you from casting a spell with a annoying tune. You must make a concentration check vs. the sing check in order to cast or you miscast as shown in your Untrained Spellcasting class feature. When you gain the ability to scry on your familiar you must beat your familiar's SR or miscast as shown in your Untrained Spellcasting class feature. Note you still lose xp if your familiar dies, and if it does a new animal will begin pestering you it in 1d4 days.

Unlucky: At 4rd level the first time you roll the best possible result on any die roll (or an opponent rolls the worst possible) per day you must reroll it. Every 4 levels thereafter this will happen an additional time per day the next roll you score the best role.

Laughing Stock of the Gods: At 19th level you may avoid all self inflicted death from miscasting you are instead stable at -9 hp. But the gods now work against you overcoming your pathetic state through shear luck. If you ever accumulate 10,000 or more gp in mundane items, magic items, coins, or land it is lost, destroyed, stolen, etc. through some unavoidable divine power. The same happens to any followers or reputation of being a competent spellcaster or adventurer.

[Kenneth]

there is no way that any class with 9th level spells can be as fail as you are thinkng, i would wager min 'tier 3' but I am sure other peopel who swear by the 'teirs; would be more accurate in the random judgings

[sengmeng]

Wow, even more doomed than my Redshirt (see sig).

I think that you are wrong about their tier; but yeah, they are not tier 1 like regular wizards by any means.

Clear something up in Untrained Spellcasting: does failing to cast the spell and casting something else use up that slot?

And is there a random way to choose a sor/wizard spell that doesn't just take forever or end up "DM's choice"?

[Dr.Orpheus]

This is not complete like I said in the title, I plan to have a Familiar that does not listen to you and steals your gear plus more.

[jiriku]

Yep, it sucks alright. I assume this is for an NPC who will be primarily comic relief?

[Dr.Orpheus]

Yes, that is one purpose. But this type of thing tends to happen when a wizard is self taught and does not show the gift.

[sengmeng]

Shouldn't they have more hitpoints and good saves from constantly surviving their own disasters?

[Dr.Orpheus]

Uncertified Mages do go through a lot and they can learn from there mistakes, but what does not kill will likely not make you stronger. In most cases it leaves them weak and susceptible and the repeated failure throughout life crushes there will, and thus the lower saves.

[sengmeng]

Crushed will, eh? Funny, I saw them as more cluelessly optimistic.

[BelGareth]

Too add to the possible comical releif you may want to add in wild magic zone affects Like so when they fail to cast. They are so inept that they botch things up, after all failing to cast a 9th level spell should have consequences.... (or you could make your own, which could be fun in and of itself)

Maybe increase their spell allotment so they can fail more times a day?

something like
{table=head]0-|1|2
1|-|-|-
2|-|-|-
3|1|-|-
3|2|-|-
3|3|-|-
3|3|1|-
[/table]
This would make for more hilarity and possible hiccups due to failed casting.

You should also add in something about using spell trigger and completion items (as any metagamer would just go to them, i'm aware this is a NPC). maybe a similar fail chance and even worse outcome of failure?

[Dr.Orpheus]

Crushed will, eh? Funny, I saw them as more cluelessly optimistic.

That could always a be a variant rule being clueless by having -2 int and -2 wis, but being optimistic and having a good will save.

Too add to the possible comical releif you may want to add in wild magic zone affects Like so when they fail to cast. They are so inept that they botch things up, after all failing to cast a 9th level spell should have consequences.... (or you could make your own, which could be fun in and of itself)

Maybe increase their spell allotment so they can fail more times a day?

something like
{table=head]0-|1|2
1|-|-|-
2|-|-|-
3|1|-|-
3|2|-|-
3|3|-|-
3|3|1|-
[/table]
This would make for more hilarity and possible hiccups due to failed casting.

You should also add in something about using spell trigger and completion items (as any metagamer would just go to them, i'm aware this is a NPC). maybe a similar fail chance and even worse outcome of failure?

I would increase the number of spells per day, I first need to assure myself that if I do that the class will be beneath a commoner. I know with its ability to cast spells up to 9th level is really good, but I plan to add more negative class features so that I can add a few more spells without making him good.

[Yitzi]

The one significant advantage this class has is that it has no cap on spells know like a sorcerer does and yet can cast spontaneously, meaning that if it gets a good repertoire of spells with only 10% failure (likely by casting them in "safe" conditions) it can handle an extremely wide range of situations (with 90% success.)

[Mando Knight]

Problem: you can't get bonus cantrips per day, so at first level your casting is effectively null.

[Dr.Orpheus]

The one significant advantage this class has is that it has no cap on spells know like a sorcerer does and yet can cast spontaneously, meaning that if it gets a good repertoire of spells with only 10% failure (likely by casting them in "safe" conditions) it can handle an extremely wide range of situations (with 90% success.)

I never said they cast spontaneously.

Problem: you can't get bonus cantrips per day, so at first level your casting is effectively null.

Exactly they will just pretend they are helping the party until 2nd level when they start accidentally hurting them.

[legomaster00156]

I never said they cast spontaneously.

You haven't mentioned that they must use a spellbook to prepare spells.

[Yitzi]

I never said they cast spontaneously.

You didn't say they need to prepare spells either, so the default would seem to be that they don't have to.

Unless you meant that they can't cast at all. (So it's not only at first level that they're pretending to be useful.)

[Dr.Orpheus]

You haven't mentioned that they must use a spellbook to prepare spells.

You didn't say they need to prepare spells either, so the default would seem to be that they don't have to.

Unless you meant that they can't cast at all. (So it's not only at first level that they're pretending to be useful.)

I retort by quoting myself.

Spells: As Wizard except you start knowing prestidigitation and don't learn any spells automatically upon leveling up. A talisman, wand, pointy hat, or staff is required as a arcane focus for all spells, and if it is lost, stolen, destroyed, etc. it costs 100 GP to replace.

Spellcasting is conducted as if you were a wizard.

[Mando Knight]

Exactly they will just pretend they are helping the party until 2nd level when they start accidentally hurting them.

"I know all the cantrips! ...but I can't cast any of them."

[Yitzi]

I retort by quoting myself.

Whoops.

[Dr.Orpheus]

"I know all the cantrips! ...but I can't cast any of them."

Yep except you only know prestidigitation quite lame don't you think. However I may add some spell casting ability at 1st level later maybe.

[legomaster00156]

You start out being capable of doing nothing, with no proficiencies, a d4 HD, no class skills (really, you should at least give them Knowledge (arcana)), only 2+INT skill ranks (apparently, not even x4 at level 1), no good saves, poor BAB, no spellcasting, and in debt. I wonder just how many Uncertified Mages make it past level 1.

[ericgrau]

What keeps you from practicing spells / making skill checks ahead of time to bypass untrained spellcasting and unlucky? Then put con before int, cast spells without saves to handle that, get skill focus (concentration) and bam you can usually put up with your pesky familiar. At high level I think you might auto-pass your checks or come close.

I think as-is these issues are unavoidable as it's not just a smart player who will pull them, but any player will given time. I think some more constant and unpreventable failure chances might be better.

[legomaster00156]

What keeps you from practicing / making checks ahead of time to bypass untrained spellcasting and unlucky? Then put con before int, cast spells without saves, get skill focus (concentration) and bam you can usually put up with your pesky familiar. At high level I think you might auto-pass your checks or come close.

I think as-is these issues are unavoidable as it's not just a smart player who will pull them, but any player will given time. I think some more constant and unpreventable failure chances might be better.

But what sane player would play this instead of a Wizard? This is meant as an NPC class.

[ericgrau]

Even roleplaying the skill checks and spells he's eventually he'll start casting something and knowing that his first few checks will fail so he'll make unimportant checks first. I mean it'd be like roleplaying someone so dumb that he walks into poles over and over again; eventually it becomes so obvious that it's no longer plausible.

Not getting a high con I can understand, so the familiar would remain trouble in the hands of an NPC. But the other two problems are way too easy to figure out and overcome the moment you start to try it out. I mean do anything a few times and the problems go away.

[Steward]

But what sane player would play this instead of a Wizard? This is meant as an NPC class.

Yeah, this class would almost be unbearable for a PC. It feels like there are a lot of dice rolls involved, for example -- to cast a spell, to deal with your familiar, or even when you do well in a skill. Sure, a dedicated optimizer could probably overcome some of the disadvantages of the class if they wanted to, but why bother?

[Dr.Orpheus]

You start out being capable of doing nothing, with no proficiencies, a d4 HD, no class skills (really, you should at least give them Knowledge (arcana)), only 2+INT skill ranks (apparently, not even x4 at level 1), no good saves, poor BAB, no spellcasting, and in debt. I wonder just how many Uncertified Mages make it past level 1.

I said I wanted to make him worse then a commoner, but I will give him x4 skill points at 1st levels and the reason there are no class skills is because all available time is spent practicing magic, learning bad habits, and not fully understanding the theories or the basics from lack of access to research, books, and mentors.

What keeps you from practicing spells / making skill checks ahead of time to bypass untrained spellcasting and unlucky? Then put con before int, cast spells without saves to handle that, get skill focus (concentration) and bam you can usually put up with your pesky familiar. At high level I think you might auto-pass your checks or come close.

I think as-is these issues are unavoidable as it's not just a smart player who will pull them, but any player will given time. I think some more constant and unpreventable failure chances might be better.

It is not a concentration check so that dose not work.

But what sane player would play this instead of a Wizard? This is meant as an NPC class.

Yes it is an NPC class, but I am also making it just to see how bad it can get. When complected I may try to play as one just for laughs.

Even roleplaying the skill checks and spells he's eventually he'll start casting something and knowing that his first few checks will fail so he'll make unimportant checks first. I mean it'd be like roleplaying someone so dumb that he walks into poles over and over again; eventually it becomes so obvious that it's no longer plausible.

Not getting a high con I can understand, so the familiar would remain trouble in the hands of an NPC. But the other two problems are way too easy to figure out and overcome the moment you start to try it out. I mean do anything a few times and the problems go away.

I may make the unlucky feature be x times a day at random moments picked by the DM.

Yeah, this class would almost be unbearable for a PC. It feels like there are a lot of dice rolls involved, for example -- to cast a spell, to deal with your familiar, or even when you do well in a skill. Sure, a dedicated optimizer could probably overcome some of the disadvantages of the class if they wanted to, but why bother?

I could think of plenty of ways to overcome the weaknesses of a Uncertified Mage, but you could make anything OP if you put your mind to it.

[gkathellar]

It's ... it's Rincewind! Hallelujah!

[erikun]

Congratulations, I think you've found the Truenamer Tier. Let's look this over:

The most successful spells you can ever cast are 2nd level and below, hitting 10% failure chance at 20th level only if they rolled a natural 20 to learn the spell. Your highest level spells have a 75% chance of failure, assuming you learn them all at 19th level. And roll 20s for all of them.

The familiar will probably be easy enough to ignore with enough focus in Concentration, and you will likely be prestige classing out to ignore most of the Unlucky Days and the "capstone".

Oh, and your DM can randomly decide to completely kill your character by selecting an epic spell as the miscast. (Permanent 0 ability score means you become a vegetable.)


So, basically, we have a character who randomly fails/miscasts around half the time, requires high skill rolls to do another, and will occasionally drop dead every now and then. That does sound a lot like the Truenamer, except for the dropping dead and being limited to spell slots.

I did make something that I thinks works as a T6 spellcaster, if you are curious about someone else's take on the matter.

[Dr.Orpheus]

Now does this look tire 7 to everybody or does it need some work.

[sengmeng]

Would you be willing to allow the Uncertified mage some amelioration by perhaps having him count as several levels lower when figuring out his XP rewards? So his one contribution to a party can be that he lowers their overall level average? Since he would seem to be a hindrance and all... The ability could be called "Inept."